Canada Assisted Dying Shitshow

[antelopevalley]

Anyone else been following what is happening in Canada around assisted dying? Lots of issues with mentally ill and depressed people being helped to kill themselves and assisted dying in some cases being pushed on disabled people. Below is a screenshot from the latest awful story.

This is what worries me about assisted dying, how it is implemented in practice. I remember how awful the Liverpool Pathway was that was supposed to make dying patients' last days more comfortable, and instead led to people who may have recovered being starved to death.

But people with dementia do not just go from perfectly fine to not knowing who anyone is. There can be years where if you continue with a low stress routine you can appear fine to casual acquaintances and have a happy life.

The other side to the story is people who commit suicide because they don’t trust the state to treat them with the dignity that they want. So take matters into their own hands, or put family members in an awful position and asking them to assist.

www.carehome.co.uk/news/amp/article/id/1585042/Ex-judge-committed-care-home-suicide-believing-his-time-was-over-after-getting-dementia-diagnosis

www.cps.gov.uk/north-west/news/greater-manchester-man-found-guilty-killing-his-terminally-ill-wife

I also think that we have become obsessed with the length of our lives rather than the quality of it.
For example, someone I know has a relative who is in her 90s and has been offered open heart surgery.
Maybe we need to take a step back and ask how long we opt to intervene, treat and operate, before we start talking about actively killing.

every province will have a similar version
this is the one for BC
www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/health/accessing-health-care/home-community-care/care-options-and-cost/end-of-life-care/medical-assistance-in-dying
i would NOT recommend you get the info on assisted dying from any news source but instead look up the info by province the government web sites are easy to navigate.
as for medical tx, Canada makes almost all medical treatments available at zero cost. occasionally some unproven tx are NOT covered but if a person chooses to go to another country their medical costs can be claimed on income tax (partially refunded).

I do not trust this would be done well in the UK. People in chronic pain who just need better painkillers but are struggling to access them often say they just want to die.

A colleagues father has cancer and he’s currently dying a very painful death. He has Macmillan nurses, but is still in pain- has a few more weeks to suffer before he dies. He would like to go now, he’s said his goodbyes, affairs are in Order. He can’t eat, he can’t move, he’s asleep most of the time. He has nothing to look forward to apart from a slow painful death.

@fallfallfall I am sure the original intentions of the Canadian legislation were good. It is how it is being put into practice that is the issue.

I have always been really for this but actually from the stories coming out it sounds really concerning, I was watching a story of a man that wasn't being given treatment the only offer to him was the assisted dying approach, he didn't want that.
It was quite chilling listening to the recording.
I think we seem to be going to the extremes of everything in the world now, common sense feels like it's being lost.

@Suzi888 There is no need for anyone with cancer to die in pain. I have seen relatives die very peacefully.

You can make an advanced directive.

although currently you wouldn't be able to specify euthanasia as part of it you could clearly indicate you didn't want any life prolonging interventions once you lost capacity.

so for example your advanced directive could state you didn't want antibiotics if you got a chest infection/pneumonia, didn't want treating other than for pain management for other conditions etc and wanted to remain at home/care home with pain relief and palliative care rather than having a hospital admission for e.g suspected strokes, heart attacks etc.

@antelopevalley it's been in practice for years. ten or more at least.
on the whole it's offered and done in a very dignified manner with many people involved.

I would argue that his pain relief needs to be reviewed. Unfortunately there can be a culture of “clockwatching” for dosing intervals for pain meds. If the patient is in pain, then more meds are required, or something else added into the mix- someone who is terminal is not at risk of drug dependence ffs.

Look up the statistics on 'organ harvesting after euthanasia'.

Is this the future? You get sick but cannot afford to access health care so opt for death...but hey...your organs can go to those with sufficient money to pay

(organ donation after euthanasia is performed in Belgium, the Netherlands, Spain, and Canada)

All the people saying they agree with assisted dying - have you read the article in the OP? This isn't about end of life decisions, it is about the misuse of euthanasia laws targetting the disabled in Canada.

I watched an interview with Christine Gautier, the disabled paralympian from the article. She was asking for a proper wheelchair stairlift to be installed which ought to be supplied by the local authority. She was told they couldn't help her with that but that "if her life was getting unbearable due to not having the stairlift", they could offer her assisted dying.

Tell me, in what way is that not pure eugenics? Tell me how it is morally acceptable to even SAY that to someone!

I fully accept there is a conversation to be had about improving end of life care - I have seen the impact of Parkinsons in my family and it is horrendous. This is not it. This is deliberately under-serving the disabled in the hopes they'd prefer to off themselves than continue to suffer and there are multiple cases being reported.

I saw an interview with a man whose brother had a depressive episode and ended up being euthanised just days after asking for it. Utterly heart breaking as the family got shut out of the whole process.
This is not what assisted dying/euthanasia should be for.

@antelopevalley what is fascinating and worrying to see is that clearly in Canada the system isn’t working. People are dying for reasons other than the original intention of the rules.
Yet many people don’t learn from it. Instead they say: oh it wouldn’t happen here, or you must be wrong, or daily mail, etc.
Yet our health care system is on its knees. So if euthanasia is introduced in the UK it would likely become extremely similar to Canada if not worse. In Society those with limited economic power/influence are usually the first to suffer. Why should it be any difference with euthanasia?
Reduce the value of human life and nothing good ever follows.

The mental illness clause hasn't been enacted yet in Canada so no one has chosen or being talked into choosing assisted death due to mental illness. It is set to come in next March.

There are multiple criteria, multiple assessments, and strict exclusion criteria for the current process. You can't believe everything you read - some of it is being driven by people with disabilities who are fighting for higher disability payments and trying to say they will all choose or be forced to choose euthanasia if the government doesn't give them more money. However one of the exclusion causes is that the suffering can not be relieved by resources and that all avenues for treatment and resources have been fully exhausted (this is more people who are not terminally ill).

www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/medical-assistance-dying/annual-report-2021.html

Report on actual cases from 2021

Thi is 100% not a true story if it supposedly happened in Canada.

I'm perfectly well as far as I know, and if I chose to end my life tomorrow for whatever reason, that should be my right. My body, my choice. Obviously I do have that right and choice. But the endings open to me are not ideal. Life is not sacred. Inflicting it on someone who doesn't want it is controlling and barbaric.

I disagree with this, my DF has dementia and he is in a state of mental torture every day, he knows who we are, but has forgotten how to change the tv channel, how to make a cup of tea, basic things that we take for granted. He is always talking about being a burden and how we would all be better off without him. It's fucking cruel to leave people in this way with little to no quality of life.

It was in Canada, and I am not sure why a bereaved man would be making this up.

Euthanasia related to mental illness is currently illegal in Canada and no MAID assessor would submit a written application for an illegal procedure, no healthcare professional would sign off on the assessment, and no doctor would administer it. All of them would be fired and lose their licenses.

When the legislation came into effect, an exclusion clause for mental illness was put in place to allow for additional research and planning. The report was released this year and the exclusion clause will be lifted in March 2023.

It didn't happen.

We should have the option. End of.

Daily Mail is not reputable

www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/medical-assistance-dying.html
bereaved family members are often unaware of the full medical history and underlying illnesses.