Don't know how to deal with this. Ds scamming people online

[1newname]

Back story is we've stopped giving him money due to many ultimatums regarding weed. Last week he was showing off about how he's managed to find a way to make money. I knew it would be something dodgy and he had sold something online which he doesn't have to sell. I told him how disgusted I was, how he's behaving like a scumbag etc. Initially he didn't care but then said he knew it was wrong and wouldn't do it again. And now he has.

I'm so disappointed. I'm embarrassed with how he's turning out. He doesn't seem to have any morals. Every wrong thing a teen can do, he's done. Graffiti, shop lifting, excessive weed smoking and now this. I give up.

My advice is to start again, it’s not too late. I’ve been where you are and it is possible.

Be clear with your consequence’s & boundaries. Remind him if he gets caught of the criminal record he will receive.

Give him some money if you can afford to or suggest that he gets a part time job. Not giving him money hasn’t worked. It can make people feel powerless.

Try lots of positive praise for doing things right like when he was younger. It doesn’t matter what you are, you always want praise and approval from people you value.

You are potentially an accessory after the fact. Report him or risk getting a criminal record yourself.

What consequences have you put in place at home?

He needs to pay back the people he scammed. Holiday job/sell his phone (he can get a basic replacement) and other electronic items.

Your son is dealing with something, neurodiversity or mental health most likely, that is making it harder for him to conform / deal with life than everyone else. Whilst boundaries are necessary and create a feeling of safety, taking stuff off him could create a spiral of resentment and oppositional behaviour. You need to tackle the root cause of this which is that there is something different about him. Many people try drugs, the ones that get hooked to the extent they need to steal are the ones who are plugging a gap they can't fill otherwise. Counselling or mental health services or a private assessment for undiagnosed ADHD, autism etc are what he needs - and you need to calmly explain how devastated you are, how you fear for his future, how you see he's lost and needs help and want to help, but cannot tolerate criminality.

I've seen teens like this before. I worked with a lady, for example, whose son was always in trouble, stole a watch off a classmate at school in year 10 etc, and is now in prison because it just snowballed. I think the root of his issues were attachment disorder (developmental trauma) caused by her having severe post natal depression when he was tiny - no one's fault, but a mental health need that was never addressed.

I work in financial crime. Even if you reported your son to the Police they would have no interest whatsoever in this level of fraud.

What will happen is that the victims will report the fraud to their banks, and the money will be recovered from your sons account whilst they investigate. As your son has no entitlement to the funds the money will be refunded and your son placed on a crime register for 6years making it virtually impossible for him to get a bank account anywhere. He will not be able to get credit cards, loan, mortgage. He will not have an account for any employer to pay a salary into.

So there will be consequences.

Also, has your son been assessed for ADHD?

Research the impact of weed and addiction and share that with him. Brains are still developing under 25 and weed impacts on that negatively. I think a lot of people, young people especially, really underestimate how strong of a drug cannabis actually is. His behaviour seems to be addiction driven, or as someone mentioned above, maybe he is being chased to pay his debts, and fear is driving him. It sounds like he has already opened up to you somewhat, I would keep digging to understand more. Empathise, and then steer him. (Alongside setting the boundaries and consequences, such as removing access to the internet, his phone, telling the police etc).

Don't beat yourself up for his behaviour. As you say, your younger son knows right from wrong, so you can raise kids effectively. The trouble is when young people get in with the 'wrong crowd'. It brings to mind the Gabor Mate book, Hold on to your Kids: "Children today increasingly look to their peers for direction—their values, identity, and codes of behavior. This “peer orientation” undermines family cohesion, interferes with healthy development, and fosters a hostile and sexualized youth culture. Children end up becoming overly conformist, desensitized, and alienated; being “cool” matters more to them than anything else.
Hold On to Your Kids explains the causes of this crucial breakdown of parental influence—and demonstrates ways to “reattach” to sons and daughters, establish the proper hierarchy in the home, make kids feel safe and understood, and earn back your children’s loyalty and love. By helping to reawaken parenting instincts innate to us all, this book will empower parents to be for their children what nature intended: a true source of contact, security, and warmth."

How is he accessing the internet, phone, laptop etc? Can you remove his devices or remove the internet and stop paying for his data. Can you encourage him to get a job rather than scamming people? Could he earn money off you by doing jobs?

The only decent thing to do is to report him to the police. Scams break people's hearts and ruin people's lives. There is no excuse for what your son is doing.

three pages and only one commenter (as far as I can see) has suggested getting him of the weed?

That's what he needs the money for and that's what is turning him into a knobhead generally.

When I was in 6th form (2000) a few of my mates got into weed and it really messed them up, I'd never accept my kids doing it. This Summer I was back in the UK and I was shocked how common and blatant it has become.

Hear, hear

If his attendance is 60% that is down to you unfortunately. Parents are responsible for getting their children to school, not the school. I am not sure what action you want the school to take if you are unable to get him there yourself.

He reminds me of my brother from whom I am completely estranged now. In his case it was bookies not weed but he started off nicking stuff as a teenager to feed his gambling habit, and my parents didn’t know how to react so did nothing other than deliver a few lame lectures and wring their hands about the evils of gambling.

Roll forward and he’s now 60. Has never had a paying job in his life, or owned a property and has spend the last 45 year scamming people and dodging the law. He flits from woman to woman sponging off them until they get tired of him and throw him out - he’s no looker but he has quite a good rapport with children and he targets wealthy single mums with kids with issues.

Somehow he’s never gone to prison but I fairly often am contacted by people trying to track him down to report him to the police. He has left my mother virtually penniless after stealing her debit card and emptying her accounts (she would not report him to either bank or police) and even stole my sister’s bank account and emptied her account as she lay dying from cancer.

He’s a vile worthless fecker, and infamous in the area he lives in - and his reputation besmirches the rest of the family. Who knows if he would have turned out better had my parents nipped his behaviour in the bud as a teenager but they didn’t and he certainly could not have turned out worse!

I'm so disappointed. I'm embarrassed with how he's turning out
Last week he was showing off
I told him how disgusted I was, how he's behaving like a scumbag etc.

I wouldn't be surprised if u lose your son completely in time. Cruel words to say about your DS.
Have boundaries for sure , but try going deeper and understand why he is doing what he is! I imagine he doen't FEEL love and accepted by you at all.

He can of course get WiFi, a new phone, laptop etc but the OP won't be in anyway condoning or enabling it.
I would immediately

1. Remove his phone, laptop, Xbox, any tablets, playstation etc and hid them outside of the house.
2. Change the WiFi code

He can still scam people but it will be harder and not in my house. I would also tell him he has crossed a line and that he has lost all privileges. I would also hide the fuckers bankcard and bank letters just so it's a bit harder for him to access the money he stole.

I agree.

You need to sit down and talk to him, like he's a adult. Taking everything away hasn't worked nor has treating him like a child so you need to rethink. Is their anyone he looks up to, admires or respects? No child turns nasty for no reason, so either something has happened to make him do this or your parenting has gone wrong somewhere. Main thing is you know it's wrong and you want to help him. He is a child and although I've suggested you talk to him like a adult I mean you listen and respect what he says, you don't let him control you or the situation.

Don't worry about school for now, you have bigger things to deal with, worse thing he fails and has to resit. Also don't compare him to his brother, that's not fair

Good post, Mrs Harman

👆This. He's a thief. You need to come down hard before he gets in serious trouble,

Report him to the police. Why would you protect him? He needs to realise that his nice cushy home is dependent on him behaving like a civilised person. Maybe a brush with the law will get through to him when nothing else has.

Or cancel his phone contract, change the password on the router, stop all money and tell him he must earn back (and pay back) whatever he has scammed.

You need to do something firm now or his criminal activities will get worse and worse.

Remove his phone, the WiFi and his computer. Remove him from your home. And report him to the police. Tell the school why.

He's breaking the law though...

My first instinct would be to help him contact every single person he has scammed so he can apologise and listen to any response they have and make arrangements to quickly repay them. This will probably mean walking him through selling some of his belongings.

Throughout all of this I would model compassion to your DS. Whilst the reparations and sale of his belongings would be non negotiable, I would still try and model empathy towards him. You need to repair your relationship with him in order to have half a chance of influencing his future actions. Sympathise (I know it's hard/we've all made mistakes etc) but stay firm (we have to make things right, I cannot protect you from the consequences of your actions, but I will help you list your things for sale/etc)

He has a addiction to drugs, and like a few others have said that is why he needs the money. Sadly a lot of people think weed is harmless. What some people don't understand is that they end up mixing with the wrong crowd. And people easily led go on to use stronger drugs until one day they cannot cope without them. All families get told is they have to decide to stop them self. Yes they can go to jail etc but its a never ending cycle. It saddens me the state of the uk.