“We fail students by indulging their fragilities” - Libby Purves in the Times

[CruCru]

I read this thing by Libby Purves in the Times: [[We fail students by indulging their fragilities

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/5dbf29f2-857e-41ce-8c78-028a513ab8f9?shareToken=c41320dec7bfb802e039b5c8bc3b513f

I found it very interesting. “Whatever the failings of postwar stiffness - it had plenty - at least that generation was more prepared than most modern children for the shocking fact that once education’s over, the wide world really doesn’t care about your feelings. Rules and systems should prevent bullying, but preserving your comfort zone is of interest only to parents and faithful friends. As far as everyone else is concerned, it’s up to you to be useful.”

I remember at work being taken aback at how much harder work some of the new graduates were than when I started. I wonder, though, if part of that was that they’d had to do so much more to get the job. My A levels were respectable but my old university wouldn’t give me a place these days. So much is expected of young people.

I wonder if young people are less able to debate / argue in a civilised way. So much online discussion is ranting in a very black and white way with little scope for nuance. To be honest, MN is not often any better than anywhere else.

Society is increasingly polarised so I wouldn't be surprised if teenagers reflect this. I also think that the pandemic has taken a heavy toll on young people's development and also on their mental health.

I've been seeing a lot about lack of third spaces in USA on you tube at minute - ie spaces that aren't work or home but just saw one that applied it to teens especially and then suggested that phone usage is a symptom not a cause of problem ie no where cheap to free to hang out so they stay home and turn to indoor entertainment like phones.

I don't think UK is as a bad - my teens girls have hung out in local parks - but previous location we when they were in primary rarely saw other kids in the local parks in school holidays or playing out. Some of the best meeting new people advice I've seen on here is start being a regular in a third space.

I do think there is also latent hostility especially to teens though in public places - and I do think it was worse during covid I know many of DD1 friends face abuse even when walking family dogs - a local trio of lads were publicly shamed in papers and by councilors for going fishing together - tuned out they were brothers living in same house and going to a very quiet outdoor site - my own teens were told of by school staff for walking home together to point they had to met up down the road a bit.

Being outside and in green spaces had research linking it to improved mental health were such places exits I'm not sure teens groups are always welcomed. The post war generation my DP and IL played out in streets most days.

It is really hard to find things for young people to do, if they’re not into sport or music.
When I was looking for activities for ds aged 13 earlier this year I drew a blank because there were things for kids that went up to 12 and things for adults, whether recreational activities or volunteering opportunities, that started at 14 or more often 16.
When I was his age, age limits tended to be more flexible and there would have been a whole load of evening classes which no longer exist at all in our area. I never knew of anyone who went to youth clubs as such but there were more things to do which weren’t specifically aimed at teenagers but were quite happy to have you. Doing an activity with adults is a valuable way to mature and if you are in a group with twenty adults and a handful of young people you make friends with the other young people in a way you might find harder if it’s a whole bunch of people your own age.
He loves acting and would have got on very well in the calm local drama group I went to as a teenager doing Agatha Christies but couldn’t face the high octane youth musical theatre group that would be the only option round here.

It is because of safeguarding that lots of places will not accept teenagers.
I do know what you mean though. My best friend was in an amateur dramatics group and was the only teenager. These days they would be unlikely to accept her as they would have had to DBS and train everyone on safeguarding.

It is because of safeguarding that lots of places will not accept teenagers.

This is what I've bee told as well.

We were starting to hit age limits here with our children and activities but the covid made it all worse. Mix of the aging out and often things locally not coming back at all.

Older two now at college and Uni do have opportunities and I do wish they join something. Youngest was doing non sport groups with school - games to art to textiles to science- and then sudden unexplained change in policy nothing but sport groups happening now.

Yes totally agree on the lack of activities for teens, my friends and I often remark on this. If you are a younger child or an adult there is no limit to what you can get involved with, but for a teenager, it's really challenging. My DC wants to get into woodwork and it's impossible.

Yes, absolutely.
Society quite rightly became aware of the dangers of sexual abuse and exploitation but this has resulted in a shift to friendships between non-related older and younger people being viewed with suspicion. You see it on Mumsnet sometimes where someone is concerned about a friendship, quite possibly with good reason, but then a number of posters will opine that the ONLY POSSIBLE REASON an adult wants to spend time with a teenager is something dubious. The unintended consequence (not that I am dismissing the intended one of keeping kids safe from predators) is more isolation for the young people and fewer opportunities for them to learn skills and enjoy activities.
Having a skill is such a valuable source of self esteem and recreational activities that calm you down are a great thing to have when you are entering a situation like university that can be stressful. It is hobbies and friendships that make you resilient, not lessons in How To Be Resilient.

I am lucky that my kids’ school makes them all do what they call a ‘personal development activity’ once a week, what used to be called a club. It not only gives them a chance to learn a skill but it promotes friendships across the years. It would be nice if there were out of school things they could do but it sounds like there are kids who don’t even have that opportunity.

@Shrammed lots of volunteers have dropped out since covid. So lots of things run by volunteers have folded.

@TheCountessofFitzdotterel I agree. Obviously safeguarding is important. But it does reduce opportunities for young people. It used to be common for girls especially to have friendships with young mums who were lonely. It also used to be common for more lonely teenagers to visit sympathetic teachers in their home.

I seem to remember the original Adrian Mole diary featuring regular visits to a cantankerous pensioner called Bert Baxter.

Hard to believe unaccompanied visits like this would be officially allowed now. Also remember a volunteer programme for the local (now defunct) psychiatric hospital where sixth formers would visit the patients. My BF and I went on an introductory visit there. After doing the rounds, and getting a talk from one of the staff who admitted that some of the male patients did occasionally ‘try it on’, we chatted about it and decided not to pursue it as neither of us felt safe there.