Eleanor Williams gets 8 years

[YNK]

Is this the right length of sentence to reflect the damage done?

"Rape carries a maximum life sentence, starting point is 5 years. Rapists are treated as pariahs in prison. This woman ruined lives."

Are they fuck. Pariahs 🤣🤣 deluded

This^

She hit herself in the FACE with a HAMMER to prove a lie. That is 100% a signal of serious mental instability. This woman needs psychological help. Yes, she clearly hurt people. Yes, she lied. Yes, she needed to be stopped. I don’t disagree with the sentence. Although I am disturbed that she started making her accusations as a child and this doesn’t appear to have been taken into account.

But it makes me sick that we live in a society that punishes a crazy woman more harshly than actual rapists and child molesters.

And I do not agree that she is responsible for the knock-on effects in Barrow. Tommy R and his rent-a-mob goons are solely responsible for their demonstrations. As are those who targeted violence at the men who were falsely accused.

I hope all the affected families recover quickly.

SorryAuntLydia yes.

And I do not agree that she is responsible for the knock-on effects in Barrow. Tommy R and his rent-a-mob goons are solely responsible for their demonstrations. As are those who targeted violence at the men who were falsely

So those mobs would have attacked those men and their family homes if she hasn't made those false accusations?

Of course she's responsible. She knew what she was doing, she encouraged that behaviour and she continued her lies even as she watched all this happen.

How can you even say otherwise? The lack of logic and the determination to defend a woman at all costs on this thread is absolutely shocking. Not to mention the implied racism.

Saraclara: So those mobs would have attacked those men and their family homes if she hasn't made those false accusations?

well, yes, or if not them, others like them, because they are racist scum looking for any excuse. Violent idiots who take the law into their own hands are responsible for their own actions - this woman did not make them do it.

No, but she gave them an excuse to

I am very angry at the damage she has done to the public conversation about rape and believing women.

Have found via a person close to me that this does happen - and it's despicable. Not as despicable as rape obviously, but its so messed up.

I followed this story for a while after I originally saw the Facebook post Ellie made containing photos of her injuries and numerous accusations of rapes and human trafficking. I admit, seeing her injuries I was taken in at first.

Then of course, increasing evidence comes out about her causing her own injuries, faking text messages and Snapchats, cctv is found of her at times she says she was being raped etc. She tells police she was trafficked to Amsterdam when she was actually on holiday with her sister. Then says she was sent to ibiza and gang raped until she realises police can check her travel records and admits that's a lie too.

She absolutely deserves that 8 year sentence. She has destroyed a number of innocent men with her false accusations. Not to mention done a number on women everywhere who might already be worried about reporting sex attacks. The police time and resource she has wasted is incredible.

That being said, she is obviously dealing with mental issues. She has also had substance abuse issues too, so I do hope she gets help.

Something I don't think I've seen mentioned, is that her mother Allison set up a page to accept donations for "Ellies pursuit of justice" against her "attackers". It raised £22,000. Given the evidence and outcome of the trial people are asking for the money to be given to a women's charity, rather than allowing Ellie to access it. At the moment, Allison is refusing to do anything with the money. She says she needs time to think 🤨

But it makes me sick that we live in a society that punishes a crazy woman more harshly than actual rapists and child molesters.

As someone who works in an adjacent field, I've always been convinced that all criminals (including rapists and child molesters) have some sort of mental illness. I've never agreed when people say "that's not mental illness, that's just someone being an arsehole", as if it's only mental illness if it's "harmless" and "acceptable" up to a point. True mental illness is demonic.

I also find it very interesting that so many on MN are still on Ellie William's side. Clearly, the innocent white girl "halo" effect remains strong!

Imagining, for example, if the roles were reversed: a Pakistani man knowingly ruining the promising lives of 3 young women, forcing them out of careers and their homes, and into suicide attempts. MN would wish absolute death upon him.

I think probably even the "hit himself in the face with a hammer" point would be just used by people to write him off as a sick manipulative fuck, rather than evidence of him needing forgiveness and gentle help. Or even if he were, say, a Bangaldeshi woman – there isn't a lot of sympathy for (random example) Shamima Begum's clearly mental unwell motivations.

Was quoting @SorryAuntLydia above! I think rapists, this girl, child molesters, and Tommy R are all mentally unwell tbh.

Many in some more well-off and advanced country (Nordic countries maybe? where murderers are afforded gentle rehabilitation), all of them would be offered the help they need instead of punished. As it stands, in British society the most expedient way to handle these threats to society are to lock them up.

I think probably even the "hit himself in the face with a hammer" point would be just used by people to write him off as a sick manipulative fuck, rather than evidence of him needing forgiveness and gentle help.

Without a doubt. MN is full of hypocrisy and totally lacking in logic a lot of the time.

I agree with this.
If it was a man and not a woman, it definitely would be a case of "hink probably even the "hit himself in the face with a hammer" point would be just used by people to write him off as a sick manipulative fuck, rather than evidence of him needing forgiveness and gentle help
Complete double standards on here as usual, a man doing what she did would not be "oh he needs help".
Your white comment is an interesting one too.
Reminds me of when white people have committed terrorist attacks.
They don't get reported to as such as referred to as them.
They're referred to along the lines of being mentally unwell.

*Although I am disturbed that she started making her accusations as a child and this doesn't appear to have been taken into account.
*
I was actually impressed at how clear the judge was in his sentencing and how the total was accrued. He explained his sentencing for each count and for the allegations she made as a juvenile, took her age into account and sentenced accordingly.
On later counts he had to give credit for an early guilty plea and he also said on some of the counts he reduced the sentence where there was some mitigation (he didn't specify what, but perhaps acknowledging some evident mental health issues?). He balanced this against aggravating factors such as lack of remorse and also that the allegations were pre-planned as evidenced by her buying the hammer etc.
I think the fact that some of the sentences were given as consecutive rather than concurrent shows that the judge felt the offences warranted the maximum penalties he could give within sentencing guidelines.

This is exactly why I hate being in the judicial system.

I've had enough. I'm looking for my exit . The sentence was justified.

Christ almighty. She isn’t mentally ill. If you don’t believe two psychiatrists, who do you think is qualified to give an opinion on it? Stop minimising what she did. She did it knowingly and sanely. She picked her victims and planned how to try and leave an evidence trail to back up her lies and went out and purchased a hammer to try and give her accusations some weight. She wasn’t mentally ill when she did any of that. She knew exactly what she was doing. She admitted some of her lies at interview and continues to lie about other elements of her crimes. She is totally unrepentant. She doesn’t believe she was abused and she never did believe it. She knows she made it all up.

Restinggoddess · 14/03/2023 19:20it

She just made it even harder for those who have been raped to get justice - at a time if all time low conviction rates

Tragically, that is bound to be the case. False allegations are very, very low indeed, but some of the papers love to make hay with them.

Look at the Mail BTL comments, any time a man is found not guilty of rape; it's all "Send the lying bitch down for as long as he would have got." Many people don't understand the difference between being unable to prove an allegation and committing a perversion of justice.

Perhaps a big sentence handed out to discourage women from going to the police to report sex offences.

am very angry at the damage she has done to the public conversation about rape and believing women

The damage that one person did all by herself??

Meanwhile the damage done to men by the statistical prevalence of male involvement in violence, crime and almost-whole cause of sexual violence is…??

One damaged woman is not the cause of male arrogance and entitlement.

Men look for an excuse to treat females like shit, aided and abetted by all social institutions and also, most regrettably, by women themselves. When they fall for the marketing rubbish telling us all girls should worry about is their looks, and that the standard for good looks should be set by porn stars and directors, and mostly when, again and again, they expect better standards of behaviour from female victims than they do of male perpetrators.

And yes, I heard myself there. The marketing industry aimed at women needs feminist analysis and attack all over again. All the work of feminism has been undone.

No, it isn't.
She has more than devasted 3 lives, and buggered up many more
Ifa man had done this, MN would be off the scale hysterics. Just becausexshe is female doesn't mean she should be excused this trail of horror she has left.
She deserved far longer

Men do this every week. Many cases dont even get reported.

this is not the question.
Why turn this back to men
She commited a henious, vile crime wgich she knew would garner sympathy,. She manipulated people, she lied and left a trail of devastation
Think on that and her paltey sentence as the OP asked and then start a thread about crap sentencing if you must

RosaGallica · Today 06:30

Men do this every week. Many cases dont even get reported.

Her case is getting a lot of attention, because it is so unusual and that makes it newsworthy; "Man Bites Dog." Unfortunately, there are many for whom this is red meat, making them feel that they have the right to claim that women who've been raped, but are unable to prove their case were "making it up, they all do."

bizclass, I am interested in reading your hunch re mental ill health and socially deviant behaviour which harms others. I too work in a field where this is a recurring theme, and a common thread is definitely mental ill health. I look at so many people I come across professionally, deemed to be 'just an arsehole', and feel convinced that if they were not in some way damaged, distressed or unwell (often very obviously) they wouldn't be causing harm.
This is obviously not to say that those of us who suffer with poor mental health (lots of depression and anxiety in my extended family) are predisposed to cause harm.

I thought there was something decidedly not true about Ellies allegations from when it first did the rounds on FB and MN. Based on my professional experience.
I left MN because of the way I, and other people (and MN mods) suggesting caution be exercised were attacked. Plus it was during covid and MN wasn't a healthy place for me at the time.
I think the sentence reflects the severity of the case. This was going on for years with i'm sure, lots of intervention offered to Ellie over that time and she persisted in making up allegations. Even after being charged.
I did wonder if she had a persistent delusional disorder but I would assume that would have been explored during her psychiatric assessments.
In 25 years of my career I've known a handful of cases like Ellies but 1000s of women who were raped and were telling the truth and did not see justice.
It's easy to assume there must be some kind of mental disorder but that's not always the case.
We want to make sense of it but I've come to the conclusion over the years that often, we just don't or can't know why. And our own morality or views of the world just aren't the same as some others and we can't come to any satisfactory conclusion which will make us feel better.
And that's why these cases are so damaging because doubt will always persist.
The men accused will always have some people thinking differently (negatively) about them. And some people will always think something must have happened to Ellie to make her do this, that there must be some truth somewhere or that she must be suffering from some kind of mental health problem, even if one is not diagnosed.