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"You don't owe your parents anything"

177 replies

climbingqueenie · 22/07/2022 08:47

I've seen a lot of this sort of thing bandied around on TikTok and other social media and I wondered if it was the norm to think this these days. I'm obviously not talking about abusive parents- my Dad was emotionally abusive and I don't really have anything to do with him as an adult - but just in general, is it really wrong to expect a reciprocal relationship with your adult children? I spend time with my DM and help her out because I love her and she does the same for me. I'd be pretty gutted if my DC grew up and didn't want to see me or didn't consider my feelings or spoke to me rudely. My mum was by no means perfect but what parent is? She had her own traumas and flaws as we all do but essentially her heart is in the right place and she loves us all, and always showed it. So no I don't "owe" her anything but I appreciate her and I like to help her out.

I don't know, I just feel there is a lot of tendency these days to put all the blame for any problems you might have on your parents and it isn't very healthy. Is there anyone who parents in a perfect way that has no damaging effect whatsoever on their children? Surely we are all a little bit dysfunctional and that's just part of being human? To reiterate, I'm not talking about abuse. I just feel there is significant pressure on parents these days to centre their children's emotional wellbeing- as is obviously completely right- but also to display no thoughts or feelings or emotions of your own. I have a friend for example with a teenage DS who speaks to her like dirt - one time after he'd spoken to her particularly badly she cried and he told her to do that was emotionally manipulative.

Is that where we are? Do you have to just allow your children to say what they like to you and have no emotional response?

I'm genuinely interested in this because I know it has many layers of nuance.

OP posts:
6ixty9ine · 22/07/2022 10:36

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:27

abusive or just toxic parents aside - of course we have a duty toward our parents.

Why?

It's the right thing to do if you care about your parents. I mean, you could neglect and ignore them to prove a point, but I bet you're not going to, because you feel a sense of duty.

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:37

Of course - as I said, I love him and he's my dad, but I also know he would never, ever ask me for help. I would have to force it on him lol.

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:38

It's the right thing to do if you care about your parents. I mean, you could neglect and ignore them to prove a point, but I bet you're not going to, because you feel a sense of duty.

I care about my parents but I don't feel a sense of duty towards them, no.

I would help them if they needed it as they're good people who love me and support me, not because we're related.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

6ixty9ine · 22/07/2022 10:39

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:37

Of course - as I said, I love him and he's my dad, but I also know he would never, ever ask me for help. I would have to force it on him lol.

Fair enough, most nice parents wouldn't want their children to feel a duty, but you wouldn't let him go without either

climbingqueenie · 22/07/2022 10:39

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:37

Of course - as I said, I love him and he's my dad, but I also know he would never, ever ask me for help. I would have to force it on him lol.

See I don't really see that as what I'm talking about really. I'm the same with my brother, it's not like we are super close and that's totally fine, but it would really upset me if he decided he wanted no relationship with me at all. Equally I know I would always help him if he needed it.

OP posts:
coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:40

Fair enough, most nice parents wouldn't want their children to feel a duty, but you wouldn't let him go without either

Of course not. Just because we have nothing in common doesn't mean I don't love and care about him, and vice versa.

But I also know he would never ask for help unless he's exhausted every other avenue open to him, so I suppose I wouldn't feel taken advantage of either.

climbingqueenie · 22/07/2022 10:41

I don't particularly feel a sense of duty to my Dad. Like I wouldn't want him hurt but I would not put myself out to help him because I know I would not get the same back. My mum on the other hand I would inconvenience myself to help because she would do the same for me. But I know people whose parents would walk over hot coals for them and they can't even be bothered to send a text on their birthday - not even that they're NC, they just can't be arsed. It's that sort of thing I mean.

OP posts:
6ixty9ine · 22/07/2022 10:41

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:38

It's the right thing to do if you care about your parents. I mean, you could neglect and ignore them to prove a point, but I bet you're not going to, because you feel a sense of duty.

I care about my parents but I don't feel a sense of duty towards them, no.

I would help them if they needed it as they're good people who love me and support me, not because we're related.

I'm with you, in my mothers culture, the parent duty is very toxic and you have to look after you parents even if they're abusive twats. It shouldn't be a right just because they're your parents (but if they're good parents, it's different).

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:42

See I don't really see that as what I'm talking about really. I'm the same with my brother, it's not like we are super close and that's totally fine, but it would really upset me if he decided he wanted no relationship with me at all. Equally I know I would always help him if he needed it.

But that's your family dynamic and culture. Not everyone was raised that way but that doesn't make them bad or selfish.

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:45

Well said @6ixty9ine - I don't really feel a sense of duty towards anyone except my paying clients lol.

I care for some members of my family because they're good people, others are not good people so I don't care for them. They're not abusive, just disinterested and of no relevance to my life.

Dinosauratemydaffodils · 22/07/2022 10:45

I had an "interesting"childhood (watched my father almost bleed to death after a fight with my mother/blazing rows/coming home from school to find I couldn't get in the house because mum had left the country and dad was on deployment/repeatedly told she wished I had been a cot death statistic/was useless/ugly/worthless). I have a cordial relationship with her because my expectations are zero and so far she's a 1000x better grandmother than she was a mother. I draw the line at providing care though.

I have also had a lot of therapy!

Just4today · 22/07/2022 10:46

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:27

abusive or just toxic parents aside - of course we have a duty toward our parents.

Why?

Well I think a duty is a moral obligation, so it isn't something that can have a neat explanation - it's not really possible to explain why you think something is the right thing to do to anyone who doesn't think the same way.
I do wonder if how we feel about this changes when our parents aren't here any more. I might have viewed some visits home as being a bit of a duty (when I had more exciting things to do) but god I'd love to be able to have one now.

climbingqueenie · 22/07/2022 10:47

Dinosauratemydaffodils · 22/07/2022 10:45

I had an "interesting"childhood (watched my father almost bleed to death after a fight with my mother/blazing rows/coming home from school to find I couldn't get in the house because mum had left the country and dad was on deployment/repeatedly told she wished I had been a cot death statistic/was useless/ugly/worthless). I have a cordial relationship with her because my expectations are zero and so far she's a 1000x better grandmother than she was a mother. I draw the line at providing care though.

I have also had a lot of therapy!

Crikey, I would not blame you if you were NC!

OP posts:
climbingqueenie · 22/07/2022 10:48

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/07/2022 10:42

See I don't really see that as what I'm talking about really. I'm the same with my brother, it's not like we are super close and that's totally fine, but it would really upset me if he decided he wanted no relationship with me at all. Equally I know I would always help him if he needed it.

But that's your family dynamic and culture. Not everyone was raised that way but that doesn't make them bad or selfish.

But it pretty much sounds like you're the same with your Dad so I don't think we are really on a different page here!

OP posts:
Limecoconutice · 22/07/2022 10:53

I agree with you op. There is a narrative of dissatisfaction and (sorry to say) self pity on line ATM which teenagers and young adults are lapping up uncritically. Again, obviously, I am not talking about situations where parents are abusive. I know so many teens and young adults from comfortable, decent, homes with loving parents, the latter having made considerable sacrifices for their dc, who take virtually no personal responsibility for their actions and blame the majority of life's difficulties on their parents.

I also feel that the parenting pendulum has swing too far from "respectfully fearful" and "benign neglect" in the 60s and 70s to "completely child focused" and "lacking in respect" today. Yes, respect has to be earned and the best mantra for parenting imho is still "example, example, example" as children tend to do what you do and not what you say. I am not sure that our current, very intense, obsessively child focused parenting has done our children many favours because many teens suffer a horrible shock when they enter the real world and discover that the terms are not attuned so favourably towards them.

I am always harping on about this but children are taught about "self fulfillment", "self care", "self confidence" (all good things) without being taught to think of others, the opposite pov to their own, or to examine their own consciences from time to time. I suppose religious education once filled that role, and spoke about personal and moral responsibility, but at the same time, turned people off with its own lack of credibility.

Many people won't agree but I think the current rhetoric of "you have to love yourself in order to love others" has been taken to extremes. How many of us genuinely love ourselves when it comes down to it? Who is putting the opposite, old fashioned view, that doing things for others, in a balanced way, can actually be very rewarding and make you feel good? The notion of sacrifice or "being kind" is viewed with suspicion by psychologists and social narrators alike and imbued with all sorts of dark motives, when sometimes, genuine kindness to others, can be just that, enough in itself.

Also, I think life lived too much on line can have damaging consequences! Another area where balance is key. So little energy, creativity and perseverance is required to tap on a keyboard. Real life is so much messier, more complicated, more demanding. The stark contrast between the two is fuelling a mental health crisis in our young.

Now I do feel that teens and young adults genuinely had a completely awful time during Covid, where their needs were largely ignored, and they are now being told to get stuck in, as if nothing happened. And I have huge sympathy for their foreboding over climate change and lack of optimism over home ownership, job security, access to decent health care and public services. And of course it is virtually impossible to convey to teens and young adults how grim and grey - materially and culturally speaking - life could in the 70s. And at the same time, they seem to have little awareness as to how fortunate they are in many ways having access to the Internet, better nutrition, travel, a vast array of material goods, such as clothes, at affordable prices. There is a lack of balance!

I don't know what the answer is. On the one hand, having children is a selfish act and I agree they don't owe us anything. On the other hand, one would hope that, within a well functioning family, bonds of love and loyalty would keep you close and concerned about one another. I don't think you need to live in one another's pockets to achieve this though. Far too many parents seem overbearingly selfish in what they expect of their adult children. I hope not to need the help of my children at any age, unless frailty or ill health makes that essential, but even then we are doing our best to make financial provision for that. I subscribe to the view that if your adult child is well adjusted and independent enough to be off living a full and engaged life then your parenting has been successful. Again, balance is key! We often only find out who genuinely loves us when we are ill or suffer an emergency of some sort. Other than that, live and let live is my motto. I certainly won't be putting any sort of moral obligation on my adult children to come and visit us once they are living independently. If they choose to do so because they want to, that's good enough for me!

wallpoppy · 22/07/2022 10:55

KangarooKenny · 22/07/2022 08:54

Kids grow up and become independent adults, and they make choices.
One of my kids went off to Uni and I hardly see them now, They are studying and working, have friends and a social life, and train for a sport. So there’s no time for home.
Another one blames me for all their MH problems ( although it runs in DH’s family and I’m the one that repeatedly suggested they access help, they also did not pay a penny or lift a finger in the house ) so I no longer see them since they got a partner. I don’t even get a text.
I think it’s really sad that they can’t even just send a text once a week.
But no doubt I’ll get the blame on MN too, just to really grind in that it’s all my fault.

Whenever I read things like this I always think that it would be extremely interesting to hear the perspective from the other side.

OooErr · 22/07/2022 11:02

Your POV is very different from what you actually think. People aren’t encouraging ungrateful children. Just discouraging a misplaced sense of duty.

I actually like talking to my parents. They’re fun, sensible people.
DP’s family are the opposite. They’re boring, shouty and judgy.
We’ll go for Christmas and the odd occasion but DP doesn’t want to call them every week which they complain about. They don’t see that they’re the problem.

Limecoconutice · 22/07/2022 11:03

SaintHelena · 22/07/2022 10:27

People don't appreciate their parents until they have their own children and see how xx.. hard it can be.
I spose people are having them a decade or so later so more time to criticise.

This is so true!

OooErr · 22/07/2022 11:03

*not POV I meant OP title

climbingqueenie · 22/07/2022 11:04

wallpoppy · 22/07/2022 10:55

Whenever I read things like this I always think that it would be extremely interesting to hear the perspective from the other side.

I agree but would you say the same if it was an adult child posting about their parent?

OP posts:
ThanksAntsThants · 22/07/2022 11:08

This thread has had me questioning myself again about whether I am justified going no contact with my mother. I’ve read through some of the abusive messages she sent me and concluded that yes, I am more than justified. It’s because I feel like I owe her something that I’ve put up with her vicious comments, chipping away at my confidence for all these years. Whatever I owe her, I’ve already paid.

SquirrelSoShiny · 22/07/2022 11:09

LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet · 22/07/2022 09:07

There’s a bizarre movement among young people today to convince themselves their parents are shit and they had a traumatic upbringing because they didn’t get the barbie they wanted for Christmas or some shit. I find these TikTok videos disturbing. It’s like we have lost all common human decency. People grasp at anything to claim their parents are awful and I worry that, despite always trying my best and doing what I believe is best for my kids, They’ll grow up to resent me because I didn’t let them have their own YouTube channel or some shit

Yes agreed.

But I think TikTok has amplified that trend. If I have one plea to parents it's to understand how damaging TikTok is and deter your children from using it.

drawacircleroundit · 22/07/2022 11:15

I went NC with my parents because of the expectations that were being put on me to provide care, coupled with the relentless passive aggressive criticisms to convey that I was simply not good enough at caring. I decided one day that I deserved a future not enmeshed with theirs, and I am so happy now - although I've lost the inheritance that was being constantly dangled in front of me. Unfortunately, I did this too late. I am now in my late 50s and trapped in a part of the world I didn't want to be in (because I had needed to be near them and didn't dare move), I have missed out on spending money on things like holidays because they would make me feel guilty for spending anything, and I still struggle horribly with feeling that I am deserving of anything.
So with my own two DC, I am happy if they are happy. If that doesn't involve me, then so be it. I refuse to become my parents.
However, I am insanely jealous of those close-bonded, multi-generational families I see around me, and if I could have had that myself, and could have that with my 2 DC, it would be lovely!

drawacircleroundit · 22/07/2022 11:17

ThanksAntsThants · 22/07/2022 11:08

This thread has had me questioning myself again about whether I am justified going no contact with my mother. I’ve read through some of the abusive messages she sent me and concluded that yes, I am more than justified. It’s because I feel like I owe her something that I’ve put up with her vicious comments, chipping away at my confidence for all these years. Whatever I owe her, I’ve already paid.

Don't doubt. Are you happier now? There's your answer Flowers

Parkperson00 · 22/07/2022 11:20

@coffeecupsandfairylights
coffeecupsandfairylights · Today 09:25
You wrote ,
'Because not everyone deserves respect or care, relatives or not.'

Sorry if this has been covered already but surely one of the hallmarks of a civilized society is respect and care for everyone. The State is not allowed to pick and choose who benefits are allocated to based on their niceness. The UN Declaration of Human Rights said back in 1948 -
Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion.

Do you really believe that not everyone deserves respect and care? That is a very strong opinion that goes against all principles of humanity.

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