Two dogs shot in London by police

[flowagurl]

I’m usually very empathetic and recently even posted on an animal testing post but I just can’t find any compassion in my heart for out of control and dangerous animals at the moment, it’s just getting ridiculous. I obviously feel for the owner who I hope gets some kind of mental support/ counselling.

It’s so confusing as I’m usually so compassionate, I guess having a small child and the number of dog attacks does something to your brain? I hate walking past Bullies with my baby in the pram. Even normal dogs I’m starting to get very hesitant about. For context I usually cry if I step on a silver worm in the bathroom so this is a very strange reaction for me.

Interested to hear what other dog owning/ non dog owning people think. Also the government are going to have to step in at some point right?

It's amazing the cognitive dissonance displayed here. The owner is being prosecuted for breaking the law, which looks to be clearly met, and people are still going on about how unreasonable the police were.

What this suggests is a lot of dog owners do not know what the law is that applies to them, and enforcement of it is a shock. Why the surprise?

When you watch the videos the dogs are barking but they’re wagging their tails.

Tail wagging is not always a friendly signal. It's a common mistake to think that, but to evaluate it properly you need to read the complete body language of the dog.

You should know that, if you have dogs and your 'conclusion" is quite worthless.

Pleased to hear that the IOPC, Independent Office of Police Conduct, will launch a full investigation into the actions of the police in shooting Marshall and Millions in London.
The IOPC will look at whether the police actions were reasonable and proportionate, we believe they were unreasonable and disproportionate. This investigation is a direct result of public pressure.
Thank you to everyone who wrote complaints, signed petitions and expressed their horror and outrage at the tragic incident. The husband of the lady who was alleged to have been attacked by these dogs has confirmed that she was NOT injured by them. He confirms that her dog sustained an injury and she had hurt her leg when she tripped over the dogs leads.
Shooting dogs which are on a lead and have not bitten anyone is unacceptable. We need accountability in our policing and policies.

I didn't see any movement after the first dog was shot - I didn't watch the second.

There certainly is!

A bite can be anything from an accidental nip to a deliberate snap that connects but is intended as a warning.

A "mauling" is intentional, determined, often prolonged and difficult to stop - a mauling causes serious injury, often life-threatening.

huge mastiff cane corso

This is one of the breeds which are not suitable for a pet home IMO.

They need experienced owners who know how to train and discipline what is effectively a "war" dog - they have their origins in the dogs which were used as weapons by the Roman legionaries. Their modern-day use is as guards.

They may be safe in the right hands, but personally I would never keep a dog that I couldn't physically hold back from a fight. Not many people could restrain a dog like this.

Just seen one of the typical owners now
Called his dog a fi king wanker for having a poo, and has just left it in the middle of the pavement, no bags to pick it up. Dog not on a lead and it's metres from the main B road
I asked if he wanted a bag and he told me to fuck off. Pleasant guy

A wagging tail can mean any number of things including arousal, excitement and in some cases aggression. Often a high fast wagging tail signals stress and an aggressive response. It does not always mean a dog is friendly or happy…

Absolutely, and I'm finding it very worrying that a dog owner doesn't seem to understand this.

If they wait until an attack is actually in progress, then a) someone WILL be bitten, b) the chances are the victim will get shot rather than the dog (fights/ attacks are active - the attacking dog, pulls, shakes, drags, leaps about; the victim tries to fend them off, crawl away etc and c) when the dog IS shot, it is very unlikely to be a clean kill, just because the marksman can't get a clear shot in and the target is moving.

The owner has previously been banned for having three dogs that killed someone's beloved pet dog.

Thank you @oakleaffy - I'd read that he was banned from keeping dogs, but not why.

When you watch the videos the dogs are barking but they’re wagging their tails.

Dogs which are excited at the prospect of a fight/ kill often wag their tails. They are anticipating a "fun" time.

We will never know if these animals would have attacked any of the officers - quite rightly they weren't given the opportunity - but they were definitely over-excited (possibly by their encounter with the other dog earlier) and this excitement was ramped up by the confrontation of their owner with the police. Their instinct would be to protect the owner, so they could well have bitten, but even an over-excited, playful "nip" from a dog like this hurts and could require stitches. If hands are bitten even a small bite can leave someone incapacitated - hand anatomy is very complex and severed tendons can't be repaired to the extent that full movement returns.

That's awful @FrostyFifi - poor little dog. And poor owner! I've experienced the physical shock of having a dog bitten by another and it is awful.

Akitas are another very powerful, fighting breed. Dogs like this need owners who know what they are doing, but are so often owned by idiots who just like the look of them.

Dogs on the streets charity have stated that they were aware of these dogs but can’t comment further, that one of the dogs was a client of theirs and just 9 months old! I believe they’re helping the owner but aren’t going to comment further.

I’m following Dominic Dyer on Twitter who has posted an article where the woman ‘attacked’ didn’t want the police called before the shooting.

The dogs had been put under a highly stressful situation and while I agree that tail wagging doesn’t necessarily mean happy, many dogs not normally aggressive might also take this stance. They would have been scared having aggressive police officers standing over them and tasering their owner!

I still can’t get the picture of the cowering dog out of my head, horrendous!

And why was one dog restrained and then let go?

Need to see ALL police cam footage.

The owner does need to take responsibility too.

Yanbu, covid has turned dogs into a menace to society and i say that as a dog owner! Mine stay on leads and i pick up all poops, soul destroying to see others behaving so irresponsibly

Sick of people here saying:

’ the dogs weren’t on a lead ‘

’The dog was shot dead instantly’

’the dogs were aggressive ‘

https://twitter.com/finjisan/status/1656412677399277571?s=20

watch this video:

• you can see the dogs are not behaving aggressively - they are walking away from the police with their owner .

— the police surround them with guns which understandably scares the dogs and causes them to bark — the dogs are on leads : you can see the poor second dog is still on the lead attached to the first dog that was shot — the second dog is clearly terrified (tethered to his dead friend ) and tried to run away from the police back to his owner and was shot in the back

-you can see the first dog is still moving after it was shot

the entire thing is disgusting . They did not attack anybody. Their leads were tangled with another dog’s - this happens several times when I walk my dog. There was no justification to murder these dogs

Why is all your sympathy reserved for these dogs and none for the dog they attacked and injured? Taking into account the fact this man is banned from keeping dogs because his last set killed someone else's pet dog, it's clear that this man keeps dogs that are a danger to others. It's also clear from the video of him having these dogs take up seats on the tube that he is a terrible, irresponsible owner whose dogs pose a risk. He's not prepared to control or restrain them, or manage them appropriately in public and here is the consequence.

He let his dogs sit on empty tube seats and he’s a terrible dog owner and his dogs deserve to be shot dead? Really? Can’t see anyone on the tube appearing intimidated by them can you? Can’t see them behaving aggressively on the tube can you?

what information exactly do you have about the dog that supposedly attacked and injured? The dogs leads were tangled that is all. The owner of the smaller dog was crying about the fact these dogs were killed.

They were illegal dogs. Do you want the police to wait until they maim or kill someone before taking action?

@Emotionalsupportviper luckily the wee thing did survive in this case but someone's beloved little companian breed dog in general will not stand a chance against an XL Bully or an Akita. I'm honestly not sure what the answer is.

How were the dogs illegal? Sorry, but I cannot agree with this.

@Florenz they aren’t illegal dogs. Dear me

He's banned from owning dogs because his previous dogs killed someone else's so yes, he is a terrible dog owner.

The fact he has his dogs taking up tube seats also indicates his selfish disregard for others - dogs don't go on seats on public transport for very good reasons and decent owners comply with this. That's all dogs, not just aggressive ones (aggressive dogs shouldn't be on public transport at all). Any owner behaving as he was on that tube carriage is a bad owner, whatever the dog breed in question.

It was certainly reported that the dogs attacked another dog rather than just getting leads tangled, and that the smaller dog was injured.

Whether the other dog owner was crying or not, dogs out of control in public places shouldn't get the chance to attack before they're dealt with and if you choose to own enormous, strong dogs that are capable of causing significant harm then your definition of under control might have to be stricter than owners of other types of dog.