"You don't owe your parents anything"

[climbingqueenie]

I've seen a lot of this sort of thing bandied around on TikTok and other social media and I wondered if it was the norm to think this these days. I'm obviously not talking about abusive parents- my Dad was emotionally abusive and I don't really have anything to do with him as an adult - but just in general, is it really wrong to expect a reciprocal relationship with your adult children? I spend time with my DM and help her out because I love her and she does the same for me. I'd be pretty gutted if my DC grew up and didn't want to see me or didn't consider my feelings or spoke to me rudely. My mum was by no means perfect but what parent is? She had her own traumas and flaws as we all do but essentially her heart is in the right place and she loves us all, and always showed it. So no I don't "owe" her anything but I appreciate her and I like to help her out.

I don't know, I just feel there is a lot of tendency these days to put all the blame for any problems you might have on your parents and it isn't very healthy. Is there anyone who parents in a perfect way that has no damaging effect whatsoever on their children? Surely we are all a little bit dysfunctional and that's just part of being human? To reiterate, I'm not talking about abuse. I just feel there is significant pressure on parents these days to centre their children's emotional wellbeing- as is obviously completely right- but also to display no thoughts or feelings or emotions of your own. I have a friend for example with a teenage DS who speaks to her like dirt - one time after he'd spoken to her particularly badly she cried and he told her to do that was emotionally manipulative.

Is that where we are? Do you have to just allow your children to say what they like to you and have no emotional response?

I'm genuinely interested in this because I know it has many layers of nuance.

Kids grow up and become independent adults, and they make choices.
One of my kids went off to Uni and I hardly see them now, They are studying and working, have friends and a social life, and train for a sport. So there’s no time for home.
Another one blames me for all their MH problems ( although it runs in DH’s family and I’m the one that repeatedly suggested they access help, they also did not pay a penny or lift a finger in the house ) so I no longer see them since they got a partner. I don’t even get a text.
I think it’s really sad that they can’t even just send a text once a week.
But no doubt I’ll get the blame on MN too, just to really grind in that it’s all my fault.

I feel like social media has made a lot of people very focused on “me me me” and it’s all about their feelings and being their “authentic” selves. When really it just reeks of selfishness. TikTok seems to be especially damaging from the things I have heard about.

I have adult DC, I wasn’t “perfect” but they know I did my best and they appreciate it. We’re very close. None of us would speak to each other like dirt, it just wouldn’t happen. But then SM was still somewhat in its infancy when they were teens.

My child is only ten, but in general, although I have a cordial enough relationship with my parents, I’m wary of blanket pieties about parents. Mine weren’t abusive, but (themselves illiterate, poor and from dysfunctional, deprived backgrounds) they had absolutely no idea how to parent, or that children might need more than (minimal) food and shelter, or that education should be encouraged — to this day, they have no idea how dreadful a childhood they gave us. I try to parent my own son absolutely differently.

I spent almost 30 years of my adult life living outside my home country, and extremely opposed to any blanket narrative of what adult children ‘owe’ their parents, purely on the basis of them being their parents. I do a lot of making allowances for my parents, and now live near them, but I would never tell anyone they need to engage in a ‘reciprocal relationship’ with their parents.

I totally agree with this. I'm also doing my best but I know I don't get everything right. Nor did my own mum but I know she did her best and I know she loves us.

I would never tell anyone they needed to engage in a reciprocal relationship either, my point was more that the expectation seems to be that parents should give you everything (inc as am adult) while not having the right to have feelings of their own or desire reciprocation in the relationship.

I generally think if grown up children don't have time for their parents, then it's for a damn good reason.

I have an excellent relationship with my mum but I've not seen my dad for over two years 🤷🏻‍♀️ they're still married but he puts no effort in to our relationship so I frankly can't be bothered anymore either.

Doesn’t it rather depend by what you mean by ‘owe’. My DM is 100% clear that she does not expect us to provide care when she’s older, for example, which lots of her friends do expect. Even though they did not themselves do the same for their parents (or certainly not whilst working FT). She says it was her choice to have us and therefore that element of the relationship is a one way street!

But do I owe her politeness, kindness etc because she gives and always gave those to me? Yes, I think I do. And I am delighted to spend time with her etc

I don't really speak to my Dad either as you'll have seen in my OP.

I dunno if I necessarily agree with the first part of your post though. Like, I know people who are happy to use their parents for babysitting, money etc but don't bother to send them a birthday card. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about.

As to care, I think that depends entirely on the person and situation. If I didn't have to work and had a large house with a separate space I would like to think I would want to care for my mum at home, when she is elderly or if she gets ill. However, if I were working full time and lived in a small space I wouldn't be able to and she wouldn't expect me to.

As an adult, you don't really owe your parents anything. But then, you're parents don't owe you anything either.

IME the people who are spouting this kind of stuff on social media are the type of people who blame everyone else but themselves for their problems. 'Look at meeeeeeeeee. I'm soooooo special. I'm sooooo saaaaaad!' Grow up, get a proper job and stop relying on sponsorship from spice entice to pay your rent.

I dunno if I necessarily agree with the first part of your post though. Like, I know people who are happy to use their parents for babysitting, money etc but don't bother to send them a birthday card. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about.

Then the parents should say no 🤷🏻‍♀️

But that's what I mean! I feel like a popular opinion is that you are meant to be there for your (adult) child, but you cannot have the expectation that they are also there for you.

I see a lot of that at the moment.

There’s a bizarre movement among young people today to convince themselves their parents are shit and they had a traumatic upbringing because they didn’t get the barbie they wanted for Christmas or some shit. I find these TikTok videos disturbing. It’s like we have lost all common human decency. People grasp at anything to claim their parents are awful and I worry that, despite always trying my best and doing what I believe is best for my kids, They’ll grow up to resent me because I didn’t let them have their own YouTube channel or some shit

I don't think my two DDs 'owe' me anything. I chose to have them and I'm pleased that we have good relationships now they're young adults. My 21yo moved out recently with her bf, but we text daily and face time a few times a week. I'm realistic enough to know that frequency will drop off as she becomes more independent and her life gets busier. My 23yo still lives at home and we have a good relationship too.

I'd like to think that when we're all older they won't just forget me. Occasional contact, even if it's only a text now and then would be nice.

Yes, these are the tik toks I'm referring to!

I think maturity and having children of your own can often put things into perspective. My elderly parents are leaning on us quite heavily atm, however there is no guilt tripping/manipulation etc, they have always been of the opinion that 'you should not expect children to help in old age', I also belive the same, the thing is though, while recognising that parents are not perfect, thye make mistakes, often quite bad ones, if they have tried their best and showed love/caring/kindness and built a loving close family you end up helping because you want to. My own DM often enrages me but I am old enough and intelligent enough to realise her behaviour is a product of a very neglectful childhood, she has spent 83 years trying to get over it, she never will now but she tried so hard not to repeat that behaviour during our childhoods I give her a (bit) of a pass.

I am very close to my own DD despite the mistakes I made with her parenting, we love each other and accept each other for the imperfect people we are.

Agreed.

I think people shouldn’t burn their bridges too early either. I know a few friends of my mum whose children were LC because <insert innocuous reason> and then when they had kids and realised childcare costs £75 a day, suddenly expected mummy on hand 3 days a week. And expected mummy to be thankful.

I 100% agree with your post, you said exactly what I was trying to but much more eloquently.

I don’t think anyone in our family thinks in terms of ‘owe’ or ‘reciprocal’ or anything so transactional.

It’s family care, compassion, love, loyalty, shared values, providing what people need.

Often, the busy independent phase of the offsprings life coincides with the parents post-kids independence. In my 20s and early 30s I wasn’t very focussed on parents, forgot to tell them when I went on holiday abroad, didn’t need them for various crises. And they were fine and busy and having their own adventures. Still went ‘home’ for Christmas etc.

When I had kids we were much more involved. Lots of visits, close grandparents relationship.

In later years my parents really needed us. With my siblings we did whatever possible to help them, include them, support them through frailty. Not because we ‘owed’ them, but because we cared, and wanted to.

But that's what I mean! I feel like a popular opinion is that you are meant to be there for your (adult) child, but you cannot have the expectation that they are also there for you.

You can be there for your children without being unpaid childcare though. If you choose, as a parent, to take on that amount of care for your grandchildren, that's on you. Don't take it on if you're just going to bitch about it.

A parent-child relationship is never going to be truly equal. If you choose to have children, you should be prepared for the responsibility of it - but you can't expect your children to have the same responsibility towards you when it's not a situation they ever chose to be in in the first place.

Technically we don’t owe our parents anything but I think it’s SO much nicer to have a loving, effort-driven relationship with your parents than to not. My mum wasn’t the greatest mum in the world - in fact she made some horrific decision at certain points in my childhood. She bangs on a little too much about the ailments of her friends and neighbours. She’s not perfect - like all of us. But my god she is there when I need her. And she’s do anything, any day of the week for me, no questions asked. And you can feel the love she has for us all radiating from her I can’t ask for better than that really can I 🥰

I do think part of this is that my cultural heritage is not British - I was brought up by my mum but with a large extended family of aunties, cousins, grandparents etc, and we all helped each other out. I have noticed British culture is very much focused on the nuclear family as the most important unit.

Lovely post and pretty much how I feel about my own Mum.

Well, you said it yourself - you can choose to have a close relationship with your parents. But the point is that it IS a choice - there should be no obligation, so it's true that nobody "owes" their parents anything.
What individuals choose to do in their family relationships is entirely up to them - each to their own, and all that.

I don’t feel like I ‘owe’ my mum, in the way that her love was somehow transactional, but I do feel I am responsible for her wellbeing as she gets older. I don’t resent that because I care about her.