Envy is everywhere

[Lentilweaver]

I don't know if anyone has felt this, but am sensing a deep envy in my immediate circle, between those who have less and those who have more. And then I come onto MN and half the posts are about posters not getting inheritance, or earnng less than they think they should, or not getting childcare from parents... It's so divisive and miserable.

Surely poor people can be frugal?
Has to be, or they'd get into debt.
The difference would be a rich person would have savings a poor person just wouldn't have debt.
Me and my sister both inherited.
Both worked hard and bought property.
I'm frugal - sister is not frugal- lots of holidays, hobbies, latest computer gismos.
Then she's eaten up with jealousy because we've got a bigger house to the point she's doesn't speak to us anymore. But we are only are where we are through saving hard.
I can say no to an expensive holiday the same as a less financially well off person can say no ti an expensive holiday.

@Janetime

simply no. If someone struggles with negative emotions, it is not in everyone else to pander to that. It’s for the envious person to own their shit and deal with it.

THIS.

I feel very happy when people I know have good luck / go on a lovely holiday/ buy a new house/ buy a new car / have a night out.
Good luck to them I say.

And my friends are happy for me when good stuff happens- apart from one relative , who no longer speaks to me , and had being getting more and more jealous, the moment I had started to get my act together.
It was fine when I was struggling, but the moment I 'caught up' with them and do well, sadly for me, they didn't like it.
I still miss them.

As a first gen immigrants in UK we actually clocked onto quite a lots of racism being overridden by class. I am EE, DH is brown. When he dressed well and got better car, he was treated completely differently. Class is the main driver in UK in our experiences. Lots of our friends agree.

I wouldn't even call it white priviledge in Europe, more "looks like, sounds like and is named like a native" priviledge. White priviledge goes out of the window second you have foreign accent and name. Fucking loved companies who did blind recruitment because the age old advice of "take anything what can be used to discriminate off your CV" is for nothing when that thing is my name🙄

And pp is right about "white male priviledge" is actually working against working class boys and their outcomes are worse. Have been for a long time.

I agree. In real life I've never heard so many bitter and jealous people as there are on here. Life has never been fair, why do people think it is so different now? There have always been the haves and the have-nots, and going back only a few generations the have-nots were a lot worse off. We have to work with what we've got, there is no point in envying others for their perceived good fortune - what does that actually achieve?

If everyone's money was put into a giant pot and distributed equally to all (which some weird people seem to think should happen) there would still be people who would end up with a fortune and those who end up with nothing once a few decades had passed.

Very wise. I don't actually know anyone who tells me, or others, how much they earn, how much they've inherited, or boasts about how much they spend, so I find it odd that so many MNers seem to know so much about other people's finances.

To be honest, our families and our close friends are all very open on finances. There is no boasting though. But we all talk about money quite openly. I don’t really understand the mindset of you can’t discuss it with family and close friends, and am quite surprised you know literally what no one else earns.

It's not that the subject is taboo, but people here (not in the UK) don't seem to discuss finances that much. Obviously some do, but even with the friends I have from the business we all worked for I have no idea what wage they were on. I really don't want to discuss my financial affairs with anyone else either, and thank goodness if it leads to all the jealousy and bitterness I see on here.

I can't imagine my parents, or the parents of anyone I know, discussing finances either. I don't remember ever telling my parents how much (or rather, little!) I earned.

Class isn't the issue here that it is in the UK, people are either wealthy or not, and while I'm sure some people are jealous of others it's not something I have encountered.

Everyone thinks everyone else has it easier/better and that the other is somehow luckier. In a weird way it’s like when something bad happens to you and you realise it happened to someone you know too but you didn’t give them the support you could have because you didn’t realise it was that hard.

Wow, this thread ran away from me. I don't feel like going into the circumstances of this particular tiff as I am still smarting, but essentially I sense my friend is envious because she is single and we are a two income family. I can't help that though. Nevertheless, DH has given me some good advice in these difficult times:

Never talk about money ( I didn't do this anyway)
Never share holidays or expensive stuff on Insta ( I didn't do this. I am on Insta but mostly share pictures of books, art, architecture)
Be more tolerant of those who earn less or are in difficult circumstances and attempt to ignore any hurtful comments. Be kinder, in effect. I will try.
Understand that no one knows your own journey. So a lot of people may think you have it better when you don't. Can't be helped. To give an instance, I was carrying a Russell and Bromley bag recently and this friend commented on it, a bit enviously. I told her it was a charity shop buy for £12. Which it was! I don't have spare money for posh bags. But someone else might have looked at it and thought I was rolling in it.

Your husband had to tell you this?

I think it all is basic common sense apart from insta. Most people only have friends and family they share with, so I for one am very happy to see my friends or family on holiday or if they have something nice they wish to share.

It't not basic common sense to hide the fact that you are married @Janetime which if you read my post, is the essential issue.

@notprincehamlet , I really dislike that term - ‘accidental landlord’. Anyone would think someone woke up one morning completely bemused to find tenants in their property.
If anyone can tell me of one case where it wasn’t a conscious decision, almost always made for financial reasons, I’d be very interested to hear it.

Is it envy though?

I think it is more a deep sense of anger and despair about how far the gap between the rich and most of us has widened in the past decade.

So many people are struggling with the cost of living while we have a government made of corrupt liars who have made themselves and their mates richer.

I think people are usually content with their lives if they can afford to have a decent roof over their head, feed their family, pay their bills and have a bit of fun as well and won't resent those who are doing better.

But there is a deep and understandable feeling of resentment that builds up when people who are working can't even afford the above and although we pay a lot in taxes every public service seems to be crumbling...

Also there are often quite a few entitled and smug people on threads who think that they are better off simply because of 'hard work' and seem to imply that everyone who isn't well off is a 'burden/lazy/stupid' and does not work hard enough.

While they conveniently gloss over the fact that it is much easier to do well in life when you have a good start: supportive parents, a family with no financial issues, the opportunity to go to good schools/universities and use mummy and daddy's contacts to get a foot in the door at work and you don't have a disability/long term health condition...

Or that a cleaner/nurse/hospital porter/teaching assistant does not work any less hard than someone who seats in a comfy office pushing paper all day.

Basically I think the Tory years have poisoned and divided our current society and we really need a reset to help raise everyone's standards of living.

My best mate and I grew up next door to one another. Parents of similar income. Mine were content to holiday at home, dinner out for special occasions, lived frugally and died young. I’ve inherited substantial sums.

My friends parents have lived the high life, they retired before 60 and have since spent at least 4 months a year on holiday, now in late 80’s they’re about to set off on a 6 mth world cruise as they acknowledge that they might not be in good health this time next year. They sold their house to one of those equity release company’s to fund this globe trotter life style, and good luck to them. She will be lucky if there’s a fiver left to inherit! But we all make different life choices.

I’m not going to feel guilty that I've inherited and she won’t.

I think your friend’s parents have the right idea @user146990847202 . Mine did similar.

As long as people dont complain that one inherits and the other doesn't. There needs to be a recognition that there is more than 'luck' involved

We live in an unfair society and that's bound to create resentment and envy. It feels like things have gradually got worse sadly.

"all this nonsense of acknowledge your luck, don’t talk about your holidays, don’t show your car or home, take the sting of envy out it for those who struggle with envy."

I never said don't talk about your holidays. I said acknowledge you're lucky.
You used the word fortunate yourself!

I resent that anger is directed at the wrong people. Help with a house deposit or, joining a grad scheme after university, or paying school fees for your grandchildren to attend your local private school does not make your life easy.

A tech billionaire trying to subvert democracy (Elon Musk) or a member of the Bullingdon Club creating rules that benefit each other to hoard wealth (eg Covid contracts, tax avoidance schemes etc) .

If you (generic you) are worried about inequality then worry about what’s going on at the top not what’s going on for others in the middle who are slightly better off than you). They’re not hurting you by having slightly easier lives but I guarantee you the ultra wealthy make all our lives harder.

Basically I think the Tory years have poisoned and divided our current society and we really need a reset to help raise everyone's standards of living.

Startingagain Do you think a Labour government will undo the divide? It will be interesting to see how they tackle it.

It might not be envy as such just people fed up with their own life and naturally we do compare. Example I have just had a promotion, the increase in pay is now going to cover an increase in my water, council tax and electric. So I'm doing twice the work just to pay my bloody bills. Resulting in me being fed up!

For years my wage increases only ever covered part of the increased cost of living, it's hardly a new thing (well, not where I live anyway).

I don’t think it’s quite as simple as envy, it’s the perception of unfairness in society now. I don’t think a cleaner expects to earn what a doctor does, so the whole argument of, ‘’Why should someone unqualified get the same as a professional’’ is stupid. They shouldn’t.

it’s fair enough if you actually work for it you deserve great pay and a great lifestyle, but that doesn’t mean that everybody shouldn’t be treated with fairness.

It’s not right that people are so greedy and selfish while others are struggling to get by. It’s mainly politicians who are so out of touch with reality.

Everyone, as a human being should have a minimum standard of living which should include the essentials at least, and nobody should be reduced to food banks or no heating, especially if they work.

The sad part is the poverty is mostly generational and I think it annoys people when people just say, ‘’work harder!’’ It’s easy to say it’s just about envy, that’s simplistic.

But people have to own their choices

They do, yes, but also it’s not always as simple as a choice. Some people don’t know better, don’t believe they can achieve better, have mental health problems, learning difficulties, physical health problems, life circumstances that impact the choices they make. It’s not simply a case of black and white, there is nuance to things.

Also, someone has to do the unskilled jobs that society would collapse without, they’re still humans who deserve to be respected and valued. If everyone was capable of doing six figure jobs they wouldn’t be six figure jobs.

What about doctors, teachers, etc whose jobs demand higher qualifications, yet they get ill rewarded, where as even on here I’ve seen people saying they get paid £100,000+ and barely do any work for it and their job is so easy and non essential compared to others?

If you do well, kudos to you, but that’s not the point. It’s not always about ‘’choice’’ or envy. People just want to be treated with respect and live their lives. Look how much the government are robbing the public purse, look at the wealth hoarding and people can’t even afford to eat. Lucky I’m not in that position, but I get it.