Voting to 'Get the Tories Out'

[DewHopper]

Pro Labour posters are all over this platform telling posters to vote for whoever gets the Tories out. It does not seem to matter who it is as long as voting for them gets the Tories out nationally.

It's a worrying voting strategy from my pov but I tend to vote at constituency level. If I had an excellent Tory MP who cared about the things I cared about and served their constituents well, I would vote for them. Similarly Labour ( I would absolutely vote for Rosie Duffield) or Independent.

Do those people who will just vote for anyone as longs as this will oust the Tories - and what could be a very good MP - ever consider the effects of this locally? They may have got the Tories out at a national level but saddled themselves with a useless MP who does nothing for the locality.

Take for example women's rights. I am a gender critical woman and care very deeply about the erosion of women's single sex spaces etc. I am sure that many of the 'Tories out at all costs' people feel the same. The pro Labour people keep telling us that Starmer will be better for women's rights BUT if you vote on a single issue - getting the Tories out - you may well elect a hopeless constituency MP who is TWAW and who will be standing up to every pro woman move that Starmer makes. I worry that there will be a lot of these in the next parliament.

So should we be voting on the single issue - get the Tories out? I don't think so - AIBU?

Put like that I suppose on a local level you’re voting for the best access to parliament.

A good local MP will do the best for their constituents regardless of the political leaning of either of them.

In response to this - we could say that people will vote for any idiot as long as they are Tory.

this is what seems to have happened with the majority of the electorate for the past 13 years.

Women’s sex rights are hugely important (and I am definitely GC.)

however - as a society we have way worse problems, shockingly - that have been allowed to develop unchallenged for far too long.

So that we’re now in a situation where a third of the electorate can’t afford to pay all of their bills and clothe and feed themselves adequately at the same time.

1 in 3 children are living in poverty in the UK.

this is now a more pressing issue than keeping women’s only spaces (which as pps have pointed out, the Tories have had plenty of time to focus on if they really wanted to.)

As a voter I deeply care that Schools, health, childrens services and social care are all suffering more than ever.

I also want a government that considers the sustainability of the planet to be a real issue.

I don’t subscribe to the solution that my family will be ok as we’ll just buy ourselves out of this mess. Even if I could I do still give a shit about those who can’t.

I happen to have a brilliant Labour MP (who answers every email in a timely fashion) so yes you’re right, it’s important to think about how our votes affect our world on a local level as well as a national one.

unfortunately I don’t have much faith that others in Tory constituencies will be thinking in the same way.

I agree that many decent Tories have gone but also think that the quality of Labour MPs has declined - Dodds, Butler, Russell-Moyle, Lammy, Nandy, Thornberry, Sultana et al are not the most inspiring crew are they? Surely Labour can do better?

It's interesting that so many people are not really voting for Labour but against the Tories which tells us how bad things are for UK voters.
It's a grim time for politics all round really.

I float between Labour and Lib Dem depending on who is more likely to be successful against the local Conservative Candidate. I would vote Labour, Lib Dem, Green or an independent to the left of the Conservatives. I am not strongly attached to the other parties, although broadly supportive of their ideologies, but I am completely opposed to the ideology of the Conservative Party (and even more so to parties like Reform or EDL). So yes, I do vote to get the Tories out and in my constituency I will choose the candidate who's most likely to be able to do so.

A good local MP will do the best for their constituents regardless of the political leaning of either of them

Yes I agree but was responding to another poster who mentioned 'dolt MPs'.

All this nonsense happened under the Tory watch anyway, regardless of Labour. Same with people who've voted Tories to stop or lower immigration when immigration has rose to record levels on their watch.

Tories are great at playing culture wars in campaigns but then do nothing when in power.

I happen to have a brilliant Labour MP (who answers every email in a timely fashion) so yes you’re right, it’s important to think about how our votes affect our world on a local level as well as a national one

Good to hear.

All this nonsense happened under the Tory watch anyway

Do you think Labour will reverse it? Why? Or get deeper into gender ideology

Hang on, your Labour list is a different type of list to my Tory list. You presumably disagree with their politics - but there is no suggestion that Lammy, Dodds, Nandy or Thornberry are either stupid or bad local MPs is there? Nandy and Lammy in particular are supposed to be very strong local MPs, aren't they? Nandy held Wigan when all around were falling due to her local reputation.

30p Lee doesn't even stand up for his own constituents.

@DewHopper but they are right, an MP’s power is limited and unlikely to influence at cabinet level unless it catches the attention of a minister who would back it (for their own Pursuit of accolades). IME local MP’s power and influence lies in simply holding the position and has weight within the local area and in local government departments. They’re unlikely to translate that to making a difference at a national level without wider party support. Which is a pitfall of an independent MP who will never have that opportunity to court wider support.

I was making a general comment on my perception of the calibre of these MPs - none of us can know how good they are in their constituencies unless we are constituents can we?

Tbf I do listen to Lammy on LBC and he does seem to be quite focused on his constituency (or says that he is) so maybe his inclusion on those grounds was unfair. He's on now actually!

Lammy was misogynistic when he described women as rights hoarding dinosaurs

Not a good advert for Labour, but they broadly toe the line with him anyway. And if you don’t it’s Duffield treatment

Many can barely conceal hatred for women on SM and elsewhere - Osborne and Drakeford good examples

Think this thread is very confused. The OP started with 'we shouldn't vote to get the Tories out nationally, we should vote for the best local MP' but actually the OP's main voting motivation seems to be a single national issue.

I think the actual position of the thread is the OP believes it is right for her to vote against Labour for national reasons, but it is wrong for others to vote against the Tories for national reasons.

@EasternStandard are there no other pressing matters for you than ‘sex based rights’ ? Do you not use public services, state schools, the NHS ? It’s like those things are of secondary importance.
You keep banging on about Labour being worse but you’ve no opinion on the tories incompetence. Like pp have said, the shit has happened on their watch. People should vote on past record surely ?

By calibre do you actually mean you disagree with their politics? In what way do you consider them low calibre that is not to do with policies?

Nandy, Lammy, Thornberry and Dodds are all pretty high calibre I would say - as in they can argue confidently, remember details, answer journalists, write in full sentences. Thornberry can sometimes sound rude, and had that incident over white vans, but that seems to have passed.

I didn't agree with Thatcher but she was a high calibre politician.

I don’t think Labour has decent economic policies to fund what you are expecting. The two main ones are gimmicks and won’t bring in funding.

I could be persuaded if they dropped gender ideology and had decent policies around funding but that’s like wishing the whole party was removed and new people installed. Gender runs through them like a stick of rock and that’s unfortunate

So given there is no extra money the added hatred of women who dare to ask for sex based rights is not attractive.

People can vote for who they want, as pp said no one will change their mind on here. But as long as pp realise Labour equals increased gender ideology then fine.

Edited to add - I have actually posted for both main parties so it’s not that I never would, just this iteration for reasons in post

Actually, I don’t think there are any more. A decent, principled person with the good of the country at heart could not in all conscience be a part of the current party. If they’ve hung around after all these years, I think they’ve damned themselves a bit. I get the argument of change from within, but it’s obvious the Tories are getting worse and that isn’t working.
Going back to the OP, why do assume people voting to get the Tories out are necessarily Labour supporters? That advice will, in many constituencies, mean not voting Labour. Yes, the likely government if Tories are out is Labour, but I don’t think it’s just Labour supporters who want that at this point.

@EasternStandard Like you I read and listen. Rachel Reeves has already said there’s little money to go around. Explain why voting Tory again isn’t the same as just banging your head against the wall ad infinitum ? Why should they get another chance ? Highest taxes ever, austerity for last 13 years, nothing to show for it.
Our local town is like a scene from 1970s Soviet union. You carry on voting for them, plenty won’t.

So tactically vote the option most likely to beat all of them…

Our local town is like a scene from 1970s Soviet union.
My local area is so scarred now from the last 13 years, it is sad. We are lucky, it is an area that does better than many places but it looks awful compared to 2010.

I have been to local places that are doing worse and it is genuinely scary how little is left.

Levelling up was a cynical lie.

Levelling up was a cynical lie

it never even happened did it? I genuinely can’t recall anything coming from that although the last few years have been a messy tangle so I might have missed it?

I’m sure they won’t.

I’m not so sure people will get all that they are expecting however, I see so many posts outlining what they think will be funded. The list is endless and state dependency is high. I also think we need the high earners to continue to fund it not the opposite.

And I’m pretty sure Labour will push forward on gender.

I can’t vote for that but everyone gets their own vote.

I’m glad he did that. That’s excellent. However he is the MP. He’s the one with clout. There’s nothing a prospective candidate for an election with no date could have done anything, so I’m not sure why you are surprised he didn’t.

They are now, belatedly, sending out some 'levelling up funds'.

They are giving levelling up funds to areas which are not in the bottom half of the needs table.

Well, on a previous thread you seem to be concerned only with one issue, that of womens rights, now thats a very important issue BUT some people think another Tory Government will damage womens rights on a national level, our views don't seem to count, a well known GC poster on here suggested another to poster skip the thread, its not her fucking job to police MN or try and shut down opposing views.

The problem is a local MP who isn't in Government, has limited power, so your excellent Labour MP of the last 13 years hasn't really a lot of clout, a poorer quality Tory one has more.

On quality, why have soooo many Tory MPs had recall petitions or stood down before their time? Bone, Boris, Dorris etc etc ?