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BBC Presenter and yet more allegations

1000 replies

friendlycat · 11/07/2023 23:28

It would appear that the front page of tomorrow’s The Sun has further allegations about messages with a new 17 year old. Creepy hearts etc

Scrolling through Sky news and seeing front pages of the papers. This appears bottom right on The Sun front page.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
16
bellac11 · 12/07/2023 15:50

Boltonb · 12/07/2023 15:32

Oh, ok. So someone who may have been groomed at 17, and may well still be under the control of this presenter (legal fees paid etc) is saying it’s rubbish.

Let’s all assume there’s nothing to the story. No need for anyone to investigate, the child who was allegedly paid for explicit photos and or videos says nothing happened. Phew

I think most people commenting on this, including you, just dont seem to grasp the issues around consent, choice, capacity and agency

If I dont consent to you making a report/claim on my behalf and using my personal information to do that, you cannot do it. You cant take my bank statements, my online information, my private photos, my email correspondence or texts or whatever and take them somewhere to show people, no matter how concerned you are. I have a choice about that assuming I have capacity.

So you and I can believe what we like or disbelieve what we like but the person right at the centre of this, the person everyone says they are concerned about, has had their voice taken away by people disregarding their view and statement. You might not want to hear it, you might think the statement came about incorrectly but it is their statement that they have a right to make.

Ive noticed comments like 'well you cant believe him he is groomed' or 'you cant believe him, he's a drug addict'

Would people be sayin the same thing if he was saying 'Im a victim of this man'?

Why is the disbelief only in one direction?

Nightlystroll · 12/07/2023 15:54

Translucentwaters · 12/07/2023 15:34

I am not sure any seventeen - twenty year old I know would even use the term ‘rubbish’ it is a very old fashioned word I haven’t even heard in decades. It’s worrying that even the language sounds off.

To you. Sounds fine to me. It's an everyday terminology where I live. I was invigilating in schools up to 2018. Kids were using it then.

lemmein · 12/07/2023 15:57

Calliecaterpillar · 12/07/2023 15:48

Thank you!! I'm really sorry that happened to you and your daughter @lemmein

I look back on my own younger days very differently now. People also couldn't be prosecuted because what they were seen and known doing wasn't illegal - parking outside of social services offices and collecting me from my case review no less...

I thought I had a lovely older boyfriend (for a while) But I didnt. I was a vulnerable child being abused.

Every sign was there. He was never witnessed doing anything illegal though by those who had the entire picture and knew exactly what was happening to me. So nothing got done

Plus I was telling social workers how lovely my "older" boyfriend was to me. I certainly wouldn't have told police anything had they come asking

@Calliecaterpillar I'm so sorry that happened to you Flowers

Similar scenario with my DD -her 'boyfriend' wasn't much older than her but he was part of a wider group who she was then 'introduced' to. No way would she have ever told the police what was going on because she just couldn't see it.

I remember years ago going on a training week and one of the speakers was a manager of a childrens home. It was just as the grooming gang stories were starting to break so it was discussed during the training. This woman said 'well yea, but what the press don't tell you is these girls went willingly and were fine whilst they were getting gifts - they only reported it when the money stopped!' Shock Absolute ignorance about grooming from professionals who are there to support young people, it's so depressing.

Catstaps · 12/07/2023 15:57

A very good point. The young person may think there’s nothing wrong in it..now.. they may also possibly have feelings for this person if it’s gone on for years. They may feel very differently in the future when they are older and see more clearly. A very mature man targeting young adults on dating sites may not be illegal but morally it’s way off especially in his public position with his power and influence. Add to that the money payments. Sorry but it’s indefensible. He should resign and apologise.

deedeeweewoo · 12/07/2023 16:00

They're shouting paedo at whoever because of a 17 year old, while they counted down the days for fifteen year olds to become 'legal'

Calliecaterpillar · 12/07/2023 16:02

@lemmein I think I even posted on here when the stories began to break back in 2012ish under another username myself saying we knew, we went willingly, we were in control etc - posters on here and threads and much therapy were what helped me change my mindset and accept that girls I lived with were actually being raped and assaulted by grown adults

It was so widespread and misunderstood in my time - the kids say it's fine so nothing to worry about, and that attitude went to the heart of police forces and social services and support workers in children's homes and teachers in schools 💐

Blossomtoes · 12/07/2023 16:05

bellac11 · 12/07/2023 15:50

I think most people commenting on this, including you, just dont seem to grasp the issues around consent, choice, capacity and agency

If I dont consent to you making a report/claim on my behalf and using my personal information to do that, you cannot do it. You cant take my bank statements, my online information, my private photos, my email correspondence or texts or whatever and take them somewhere to show people, no matter how concerned you are. I have a choice about that assuming I have capacity.

So you and I can believe what we like or disbelieve what we like but the person right at the centre of this, the person everyone says they are concerned about, has had their voice taken away by people disregarding their view and statement. You might not want to hear it, you might think the statement came about incorrectly but it is their statement that they have a right to make.

Ive noticed comments like 'well you cant believe him he is groomed' or 'you cant believe him, he's a drug addict'

Would people be sayin the same thing if he was saying 'Im a victim of this man'?

Why is the disbelief only in one direction?

Spot on.

Calliecaterpillar · 12/07/2023 16:09

@bellac11 they can ofc and have a right to say it

But society has a duty to recognise that in grooming we cannot take the word of someone potentially exploited as true in that it has not harmed them

There's a duty morally with people who are able to see it - to not say "they say it's fine so let it be"

Sometimes people cannot safeguard themselves and need other members of society to do it for them bc they are too vulnerable to have that capacity

friendlycat · 12/07/2023 16:11

There are many complexities of this situation, firstly that the parents approached The Sun newspaper and presented them with whatever their evidence is.

Secondly, that it relates to a senior TV Presenter employed by the BBC a public funded corporation. With added complications of historical mishandling of situations with other employees.

Thirdly, that said employee has a role within the BBC where gravitas and a high level of professionalism is a requirement of the job. Due to the nature of his role he is open to a level of scrutiny (fairly or not) that others say presenting "Homes Under the Hammer" or "Saturday Kitchen" would not have levied on them. (Accepting though that 'lesser' presenters still have a duty of how they conduct themselves when employed by the BBC.)

Lastly, he may not actually have done anything actually illegal. But many find his behaviour extremely sleazy and sordid and unbefitting of his status. Trawling whatever sites he uses to make contact with youngsters forty years plus his junior and requesting and sharing sexual images is at best extremely seedy.

The fact that whatever evidence was presented to The Sun in the first place then set off this roller coaster ride.

I feel sorry for his family, and also his colleagues having to front all of this.
He made choices of his own activities. He could have made other choices such as recognising his sexuality (which in this day and age would have been fine), ending his marriage and perhaps looking for a different relationship of equals rather than trawling for much younger assumed men on the internet.

If he was a Pop Star I wouldn't "judge" as much as it would be my choice whether I actively purchase their music in whatever format. But I have no choice of paying for the BBC Licence fee. I would like people who have senior positions within that corporation to behave in an appropriate manner, call me old fashioned.

OP posts:
StefanosHill · 12/07/2023 16:12

FunandBlames · 12/07/2023 14:50

Safeguarding policy works both ways. For the protection of all - both the vulnerable and the person in the position of power. The moment you start doing things which step outside that you make a decision to expose yourself to risk.

👏👏👏

It's about protecting people from abuse.

It's about checks and balances.

It's so that those far and deep reaching interpersonal networks in organisations don't prevent people from speaking out about abuse. There is SO much abuse, everyday.

It's about minimising the oh so tempting abuse of power.

After all, if you are so adulated and in a job with influence where everyone is sucking up to you, you have more power than the average person. It's tempting then to think you're entitled to whatever you fancy and that you can get away with murder. Because you can, until someone speaks out.

Thank God for safeguarding. Those who used to get away with abuse in organisations have a much harder time of it now. Not that I feel sorry.

I do not feel sorry for any of those celebs, many just scratch each others backs.

It's all really rather depressing.

Yep. If someone feels untouchable, maybe think again about boundaries.

RedToothBrush · 12/07/2023 16:13

Sweetashunni · 12/07/2023 15:05

I think it carries huge weight. I think 90% of people have done something that would shock their family and friends if they knew.

There is a difference between shocking people and caring if you shock them though.

Tbh I think very often people do things like that precisely because they WANT to do something that would shock. It's not purely about the act itself, it's also about the act of shocking. That's the thrill part. It's the risk. If there was no risk they wouldn't do it in the first place.

And it's kinda stupid to think you are going to get away with it, when there's so many eyes on you.

To then complain when you've been caught out, isn't anyone else's fault but your own. You can't claim to be a victim.

Genuinely I think I'm pretty boring. And there's not much at all that I think would shock my friends and family because I'm honest and think if people don't like it, tough shit anyway. I am just not insecure in that way. In terms of my views I think I am capable of arguing the point well and fairly.

lemmein · 12/07/2023 16:14

I heard Jeremy Vine say earlier the presenter in question is 'really angry'.

The arrogance of these people is breathtaking!

pintery · 12/07/2023 16:15

*So you and I can believe what we like or disbelieve what we like but the person right at the centre of this, the person everyone says they are concerned about, has had their voice taken away by people disregarding their view and statement. You might not want to hear it, you might think the statement came about incorrectly but it is their statement that they have a right to make.

Ive noticed comments like 'well you cant believe him he is groomed' or 'you cant believe him, he's a drug addict'

Would people be sayin the same thing if he was saying 'Im a victim of this man'?

Why is the disbelief only in one direction?*

Welcome to mumsnet, where an estranged mother going to the papers without consent and no evidence produced => NAME THE PEDO

And the person themselves issuing a statement through a lawyer => A 17-20 YEAR OLD WOULD NEVER USE THAT WORD! WHY WOULD YOU BELIEVE A CRACKHEAD? IT'S GROOMING!

Calliecaterpillar · 12/07/2023 16:20

It's been reported the parents DID go to the police first

Then to the bbc

Finally to the Sun.

Desperate parents often do get estranged from their children if their children are being groomed.

The parents obviously have enough evidence to know it's happened and not enough evidence legally to make people act and help. So they've gone public to the court to public opinion to try and deal with it

Sweetashunni · 12/07/2023 16:24

Catstaps · 12/07/2023 15:57

A very good point. The young person may think there’s nothing wrong in it..now.. they may also possibly have feelings for this person if it’s gone on for years. They may feel very differently in the future when they are older and see more clearly. A very mature man targeting young adults on dating sites may not be illegal but morally it’s way off especially in his public position with his power and influence. Add to that the money payments. Sorry but it’s indefensible. He should resign and apologise.

We’re 3 years on. And he still doesn’t want to do anything about it. You all seem to want him to be suffering more than he is for some weird reason. Because it fits a narrative

user01082312345 · 12/07/2023 16:24

Anyone who goes to the media about such allegations doesn't have my respect. If a crime has been committed, then go to the police. Otherwise, seek help.

lemmein · 12/07/2023 16:25

Welcome to mumsnet, where an estranged mother going to the papers without consent and no evidence produced => NAME THE PEDO

@pintery It's interesting you have such an insight into mumsnet when according to AS you're a brand new poster who only appeared yesterday to discuss this subject.

Unless of course you're a name changer - which raises the question of why you'd feel the need to NC when posting about this. Bizarre really.

lemmein · 12/07/2023 16:26

user01082312345 · 12/07/2023 16:24

Anyone who goes to the media about such allegations doesn't have my respect. If a crime has been committed, then go to the police. Otherwise, seek help.

They did go to the police 🙄

user01082312345 · 12/07/2023 16:27

@lemmein yeah and didn't the police tell them no crime had been committed? So they thought it would be a good idea to go to the media?

lemmein · 12/07/2023 16:27

user01082312345 · 12/07/2023 16:27

@lemmein yeah and didn't the police tell them no crime had been committed? So they thought it would be a good idea to go to the media?

Seriously, read the thread.

bitnervousaboutthis · 12/07/2023 16:28

The parents did go to the police who said it wasn't a police matter, then they complained to the BBC (the presenter's employer) who didn't action it straight away and then they went to the press.

Calliecaterpillar · 12/07/2023 16:28

Some people clearly have very blessed lives not to have come across situations in which you GO to the police but the police have their hands tied unless you provide more than what you can to be able to investigate and build a case that would stand any chance of a prosecution

pintery · 12/07/2023 16:29

The parents obviously have enough evidence to know it's happened and not enough evidence legally to make people act and help.

I don't think that's obvious at all. The Sun won't even admit what evidence (if any) they have seen, let alone actually produce it.

What parent when thinking how to get their estranged adult child off drugs thinks, I know, I'll expose them to the tabloids as a drug addict and sex worker and use their private data without consent as evidence?

lemmein · 12/07/2023 16:30

What parent when thinking how to get their estranged adult child off drugs thinks, I know, I'll expose them to the tabloids as a drug addict and sex worker and use their private data without consent as evidence?

A desperate one?

pintery · 12/07/2023 16:31

lemmein · 12/07/2023 16:25

Welcome to mumsnet, where an estranged mother going to the papers without consent and no evidence produced => NAME THE PEDO

@pintery It's interesting you have such an insight into mumsnet when according to AS you're a brand new poster who only appeared yesterday to discuss this subject.

Unless of course you're a name changer - which raises the question of why you'd feel the need to NC when posting about this. Bizarre really.

Yes I name changed for this thread because I was going to talk about some relevant personal stuff, but have decided against it.

Feel free to check with HQ how long I have been on the site ofc.

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