What happened in the House of Commons tonight?

[Bookridden]

I'm struggling to understand what is going on and would be grateful is someone can explain to me in simple terms.

Why were Labour worried about the safety of MPs?

Why were the SNP unhappy?

Why were the Tories unhappy?

What's likely to happen next?

Are MPs who don't take a Pro-Palestinian stance really putting their lives at risk?

Oh quit the ridiculous posts trying to harass it’s not interesting

Try and debate properly the world won’t fall apart if you do.

What are you debating?

You don't deny that Conservatives have broken with convention.

That’s a pretty good summary. Succinct too. The sooner Sunak admits defeat and calls an election the better.

You've said nothing to debate. I'm happy to. You pick the topic.

Who'd vote for any of them though? I haven't felt optimistic about politics since the day Tony Blair won the election, the country felt reborn that day so much hope but that was a long time ago.

So now I’ve said nothing 😂

You’ve managed to get worked up enough to insult over nothing

But sod that it was painful enough, someone else will enjoy it I’m sure. Enjoy.

Thank you. Yes we have so that means a lot to me x

I always find your posts balanced, thoughtful and factually correct. You never lose your shit on here either ( like I do sometimes) You must have the patience of a saint with some posters!

Labour activists have a shock coming. Living in an echo chamber and simply reading the polls (historically inaccurate) they seem to imagine this election is a done deal, and close their ears to the very real concerns people have that they are simply not up to the job of running the country.

Hell my parents are devout Labour supporters going back many generations and can’t stand Keir Starmer - they view him as another fake, another Tony Blair. And won’t be voting for him. All of my Labour friends have reservations about them. They mostly worry about Labour completely crashing the economy and letting the woke agenda especially on trans get totally out of hand just as we were making progress and common sense was beginning to prevail on the subject.

All of my Labour friends have reservations about them. They mostly worry about Labour completely crashing the economy and letting the woke agenda especially on trans get totally out of hand just as we were making progress and common sense was beginning to prevail on the subject.

Sorry but open mouthed reading this. I would suggest maybe you are in an echo chamber. After the Lizz Truss debacle and general state of things people are worried about labour crashing the economy? I only know a handful of people IRL who care that much about trans issues, and they certainly don’t care about it more than, say, crumbling public services. I would highly doubt it would lead them to vote Tory. My view is that the silent majority of U.K. voters are fiscally conservative, but generally socially pretty liberal. Kier hits that sweet spot.

Starm is not a sweet spot.
He is a weak and wooden ineffectual leader by anyone’s standard.

The worst thing about your post is the false hope you are peddling that public services are going to magically improve under Labour.

They are not going to improve.
Labour have even said as much but you are simply not listening.

There is no money to magically improve public services, under any party. I am afraid most labour voters are going to be bitterly bitterly disappointed when they see no change or things becoming even worse because the tax receipts are drying up.

Women’s rights are not, and should never be considered a ‘side’ issue WTAF - says it all - really. You may not care but millions of women and girls do.

So anyone that doesn't support this Government is a 'Labour activist'?

Does posting on here make you a Conservative 'activist'?

The Conservatives have thrown away any reputation they might have once had for pragmatic politics. Austerity & the interminable years of infighting over Brexit put paid to that.

No magic involved. Every Labour voter knows there’s no money. That’s why our jaws drop when we hear Hunt promising tax cuts. Public services have been cut to the bone on the last 15 years yet the Tories think it appropriate to cut them even further to give them the wherewithal to bribe voters with tax cuts. wtf?

What Labour will do - and Reeves couldn’t be clearer - is grow the economy to create more real money. Not illusory borrowed money. In the meantime they’ll reprioritise spending, cut out Tory rubbish we don’t need and use tax revenue more sensibly. The fact that business is firmly behind Labour now is all the proof I need that they’re fiscally responsible.

The trans issue is an obsession on the part of a small number of single issue voters. I never hear it mentioned outside MN. It won’t be a consideration for 99.9% of voters.

No. Everyone is aware that it will take literally years of rebuilding this country after these bunch of self serving idiots have trashed it. I feel sorry for labour. Who would want to take on that thankless task. The conservatives have all but given up. They can barely be bothered to keep the show running.

In my rural town we now have not a single NHS dentist and not a single GP employed at the local surgery because they all quit when it was taken over by yet another shady profit making company (with the profits going abroad of course). Ambulances are waiting 4 hours to drop off patients and that’s considered good. They are about to cut one of the very few remaining bus services that is absolutely vital. The secondary school looks like something out of the Soviet Union. I expect the books in the library were donated at about the same time. Meanwhile the governments energy seems to be focused on sending a flight of 100 people to Rwanda. People have had enough.

There is no money to magically improve public services, under any party. I am afraid most labour voters are going to be bitterly bitterly disappointed when they see no change or things becoming even worse because the tax receipts are drying up.

Do you therefore accept, @Newchapterbeckons, that there is also no money for tax cuts? How do you account for the fact that Hunt claims there is?

Women’s rights are not, and should never be considered a ‘side’ issue WTAF - says it all - really. You may not care but millions of women and girls do.

Women's rights certainly aren't a side issue, which is why anyone in support of women's rights would have to be mad to vote Conservative given their abysmal record in that respect over the last 14 years. Given also the party's lurch to the right, I'm pretty terrified of what else they will do in that respect if left in power. Paying lip service to the trans lobby whilst not actually doing anything to change the legislation makes no difference to that.

Thanks @Newchapterbeckons

Assuming, safely, that Labour wins the next election it will be interesting to see how many significant changes Labour makes.

What are the changes proposed, in concrete terms?

https://labour.org.uk/missions/

Great clear posts from @Grandmasswag @Zyq and @BIossomtoes

Everyone knows Labour won't be able to perform any miracles but they can work on undoing the crap of the last few years.

Starmer isn't the best and I have reservations about him but he's massively better than the last 5 PMs of this Tory government.

I'd love to read the manifestos.

The only way to do that is to call an election.

There won’t be much if it’s only VAT really standing out as a policy, in fact likely damaging

If they commit to other stuff we’ll see

Yes this is what I am hearing too. People are pissed off with the Tories naturally but they are voting against them and not FOR Labour. The LP is a fucking mess and are clearly very divided on many issues, the hard left Rayner is waiting in the wings and their current leader cannot bring himself to define what 51% of the population is. What a fucking time to be alive.

THIS.