Middle class parenting more competive & sharp elbowed since the pandemic..

[Blooomingheck]

Might be just my area but many parents (interestingly the dads in our particular are the worst!) are doing whatever they possibly can to get their kids ahead.. It was bad before the pandemic but I think it's created a new breed of sharp elbowed, neurotic parent... Is this just my area (1.5 hours south of London)

Definitely definitely agree. I recently met with a bunch of friends whose kids are all at the same single sex private primary - they’re all being full time (as in weekly classes with daily exercises) tutored in addition to their private schooling to prep them for the 11+. “It’s an arms race” said one of them. These children are currently in year 4.
In the same group, one child can’t start a new activity without all the mums having to know where/when/what they’re doing so they all sign up too, whether it’s Cubs, horse riding, whatever, you name it.
I couldn’t be more glad to have removed my daughter from that toxic attitude, it’s absolutely soul destroying!

“So yes, if I get a work email from someone sent late at night, it doesn't affect me, but it does make me wonder if this person is struggling with their work/life balance.”

I work for a large corporate that would grind to a halt without email. In my experience, late nights emails are generally a sign of the opposite, that someone has a positive work life balance facilitated by flexible working.

I have seen quite a few with comment after signature along the lines of: “You may receive an email from my out of standard working hours due to my flexible working, there is not expectation on you to read or respond outside of your chosen hours.”

The email thing is absolutely bonkers. Of course people should be able to email at a time convenient for them.

Some parents are at work during 8-6 and can't email during that time. Children and school issues are "personal" matters and not all parents have the sort of job where you turn up at work, fetch a coffee and then spend an hour faffing around catching up on office gossip and doing personal stuff before you actually do any work. For example, it's not uncommon for medical staff to be on their feet for a 10 hour shift with two 30 minute breaks... are they really meant to spend their breaks sending school emails?

There's something to be said for keeping children occupied and busy and not sitting around bored at home. We live on an old council estate and quite a few of the homes are still council owned. Sadly, the children who are most likely to be seen cutting school or who are not doing so well academically, are also the children from families that definitely are not doing any of the extras.

I'd argue that as a society we should be doing more to help those children to benefit in a similar way to the families who are doing this stuff privately.

For example, our primary school has almost zero after-school activities. As a result, only the wealthier families at our school are able to do extra football, art, music etc. Partly because of the cost and partly because of the logistics. If the school offered a few more options at or after school, on a not-for-profit basis (ie costs only), many of those children would benefit.

Exactly this. I used to have to contact school by email at 4am when I had my break at work. It didn’t mean I expected a reply at that time, it was the only time I could communicate with the school

Interesting point, in our area too the kids of the "pushies" are utterly lovely, well liked & don't come accross at all stressed... Lovely to have to tea also. It's the parents who are the pro let, their kids are great!

My point exactly they're scared to miss a trick in case another child gets a leg up!

Sure, our kids are (now) not getting to do YR Fencing, or coding for 6 year olds…but they don’t have that heavy weight of expectation either, which is a lot for a child to carry.
For me it comes down to children being allowed to become what they are, rather than being trained to become “successful” any specific achievement.
My kids do their homework and clubs and we do stuff - educational and FUN - together. That’s enough, I think. Let the pressure come later.

Some people clearly do not understand how email works. Simply read and respond to your email when it is convenient to you. I’m using too busy to send personal emails during my working hours. DP also sends emails 24/7. We’re abroad on holiday now and he has to send emails as he runs businesses.

We live in W. London, not a grammar area. Our Yr 6 DD was tutored from Yr 4 as she was struggling with Maths. We stopped tutoring during lockdown as the tutor was only available via WhatsApp which didn’t work for DD, so us parents took over the tutoring role. DD got offered places at the two independent schools we applied for. We ultimately decided that DD will do well whichever school she attends and would be much happier in a much more diverse Academy school mixing with peers who look like her and her friends from her state Primary School. Tutoring helped DD gain confidence and structure which has helped across all of her subjects. We’ll be doing the same with our Yr 2 DS if he needs it.

There’s nothing wrong in wanting the best for your children and wanting them to do well. We work hard to give ourselves and our children options. Don’t knock people who can do it just because you can’t/won’t.

DP and I grew up on Council estates with hard working parents and Grandparents. We have worked hard to be where we are now.

We are not conformists. We don’t care about what other people think about how we spend our money and we don’t care about how other people spend theirs.

Oh, and we don’t eat McDonalds either. A choice that we made 10+ years ago when our eldest was a teen. We don’t feel the need to discuss this loudly in public. Adult DD currently choses to eat McDonalds as it’s her choice as an adult.

Blooming my anecdote is a little extreme the other way ,

I know of a family with highly educated dad and bright but not uni education mum.
He really pushed how exams are bad and are not a sign of intellectual ability ( I do agree)
But he really pushed it ,how his DC would be fine. He could have sent them to better school but chose not too.
Unfortunately not a single one ( 4) ever manage to get a decent job.
All complain they wished they were pushed and encouraged more.
Two are alcoholics and one of those sadly ided her biggest regret was not for filling her accadmically potential.
All lost and bright...and in 50s 60s now blaming parents for their lack of success.

My first dd never needed a tutor and I must admit the way tutoring is presented on here made it sound like a bad thing. However When Ds 2 started struggling I reluctantly got a tutor.
The absolute best thing we spend money on.
They are Able to zone right in on what the child needs!
With undivided personal attention.

It's improved DC confidence immeasurably!
Esp with maths concepts that no one in school has the time to go over and over with.
They are much happier and engaged in school.
I'm so so glad I did it. And for a mere 40 mins a week!

Maybe because of home learning during lockdown, parents might have realised the potential of their children. That one on one teaching can progress way better than 1 - 30 ratio at school, so just want to keep doing it by hiring a tutor?

Lives in London it's not surprising that children who can create music and all the enjoyment and benefit of playing an instrument are Happy?
It's again not surprising that children who are achieving and engaged and have a full Happy life , meeting all sorts of people , enjoying hobbies and different aspects of lifeare happy?

My experience is more with the under achievers who have not achieved their potential, who don't have hobbies except drink, dont have many interests and don't get much out of life!

Graphe!

Actually you're spot on there for me, it was in lock down that I did relaise dd was amazing with 1:1 support and I was able to bring her on enormously. We suspected Sen because she had been struggling so much!

@Ithoughtsummerwascoming
No not just playing an instrument and enjoying music - I mean getting Grade 8 in at least one instrument by Y6 (preferably 2) and daily practise for an hour plus being non-negotiable.
I mean being on county pathways for your chosen sport(s) and if not, having extra private tuition to help get your standard up. Also into the top London academic day schools pref with a scholarship. And being told that anything less is a failure and you need to work harder.
It sounds like a recipe for disaster doesn’t it but I haven’t seen any evidence that the kids are unhappy. Bit like that Tiger Mum book published a few years ago. Her kids were actually quite grateful and happy despite her pushing them.
personally I haven’t the energy for it all 😂 My kids do play musical instruments though but will prob never get to Grade 8

You’ve just made me think of one of the saddest kids I ever met.
Supply teaching aYear 3 class for a couple of weeks, I’d been in the school for the previous two terms so kids knew me. Creative writing lesson, after the talking bit I just asked them to think of and write down their main character, one or two minor characters and a setting, their choice, anything goes. I emphasised that this could all be tweaked, changed as their story developed. 99% of the kids are happily thinking of names for their characters, setting their story on the moon, fairyland, the Arctic etc… One child refuses to write, I ask him to tell me his ideas, I’ll jot them down for him. Won’t say a word. No tactics worked, he eventually starts saying he wants to take it home for homework —- no, you’ve already got your homework for today, I don’t want you to have more. Much wailing followed about he must take it home culminating in him hyperventilating, really alarming. Later learnt that he did that frequently, took the work home where his mother did it all, he had to be perfect in everything. He could barely function amongst the other kids.

Makes me glad for the laid back, rather hippy-dippy upbringing my own two had.

This isn't about parents wanting the best for their children, or doing whatever they can to provide them with tutoring or whatever else.

This thread is about the parents who boast about their child's achievements, whilst rubbing other parents' noses in it and either denigrating the achievements of others and/or elbowing them firmly out of little Johnny's way.

I never talked about what my dc was doing in her chosen extra-curricular activity, and avoided answering questions from other parents like the plague. It was embarrassing. They were weirdly competitive with us, and a mum would often come and tell me her dd had just taken her grade 3 ballet exam or whatever, and the teacher said she'd be sure to get top marks and all that. Lovely, I'd say, that's great, I'm so pleased, well done to her. Then the mum would ask about how my dd's ballet was coming along. It would have been impossible to answer without offending them, so I didn't. I'd just say yeah, fine, she really enjoys it, blah blah. I wouldn't tell them the truth. No point.

@taxi4ballet this 100%, the types I'm talking about are out for their dc only but feign concern & interest in others to gain information! Sounds crazy to those who haven't experienced it but it's happening... At least in my neck of the woods!

All sounds like a lot of effort to me. I knew a few of these type when mine were at primary, mostly I just found them amusing.

now mine are older I have to say I avoid most of it.

It is amusing & the dads are worse than the mums.. One particularly high earning dad is sponsoring all sorts of teams his dc are involved on to ensure they are chosen for the first team... Also sponsored large prizes for school raffle, very generous but definitely keeping the dc up there!

You do sound snipey OP.

Turn the situation on its head and the sports teams have sponsorship and the school raffle may well be more successful.

@110APiccadilly

Actually I disagree with your last statement.

Things are changing. Kids (teens) are looking at apprenticeship as a alternative more be more now and big company's are starting to offer them. Obviously they will be competitive but universities are not offering value for money so kids and companies are going elsewhere. I don't blame them!

Something slightly similar happened when I was at school - there was a clique of dads who bought cups for the school prize giving ceremony on condition that the prizes went to each others' kids. There was a teacher who wanted to give me a prize for being the best at her subject, the daughter of the guy who donated the prize threatened to tell her daddy (this was in sixth form and she still said daddy), so the teacher had to give it to the girl's best mate instead (their dads were friends as well).

If that is true, then the school should never have accepted cups under those conditions.

I don’t see the problem with this. It’s good that this Dad is financially contributing to the school, which will help all the children taking part in those teams, not just his own DC.
What’s the problem? Do you feel as though you and your DC have to compete? You really don’t have to. Everything does not have to be a competition. Do you think this Dad is bothered or even aware of what other parents are contributing (financially, physically and emotionally) to these teams? He is using his resources in order to do the best for his DC, which in turn will also help the other students.