So what is the answer to the migrant crisis?

[fucketyfuckwit]

Just had a conversation with DH about the migrant crisis.

DH is more left wing than me (I'm more in the middle). I asked him to explain what he thinks about the migrant crisis that is in the news (as in people coming over in dinghies into Kent).

He said that we should support them as they often bring us skills and will eventually work and pay taxes.

I get that historically immigration had resulted in this but can't help but think that firstly, this country is on its knees and can't cope having to support these people and also that the I don't believe all these people have skills to offer us.

I know we lost a large number of farm workers etc through Brexit,

Without jumping on me and calling me a bigot etc can anyone please help me explain why we shouldn't just be sending them straight back?

Please just help me to understand.

@Sigma33 you don’t really address any points. We do have a system for skilled migrants, it’s called applying for a visa. Not getting on a rubber dinghy, throwing your passport in the sea and then expecting to be housed and fed.

Because the government is failing. Don't blame the asylum seekers for the failures of government

Use the Australian method. Put them all on a detention island, processed according to kids+mothers first, all others first in first out. Make the island pretty unpalatable. Don't make ANY exceptions. You're a refugee, you're on the island and if you're not, you're on a plane home.

Must asylum seekers be on UK soil when applying? is it a requisite?

Yes, and friend has moved to the UK as a qualified social worker under that system.

There are also refugees who are not in a position to use those channels

Yes, unfortunately. Ideally there would be other channels, I have friends resettled in Canada for example. In practice the UK is so immigrant averse there are no realistic other channels, which is a big factor in coming in through trafficking

Either that, or the suggestion above, allocate them all into rich communities and into excellent schools and see what happens at the political level once the ruling handwringing classes are actually affected.

@Sigma33 there should be speedier processing, but the appeals process slows this down considerably. This makes the uk a better place to claim asylum then other countries in Europe. We accept about 70% compared to about 20% in France. But I see you are a person that thinks all illegal immigration on small boats is good, anyone concerned about the cost to the tax payer is Britain first and the problem is the is the tories not sorting out the asylum process for 40,000 people in a year that should not, in most cases, be here as they are not fleeing persecution but coming for economic reasons.

The appeals process is often slow due to significant underfunding of the court system. (Incidentally, this is also why victims of crime are waiting years for their attackers to be put on trial. Both have the same root cause - a government who simply do not give a stuff about those struggling to access the court system.)

If you don’t want people to think you are Britain First it would be best to stop conflating illegal immigration with perfectly legal asylum claims. According to international treaties we are signed up to, asylum seekers have every right to travel here to claim asylum, even if they pass through a “safe” country to do get here. We could back out of those treaties, but that would have significant diplomatic (and therefore economic) consequences.

Those who are falsely claiming asylum should be deported quickly. Those who are genuine should be settled quickly. Both of which would massively reduce the spending on accommodation and subsidence for claimants. The ultimate problem is a point blank refusal to process claims in good time.

I don't know what the solution is, but we should not be encouraging them. If you speed things up and allow more people to settle, that won't solve things. On the contrary, it will make them much worse. Instead of 10,000 trying to cross, you will have 50,000. And if you let in those 50,000, and find them somewhere nice to live, the following year it will be 60,000 or 70,000. You can't blame them. If I lived somewhere poor and corrupt, and someone told me the UK was opening its doors, then my cousin texted me a photo of himself in a nice hotel, I'd pack my bags as well.

This problem isn't going away. Africa has the highest birth rate in the world. In fact, its birth rate is so high the population is going to double by 2050. When climate change gets worse, that booming young population will head for Europe. Like I said, I have no answers. All I know is this country is already crowded. I live in rural Essex, and it's awful. The traffic is so bad we'll end up having to book time slots to use the roads. Everywhere I go there are horrible new estates being built, crammed with ghastly rabbit hutch 'houses'. Indeed, as I type, two new estates are being built at either end of my village - on fields where I used to walk my dog and de-stress after work. In fact, the population of my small market town has doubled since 2000. Will it double again? During the heatwave, I sat at my kitchen table and sobbed, just totally overwhelmed with the heat and noise and traffic. I utterly dread the future, I can tell you that.

And by the way, if these people are refugees, where are the women and children? All I ever see are boatloads of fit young men. Where are the old people? Where are the women and kids? Have they been left behind to face the "war and persecution"?

The labelling happens because of the ignorance displayed especially when you say things like "What’s not to like??".

The UK is a favoured destination (and I won't deny that it is) because it is English speaking, because many migrants have family here and because of colonial links.

Why do you think France is full of North Africans?

Yup, and let's please also have the sexual abuse of women and children and the high suicide rates that are common on Australian detention islands. Good fun for everyone!!

of course people should be allowed to appeal - currently about 1/3 initial decisions are allowed as wrong! that is life and death!

If you went to prison (not life and death) wouldn't you expect the right of appeal?

I am sorry (not) to those who believe being born British makes them special and exempt from the rest of the world. I recognise I could have been born anywhere in the world, and think about what I would try to do if born in Afghanistan etc

I don't condemn anyone trying to escape being murderred

I do think our government should have a system that deals with immigrants efficiently and effectively

it is not 'letting them in'

by the way, using the word 'them' says a lot about you

It is about dealing with claims quickly and fairly.

Genuine refugees are admitted and helped to settle, those who are not are deported

Several years ago I presented myself to the local council with my 2 year old son as I was officially classed as ‘homeless’. The very kind lady at the office said to me are you pregnant, I said no are you on drugs, no then I’m sorry you won’t be getting a council house anytime soon and we have to save a certain amount of housing as a priority for our ‘foreign friends’. This is my homeland born and raised all my life.

I totally agree something needs to be done to help those that are fleeing violence and persecution and there needs to be a safe route and to be processed as soon as possible. However, only if they seek asylum via the correct channel and that does not mean illegally crossing the English Channel. Anyone entering the country via illegal routes SHOULD NOT be processed, all it is doing is encouraging people to risk their lives and the boat gangs to profit from those that are vulnerable and desperate. There needs to be a clear message that this is no longer an option and no longer an easy money ‘career’ for the boat gangs. This is ridiculous and has to stop.

For economic immigrants this is different altogether and should apply through the normal route. I would love to immigrate to USA or Canada or Australia but I can’t just rock up in a boat and hope for the best.

Thing is its really hard to come via legal routes and claim asylum . Ok some are economic migrants but some are asylum seekers.

On the economic migrant front I can actually understand why younger men come over here as there's eff all opportunities in their own countries. I'd probably do the same.

We should work together to make the world fairer rather than talk about deprtation, dumping them on islands etc

I’m sorry you won’t be getting a council house anytime soon and we have to save a certain amount of housing as a priority for our ‘foreign friends’

Lack of social housing is a decision made by successive governments (Labour and Conservative) over the past 40 years. Even if there were zero asylum seekers and zero refugees there would still be nowhere near enough. Because new developments don’t have sufficient provision of affordable housing or social housing and councils are not required to replace housing stock depleted due to “right to buy”. Near me, the cheapest 3 bed in a new development is £350k, while I’m looking to be a FTB (at nearly 40yo) on an older 3 bed house, in a nicer area for £200k. Of all things, lack of housing is the last which can be reasonably placed at the feet of asylum seekers and refugees.

However, only if they seek asylum via the correct channel and that does not mean illegally crossing the English Channel.

Crossing the channel to seek asylum is not illegal under under international law (which is the bit which applies in international waters). It is unsafe, certainly. But not illegal. And there are precious few safe routes for claiming asylum.

That's due to the decisions made by UK governments, chosen by UK voters.

Not our 'foreign friends'.

Who have you voted for? The party promising decent housing for all?

There are no ILLEGAL routes for claiming asylum. There are legal routes for processing those claims, which should have a process for legal review - presumably if your life was at stake you would want a right of appeal?

The fact that the asylum system has an enormous backlog is not the fault of people claiming asylum. It is the result of the decisions of the elected governments of the UK, who have chosen to make a scapegoat of the people reaching the UK rather than admit to their own failings

Can asylum seekers fly to the UK on a tourist visa and claim asylum when they land? Is this option not available to them? Lack of money can’t be the reason as they do have money to pay the smugglers.

(I guess the answer is that they are denied tourists visas)

Those are some of the costs of the system. The benefits, however, are significant. Trafficking fallen almost to zero. People processed in place, at a regular rate, allowing for their arrival in Australia to be planned. No homeless new immigrants.

Plus, I don't know all the details but I suspect that if there's sexual abuse of women on detention islands, then it is happening because of the 'quality' of the men trying to get into Australia. The fact that they're sexually violent suggests to me that it is a good thing they've been stopped prior to getting to the border.

We should work together to make the world fairer rather than talk about deprtation, dumping them on islands etc

PMSL. Since when has the world been fair? Does the world get fairer if we dramatically reduce the quality of life for those in safe stable countries, in order to let in a small proportion of hopefuls from sh*tholes?

I completely agree with you @TisUnbelievable

By allowing people to stay who cross the channel illegally, it is sending a clear message that this is a successful way to get into the country. This encourages more people to then pay criminal gangs to cross the channel and the cycle will never end.

The only way it will stop is if the country toughens up its boarders and anyone who enters the country illegally should be sent back home. Then people will stop paying the criminal gangs, because they know there’s no point. We need to encourage people to apply for visas and do it legally. This madness has to stop…

Absolutely. Also as the climate change impact is felt more and more severely, populations displaced by drought, famine, flooding etc will migrate in their millions.

If you want people to stop calling you a bigot maybe don't voice bigoted views...
Love to know how many of you have Irish surnames. Or was that mass exodus of people ok? Think about how the British thought of the Irish in the 1800's

• big families
• stupid
• unskilled

Ring any bells? Unlike most of the 'protec the NHS' brigade on here, I actually work in an NHS hospital. My dad was an asylum seeker. He would have got an a boat no doubt about it. After the government murders one of your brothers, you would probably consider most alternatives. He also left his mum and sisters behind because it is what they wanted. If most of us had the choice, we would want at least one of our children to survive. And if our culture promoted daughters looking after mothers then we would also stay behind and let our brothers go, in the hope of sending money back or being able to earn enough to take us all with them. So if you become seriously ill in Britain today, chances are you will meet some migrants or their children. Namely me! Or the people of Somali, Ethiopian, Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi or Central American descent I work with. People want to come to Britain to work. British people don't want to work in the NHS anymore. What is the solution?

''@Flaunch · Yesterday 21:32
Put them all on a plane and sent them straight back where they came from.''

It didn't take long for some people to show their true colours...

Claiming asylum is not illegal and the UK has to take a fair share of claimants like all the other EU countries. We should assess them quickly and in a way which is humane and then welcome those who qualify.

That is what civilised nations do, especially those who have a history of colonialism.

I personally would prefer to see our home-grown bigots, racists and xenophobes put on a plane and send to a remote desert island. We would then have a much less toxic atmosphere in this country....