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Original poster

Thread 34 Sunak - the Circus is back in Westminster

997 replies

DuncinToffee · 12/12/2023 13:36

Previous thread
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4947437-thread-33-sunak-sense-and-sunakability?page=40&reply=131395455

OP posts:
Thread gallery
43
tobee · 13/12/2023 23:20

"and no matter what this government say it is not illegal to seek asylum."

THIS!!!!!!!!!!!

L1ttledrummergirl · 14/12/2023 00:09

I've had to avoid this page since I read Janiie comment earlier. Having attended the funeral of one of my dc friends after they killed themself having not recovered from the treatment they received during covid while at university, someone taking the piss about and minimising suicide absolutely disgusts me.

As far as I'm concerned, you have to be a particular breed of lowlife to be so callous.

TooBigForMyBoots · 14/12/2023 00:47

Pay no mind to Janiie @L1ttledrummergirl. Her raison d'etre is to support the Tories no matter what.

I'm sorry about your friend.ThanksBrew My friend died because "we don't have a bed". It makes me so angry that her death was recorded as Suicide. She died because our government couldn't be arsed doing it's duty. Too busy rinsing the UK to line their own pockets.Angry

itsgettingweird · 14/12/2023 04:30

pointythings · 13/12/2023 21:21

Room size on that barge is worse than it is in a standard prison cell. These men have committed no crime - their claims are still pending, and no matter what this government say it is not illegal to seek asylum.

Yes.

I've noticed their rhetoric has increasingly used the word "illegal immigrants" lately when referring to asylum seekers who haven't yet been processed so are not illegal at the point they are discussing.

It's made me so cross.

Almost as cross as someone trying to justify someone taking their own life as "one of those things".

I hope to god no one in the U.K. ever needs to seek asylum and the world stops seeing them as human.

MrTiddlesTheCat · 14/12/2023 08:18

Janiie · 13/12/2023 10:03

'And that’s on top of the questions about how we’ve made conditions so bad for asylum seekers that we are breaking their mental health even if it wasn’t broken before.'

Bad? They are all housed and fed, rightly so. I'd guess treated far better than the war torn countries some are fleeing. They are treated far better than our own homeless people are. No doubt whataboutery and I'm sorry for the man who took his own life yesterday but you do know suicide is the biggesr killer of men under 40 in the UK? Sympathies for this poor man and his family but let's have some perspective.

Your empathy appears to have crashed. Have you tried switching it off then on again, that might kick start it.

IClaudine · 14/12/2023 08:39

Have just caught up with this thread. I am disgusted by some of the posts. Choosing to come on this thread in order to be goady about a man's suicide is very low.

Sad about Drakeford, but he did say he wasn't going to stand again. I am not sure we will find another person with his integrity.

Janiie · 14/12/2023 08:43

'Almost as cross as someone trying to justify someone taking their own life as "one of those things".

I've no idea how you've taken that from what I said. Posters were trying, as always, to blame the Government. Suggesting a bed and less than luxurious shelter may have tipped the balance. I merely suggested suicide is sadly a bit more complex than that and blame is not helpful or even actually appropriate.

I'm sorry for every person who takes their own life and families left to pick up the pieces. Let's not suggest it was because his bedroom was too small.

cakeorwine · 14/12/2023 08:47

Janiie · 14/12/2023 08:43

'Almost as cross as someone trying to justify someone taking their own life as "one of those things".

I've no idea how you've taken that from what I said. Posters were trying, as always, to blame the Government. Suggesting a bed and less than luxurious shelter may have tipped the balance. I merely suggested suicide is sadly a bit more complex than that and blame is not helpful or even actually appropriate.

I'm sorry for every person who takes their own life and families left to pick up the pieces. Let's not suggest it was because his bedroom was too small.

That's exactly how you came across.
You can't see it.
Maybe that says something about you and your empathy.

IClaudine · 14/12/2023 08:48

Bad? They are all housed and fed, rightly so

There is more to treating people decently than simply feeding them. I won't say housing them as making people share rooms with strangers on what is essentially a prison barge barely qualifies as housing them.

Some posters might want to read this and then ask Santa to bring them some empathy for Christmas.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/dec/13/growing-despair-of-asylum-seekers-on-bibby-stockholm-over-living-conditions

Roussette · 14/12/2023 08:49

If I were you Janiie I'd stop digging. Seriously.

Do you honestly think suicidal people are not affected by their surroundings, the people around them? It is fact that the environment that someone is in affects their mental health and can lead to suicide.

How in god's name you think different, just means to me that you know absolutely nothing about those with suicidal thoughts. I do. I have in the past talked to people who are struggling like this for ten years. I can promise you that is a big factor on how they feel.

IClaudine · 14/12/2023 08:52

Risk factors for suicide include: inadequate housing, poor mental health, low educational attainment, unemployment, loneliness and low social mobility.

www.samaritans.org/about-samaritans/research-policy/inequality-suicide/socioeconomic-disadvantage-and-suicidal-behaviour/

pointythings · 14/12/2023 08:57

It's pointless trying to argue with @Janiie . None so deaf as those who do not want to hear. And suicidal people only deserve sympathy if they aren't asylum seekers.

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 14/12/2023 08:59

For all the reasons to come back to this thread, she chooses this one

OP posts:
IClaudine · 14/12/2023 09:04

It is just so crass.

Notonthestairs · 14/12/2023 09:08

Breaking:

MP Scott Benton facing a 35-day suspension from the Commons.

Sanction recommended by the Commons standards committee.

If passed by MPs, would mean a recall petition and possible byelection.

twitter.com/breeallegretti…

x.com/breeallegretti/status/1735224692645023865?s=46&t=Uw4lJNwxFZFnX0Xs3doHYg

Notonthestairs · 14/12/2023 09:17

Bloody hell this is stark.

Ch 4 revealing the difference in the NHS since the coalition.

x.com/channel4news/status/1615771711336497156?s=46&t=Uw4lJNwxFZFnX0Xs3doHYg

Janiie · 14/12/2023 09:19

pointythings · 14/12/2023 08:57

It's pointless trying to argue with @Janiie . None so deaf as those who do not want to hear. And suicidal people only deserve sympathy if they aren't asylum seekers.

I didn't say anything like that. In fact I've said throughout I have sympathy for the man and his family but to politicise this tragic situation is disgusting.

Jason118 · 14/12/2023 09:24

If politicising is disgusting, I presume you will not be supporting the political party that implemented the policy that undoubtedly contributed to the outcome?

Roussette · 14/12/2023 09:25

Janiie · 14/12/2023 09:19

I didn't say anything like that. In fact I've said throughout I have sympathy for the man and his family but to politicise this tragic situation is disgusting.

Show quote history

To categorically deny that this man's environment played no part in his suicide is what is disgusting.

You cannot tell me that him not having any idea when his asylum claim would be processed, and living in a room the size of a parking space on an industrial barge has no bearing on how he feels.

Do you then think it is totally irrelevant as to where he was existing? That his environment and circumstances had no bearing?

Give it up Janiie for god's sake.

IClaudine · 14/12/2023 09:29

As linked above, risk factors for suicide and inextricably linked to how well the government looks after the vulnerable. It is impossible to reduce suicide rates without government action. Political actions affect the mental health of individuals, janiie. It is not disgusting to recognise that.

cakeorwine · 14/12/2023 09:29

Janiie · 14/12/2023 09:19

I didn't say anything like that. In fact I've said throughout I have sympathy for the man and his family but to politicise this tragic situation is disgusting.

Show quote history

Can you possibly put yourself in the position of some of these people?
It doesn't take much to tip someone over the edge and who knows what the condition is like on this vessel, with the people, the surroundings , the guards and not knowing what the future is like - especially with the logjam.

"Bad? They are all housed and fed, rightly so. I'd guess treated far better than the war torn countries some are fleeing. They are treated far better than our own homeless people are."

Do you not understand mental health and how the environment you are in, and how you see your future, can be affected and can be enough to tip you over the edge?

Maybe you don't.

I had a house and food. But I once had little hope for the future. And without hope, things can be tough.

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 14/12/2023 09:30

Notonthestairs · 14/12/2023 09:08

Breaking:

MP Scott Benton facing a 35-day suspension from the Commons.

Sanction recommended by the Commons standards committee.

If passed by MPs, would mean a recall petition and possible byelection.

twitter.com/breeallegretti…

x.com/breeallegretti/status/1735224692645023865?s=46&t=Uw4lJNwxFZFnX0Xs3doHYg

Report says he was "clearly motivated" by personal gain and says "concealing or withholding evidence" was an aggravating factor

https://x.com/danbloom1/status/1735225464124276803?s=20

OP posts:
IClaudine · 14/12/2023 09:31

So, two possible by-elections on the horizon? Excellent!

Notonthestairs · 14/12/2023 09:31

Utterly corrupt.

Janiie · 14/12/2023 09:47

'had a house and food. But I once had little hope for the future. And without hope, things can be tough.'

Yes of course things can be and are tough for many.

My point <again> is to state this tragedy was the Government's fault is very low and totally inappropriate . I would suggest the country he was fleeing are more to blame if anyone is.