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Original poster

Thread 32 Sunak : Sunak v Suella, the final countdown?

996 replies

DuncinToffee · 10/11/2023 08:25

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4916659-thread-31-sunak-court-conflicts-and-complications?page=1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
46
Original poster
DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 13:13

BIossomtoes · 15/11/2023 13:11

Who’s the anchor? Her face was priceless.

Show quote history

Jo Coburn

OP posts:
AutumnCrow · 15/11/2023 13:15

Comedy gold - a few of the usual MPs asking about 'LGBTQI+' asylum seekers and Cleverly can't say it properly. Got lost in the alphabet soup and had to be helped out.

BIossomtoes · 15/11/2023 13:15

Thanks Duncin.

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 13:15

At least Cleverly is not advocating to leave the ECHR

OP posts:
AutumnCrow · 15/11/2023 13:16

Jo Cherry making the same point as Theresa May in more legal detail

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 13:22

Rishi Sunak's Press Secretary defends Lee Anderson's demand for the government to "ignore the law" on Rwanda as him having "strong views"

Asked if having strong views trumps the need to respect the law, she says he was "representing the views of his constituents".

OP posts:
AutumnCrow · 15/11/2023 13:24

Sammy Wilson comparing Cleverly to Baldrick, so he is.

dontcallmelen · 15/11/2023 13:26

DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 13:22

Rishi Sunak's Press Secretary defends Lee Anderson's demand for the government to "ignore the law" on Rwanda as him having "strong views"

Asked if having strong views trumps the need to respect the law, she says he was "representing the views of his constituents".

I wish some of his constituents would come out & say he isn’t wonder if any of them would?

AdamRyan · 15/11/2023 13:34

I think leaving the ECHR is the end game for lots of Tories, not immigration at all.
At the moment the ECHR, HRA and EA together are viewed by some as "red tape" that stops governments/employers from doing all kinds of discriminatory and prejudicial things and thereby impact their ability to be as capitalist as possible (e.g. by having to make reasonable adjustments for disabled people, or provide paid maternity leave).

Therefore the same people who wanted brexit also want this.

I also think this is what's driving the "sex based rights" malarkey - its a trojan horse to scrap the EA. And that's why the Conservatives haven't made any progress. If they wanted to strengthen sex based rights that would involve a wording change and there is cross party support so it should be straightforward. But they don't want to do that. Badenoch wants to scrap it altogether and replace with something else. And I don't think that's to protect women.

(Sorry, slight derail. As a feminist all this talk of scrapping the HRA/EA, coming out of ECHR terrifies me)

MrTiddlesTheCat · 15/11/2023 13:43

AutumnCrow · 15/11/2023 11:44

Apparently the UK Govt has two other countries 'in mind' but hasn't revealed which ones yet. We have previously had speculation about various crown dependencies and overseas territories whose own governments told the government to get fucked. So that went well.

I'm betting Wales and Scotland.

Piggywaspushed · 15/11/2023 13:57

it was mentioned on the news last week. Am recalling Turkey and India.

Roussette · 15/11/2023 14:07

There is word going round about Falkland Island ! Good grief, that won't go down well knowing something about the island...
Ditto Saint Helena
Ditto Tristan de Cunha
Ditto Ascension
All British territories
Between me and DH, we have been to all these islands

MrTiddlesTheCat · 15/11/2023 14:18

DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 13:22

Rishi Sunak's Press Secretary defends Lee Anderson's demand for the government to "ignore the law" on Rwanda as him having "strong views"

Asked if having strong views trumps the need to respect the law, she says he was "representing the views of his constituents".

So they believe his constituents are all law breakers? I wonder how the people of Ashfield feel about that.

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 15:22

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/rwanda-decision-reveals-the-governments-tawdry-moral-disposition-in-devastating-detail-2756279

At the heart of the case was the principle of non-refoulement. It sounds esoteric and technical. In fact, it is a basic ethical rule for those who still care about things like human rights. It is a fundamental principle of international law.

The principle is this: countries which receive asylum seekers must never return them to a country where they’re in danger of persecution. No matter what happens, we must make sure that the people fleeing oppression, torture and death are protected from those who would harm them. It is a grand, humane thing, one of those ideas which defines civilisation.

Rwanda decision reveals the Government's tawdry moral disposition in devastating detail

It’s been a bitter, shameful story. But for all that, there is at least one moment of hope

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/rwanda-decision-reveals-the-governments-tawdry-moral-disposition-in-devastating-detail-2756279

OP posts:
Roussette · 15/11/2023 16:15

Great article. Very powerful. Thanks Duncin. As it's behind a paywall, I have archived it if anyone can't get access. (link below is safe)
I didn't know about the 2013 Rwanda experiment with Israel, when Rwanda broke the agreement. And I didn't know that during 2020-22 Rwanda 100% rejected all refugees from Syria, Yemen and Afghanistan.

https://archive.ph/9NbL7

I only had to type 'ref' into google and up comes 'refoulement'. I bet it's been looked up a lot today....

Notonthestairs · 15/11/2023 16:16

NEW: First YouGov snap poll on the Rwanda judgement.

What should govt do now?

  • Scrap the policy: 39%
  • Similar agreement, new country: 29%

What should Britain do on ECHR?

  • Remain member: 51%
  • Withdraw: 28%

x.com/tomlarkinsky/status/1724822446606303466?s=46&t=Uw4lJNwxFZFnX0Xs3doHYg

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 16:21

Thanks Roussette, I have a few free articles so didn't realise this one was behind paywall.

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Original poster
DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 16:28

Good point is made in the replies to Tom Larkin's tweet, do people know what the ECHR is?

See also AdamRyan's post.

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Notonthestairs · 15/11/2023 16:35

I don't think all MPs know what the ECHR is. Let alone the public.

bombastix · 15/11/2023 16:43

Oh look Braverman popped up with her emergency legislation which I think is also unlawful. What a self serving gargoyle she is.

bombastix · 15/11/2023 16:44

Roussette · 15/11/2023 16:15

Great article. Very powerful. Thanks Duncin. As it's behind a paywall, I have archived it if anyone can't get access. (link below is safe)
I didn't know about the 2013 Rwanda experiment with Israel, when Rwanda broke the agreement. And I didn't know that during 2020-22 Rwanda 100% rejected all refugees from Syria, Yemen and Afghanistan.

https://archive.ph/9NbL7

I only had to type 'ref' into google and up comes 'refoulement'. I bet it's been looked up a lot today....

Yes it's almost as if Rwanda just takes the money and then runs. Because the same outcome over a decade is pretty good evidence for that

jgw1 · 15/11/2023 16:47

bombastix · 15/11/2023 16:44

Yes it's almost as if Rwanda just takes the money and then runs. Because the same outcome over a decade is pretty good evidence for that

Show quote history

I am told we know where the money goes in Rwanda.

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 16:56

Press Conference

Rishi Sunak: "We will take the extraordinary step of announcing emergency legislation. This will enable Parliament to confirm that with our new treaty Rwanda is safe. I will not allow a foreign court to block these flights to Rwanda."

OP posts:
bombastix · 15/11/2023 16:58

Oh shit

jgw1 · 15/11/2023 16:58

DuncinToffee · 15/11/2023 16:56

Press Conference

Rishi Sunak: "We will take the extraordinary step of announcing emergency legislation. This will enable Parliament to confirm that with our new treaty Rwanda is safe. I will not allow a foreign court to block these flights to Rwanda."

Rishi thinks the Supreme Court is foreign?

Has he forgottent that he is the UK Prime Minister?