DH using toilet for DT’s when out

[Silverbirch123]

I have NC for this but I’m a regular poster

We have 3 year old twin girls. If we’re out (or he takes them out on his own) for the day and my DH has to take one (or both) of our girls to the toilet he’s started using the ladies (not always just sometimes)

The reason he says for this is that the mens toilets are usually really grotty. He went somewhere a couple of weeks ago where there was only 1 cubicle, and several men using the urinals. He pushed the door open and there was a guy sitting on the toilet who hadn’t locked the door 🤮

He immediately came out and used the ladies. No one has ever said anything to him but I’ve suggested that in those circumstances he uses the disabled, but that’s not always possible if you need a special key to open them.

i darent post this in AIBU but given the circumstances above would you DH’s do the same? I’m keen for my DH not to cause offence by using the ladies but I’m also keen for my DD’s not being subjected to filthy toilets and grown men not shutting the doors when they’re having a poo 💩

I would also suggest he could knock on the ladies door and ask if anyone minds him bringing his girls in there. People can say no if they are uncomfortable with it.

Women here are saying no and that we’re uncomfortable with it. If a woman didn’t mind, then great, good for her. But lots of us do mind and our hard won right to a single sex space to pee in isn’t up for grabs, whatever the OP and her entitled husband think.

I had sons and used to take them into the ladies because the mens were grim and you heard stories of perverts loitering.

These days at some swimming pools it's unisex changing rooms. Now I'm quite bashful so have never wandered around naked in front of women let alone men. I'm the same with unisex changing rooms in clothing stores.

Thanks @Sirzy I had never know that this was an option. I wouldn’t do it unless he really needed it, but he does he’s so vulnerable.

Your DH may well be a perfectly decent person in other ways. But the misogynistic gender-identity movement have succeeded in breaking the long-established rule that men do not use women's facilities. So now the idea that "women's" means "for general use@" is sneaking into everyday life. And that puts all women and girls at risk, because it's an open door for sex predators.

Every man who uses a women's facility is actively helping sex predators.

It's not so much his discomfort as his daughters though?

Of course he shouldn't use the ladies. He isn't female.

If he's unhappy about the state of the gents, maybe he should start doing something about that. But the answer isn't coming into the ladies.

My H always took my daughters into the male loos - until they were old enough to go into the ladies on their own.

My DD is 8 and still struggles a bit with urgency (if she has to go, she has to go RIGHT NOW). DH will not take her in the ladies' because HE'S A BLOKE.
We have a mental map (as someone above) of all the loos in town. Hippy cafe - small men's with only one or two cubicles, he takes her in there. Library - single cubicle. Other cafes (Starbucks, Costa etc.) - single cubicle. M&S - mens, women's and disabled - he takes her in the disabled.
At 3 they may find it smelly but probably won't notice what anyone else is doing. At 8, my DD would notice but (I will ask him though) he would either ask her if she's OK going in the ladies (I think she copes with the hippy cafe one), or check it's empty before ushering her into a cubicle.

You really think an entitled man would take no for an answer?

”you fucking bitch. Trying to stop a little kid from going to the toilet. You should be ashamed of yourself”

It’s a parents job, male and female, to campaign for family spaces instead of the default always being to use the spaces that disabled people have campaigned for.

I don’t know if I’m right in summing up, but the general consensus OP seems to be that:

• it isn’t OK to just use the women’s without trying to find every other option, including going specifically to another toilet to find a single unisex one.


• if it is absolutely necessary and there is no other bathroom anywhere, then he has to understand that if he uses the women’s bathrooms he is compromising the privacy, dignity of women in there and making them feel unsafe

He should complain if the gents are filthy and complain if men are shitting with the door open. He shouldn’t be in the ladies and he should be stopping other men from going into the ladies because his daughters will be going by themselves in a few years and he very much wants toilets to be sex segregated when his girls start using them.
Most people know where the toilets that fit their needs are located. He needs to learn where they are not invade single sex spaces.

Neither does the dad in this scenario

And again, what about the discomfort he is causing to the other women and girls by his presence in a single sex intimate space?

Agree with pp, he shouldn't be going into the ladies, because he's a man.

Some options: have a google before going out, look for unisex/family bathrooms; or take them into the gents. He can't take them into the women's loos: those are for women.

I think this must all be a sign of the fear of men invading women's spaces, and the obsession with toilets, that is so embedded in mumsnet these days.

If you care about the comfort of adult women using a public toilet, you should also care about the comfort of a 3 year old girl.

Do you seriously think it's better to get a 3 year old girl to to use a disgusting toilet that would upset her and be gross, to 'just hold it', to put a nappy on, to be randomly supervised by a strange woman (because a strange woman has never hurt anyone, she doesn't have a penis, it's not physically possible). All instead of her dad shouting through to the ladies loos "my daughter needs to pee, can I just stand out here and supervise her, we'll be two minutes".

Yes ideally there should be family loos. Yes men should campaign for that. But in the here and now, kids need to pee, no one is perving on anyone in a public loo, for goodness sake there are bigger things to worry about than boogeymen pervs in toilets.

Yup, the entitlement to use the women's facilities if more convenient is now a standard thing.

And the female people who cannot use a mixed sex space, and those females deeply uncomfortable about using a mixed sex space, are just left to either manage the discomfort or to self exclude and lose access to anything at all so that men can take their preferred and most convenient choice in the moment from everything.

It's the same argument as people with sleeping babies in buggies in the wheelchair space excluding wheelchair users: I want to, it suits me, I've justified it to myself, and it sucks to be you who I've displaced because I want your access. It's selfish. And your DH needs to ask himself why, when he doesn't want to subject little girls to the men's facilities, he is happy subjecting females to him and thereby any other male who feels entitled to be there when they're vulnerable.

If I were him I’d put my daughters’ interests ahead of strangers’ “discomfort”.

Little kids can't always wait

Do you seriously think it's better to get a 3 year old girl to to use a disgusting toilet that would upset her and be gross, to 'just hold it',

This presumably applies to 3 year old boys too - do you think all children should use the woman’s loos? No wonder the queues are always so long, men can take their children (of both sexes) into the closet gents.

Have only read OPs posts. (so sue me)
The key thing here is that (once he's sorted the DCs out) to go to wherever he is and complain. Complain. Complain. Ask for a) clean(er) toilets, Family toilets, whatever. Complain complain complain.

And sure, nobody would begrudge your girls going to the look. But plenty of women don't want men in the ladies either.

So he needs to campaign. Is he?

This

If I were him I’d put my daughters’ interests ahead of strangers’ “discomfort”.

oh, you mean the discomfort of other people ‘s daughters?

all about you, then?

Quite
And most of the time it is possible to avoid places that don't have unisex loos until your daughters are old enough to go into the ladies by themselves.

I can see why there's been a push for unisex loos. It would solve a lot of problems space wise. At present we have ladies, gents, accessible. Now folks are suggesting a family loo. It's all dead space that a business has a. Find room for, b find the money for. C, pay so much PSF in rent and rates. One big unisex loo with baby changing facilities and a wider opening with more depth for disabled facilities would save a lot of money

He should do what most of us do. Which is plan ahead a bit. Make sure we Take the children places where there are adequate facilities. Allow longer for journeys to allow us to stop off at places we know are OK to avoid using ones in places we are less sure of.
this ^
DD has additional needs and needed help at the toilet for longer so for quite a while DH never took her somewhere alone, in general he only takes her to places where she can managed herself. Planning ahead helps a lot.

By the way I can’t understand your question about male attendant. There is a big sign usually alerting you about this so you’ve got choice to go in or not. he’s usually cleaning something and he’s in uniform so it’s obvious what he’s doing and who he is.