The country is a shit show - why is there so little mention of Brexit's role?

[Neonskytonight]

That's it really.

Surely all our woes can't be placed at the door of covid and war - it is a good political narrative, but is it really true?

I'm amazed how little questioning by the media and public there is about the role of Brexit.

It isn't the division I'm bothered about, it is the economic damage.

Hateful. Luckily for Europe our political stance has helped them now that the decade long run up to this war has landed. God bless Ukraine. Peace out ✌️

VOTE GREEN

Different countries measure it across across different goods and products, i'd have thought that was obvious.

www.ons.gov.uk/economy/inflationandpriceindices

I'm beginning to despair. The countries calculate all the standard inflation measures. Check the link - the UK produces 3. Trading Economics will then select the right measure for use in a like-for-like comparison. This isn't rocket science! They don't add a caveat to say that the UK measure is wrong because it included beetroot whereas Germany included sauerkraut.

Anyway, answer the question. If inflation rate is such a strong indication of economic success then will you accept Brexit as a success if the Uk's rate becomes lower than the EU's? I don't think you should and that applies equally the other way around.

@XVGN err i didn't say it was "wrong" its different e.g in the UK (on avg) 32% is spent on household/utilities, in France thats 15%. On food drink, UK 16%, France 9%.
If you look, you'll find a handy drop down menu to illustrate this.....

Even in the EU, there was no standard way to measure inflation.

We are 6 years out from Brexit, inflation is higher in the UK, mainly because still import vast amounts, mostly from or through EU, those import costs have risen and thats before we even get to checking EU imports, which we wont.... because it would add to UK inflation

If it were only inflation, sure, i'd agree but its not.

I'm bothered about the division Brexit has caused as well. Upkip/Tories took an issue most people didn't care about and turned it into a major issue then made everyone pick a side. After that was done and leave won by a slim majority they then took a winner takes all attitude and offered absolutely zero concessions to the 48%+ of the people who voted.
I'm in my fifties and before the referendum I had never had a single conversation with anyone in my life about the EU and don't know anyone who had apart from one person who was a big ukipper (making an assumption he had talked about it). He's now moved on to independence for England now so he still inst happy.

On the whole I certainly don't think the EU referendum has added to the country's unity or happiness even amongst the people I know personally who voted for it, they seem angrier than ever.

I came on here to say the exact same thing. IMO the whole Brexit debate bored many people and they became sick of hearing about it and mentally switched off from it. I'm not saying that it's right to have done this, it's just what I see around me and TBH I feel like this myself. I'm very politically engaged and found the prolonged Brexit debate quite tedious. I voted remain, but I know and understand why some people voted leave and I respect that. Casting blame and finger pointing or discussing it ad nauseum isn't going to help anyone.

However, that aside I do think the impact of Brexit should be still reported on to keep the electorate informed and as a PP remarked, the older I get the more suspicious I feel when things are dropped from the news.

In fact after the last 2 years I'm not sure balanced journalism exists in this country anymore and I feel the media is influenced by the government more than I first realised.

Go ahead and provide the evidence. Only one of us has done this so far.

Because you can't. You can't give valid reasons for voting for it. Nobody can, because there weren't any.

Europe 'punishing' us ffs....why do so many of you think you're so very special and important? The EU didn't want the UK to leave. They gave multiple chances to go back on it, asked if they were sure, because they knew it was a shit idea all around. Then they did what they had to do.

The deluded Brits who voted Leave are the kind of people who go abroad and get angry that people are talking 'foreign' and they dare to eat different food. Full of exceptionalism and jingoism. Expecting to be fawned over and catered to.

You're not special. Britain isn't special. It's fast becoming a very sad, isolated, small minded little place with a tanked economy and terrible quality of life. The gap between rich and poor is getting wider and wider and now there's no 'EU bureaucracy' protecting us from dangerous chemicals, dangerous food and all the many things the widely mocked EU regulations were intended to do. Every single aspect of life is now much harder, from sending and receiving parcels to travel to recruiting staff from Europe to fill urgent vacancies.

'Europe' isn't punishing you. They don't give a fuck about you. The overwhelming emotion people have for you is pity.

"Look across the whole economy, from farming, import/exports, car production, staff shortages, queuing at EU passport control... the list is endless... Brexit, after 6 years, has been a complete failure..."

Let's start with staffing shortages. There are many reasons for these and changes in net migration since Brexit are not a major one (we can look at that separately later).

Lots of cafes, shops, etc are looking for labour. Correct. But (guessing) 20% of UK citizens are economically inactive. They could do these jobs but choose not to. There will be lots of reasons such as the job is too hard physically, the job involves contact with people and "I'm vulnerable", the NMW prevents employers from employing disabled people, etc but the main reason is that the level of benefits paid is TOO high. It's a disincentive to work. Benefits need to be cut to reduce government debt and increase employment. Nothing to do with Brexit is required at all.

@XVGN most benefit recipients are in paid work. Lots of women don't work because childcare is too expensive and it's cheaper for them to stay at home with their kids. How can that be justified? Look at countries like Sweden, where it's heavily subsidised and you can put two kids in full time creche for a few hundred a month.

You don't understand anything.

There were plenty of valid reasons for voting for it. Whilst some will have been motivated by bigoted xenophobic beliefs many will have not.

I love Europeans and European culture. I speak 2 languages and try others when I can, But I HATED the EU - it's incompetence and corruption. There was no way to change it. Try this thought experiment. If we were still in the EU then how could I get rid of Ursula von der Leyen if I wanted to? Ce n'est pas possible!

it felt like being on a night out and someone saying they were leaving over and over for the entire night, except it lasted for 5 years.

but the main reason is that the level of benefits paid is TOO high. It's a disincentive to work. Benefits need to be cut to reduce government debt and increase employment. Nothing to do with Brexit is required at all

Yet benefits are some of the lowest in europe....
Go on a benefits calculator and see what you actually get?

If employers paid decent wages, then not only would people stop claiming in work benefits in order to live, they d also have more money to spend in the economy.
Tesco made 2 billion profit last year, yet their average hourly rate is £11 ph.... most of these workers will be claiming some sort of benefit.

But what an attitude when you think we should pay the disabled less than the national min wage.... why not pay them fuck all? after all they can't do what the able bodied can do...

As for Brexit, as far as i can see, the stupid voted for it, one of the main groups who did, were the very people you have such scorn for... the economically inactive and those on benefits..... the majority of tax payers voted to Remain.

LOL.

What is this 'incompetence and corruption'?

You think our government are better? Can you get rid of Boris if you wanted to? Remind me when people voted for him?

I don't believe for a single second you have the first clue about how the EU works. Is it perfect? No. Is it a hell of a lot better to be in than out? Yes.

Only 43% of the voting public voted for BJ and just 17m out of 46m voted for Brexit.... yet we are all so "Democratic" compared to those corrupt europeans.

Joke really, only Belarus uses the FPTP system in Europe.

Plus, within any meaningful timescale, no one will ever get a chance to vote to rejoin the EU.

Brilliant. Brexit Benefits Boris's Bullshit.

he will never resign - of course we all know he cant stop lying or trying to impress us because that's been his life story and it will catch up with him.

Such an original subject. Not like we haven't had hundreds, if not thousands of threads like this one over the past six years. I find it amusing because the bottom line is that we are out and there's fuck all you can do about it, just like with Boris Johnson and the Tories. All you have is words and we all know about sticks and stones.

But there is something you can do about it? Of course there is.

True we cannot rejoin but we could have a better more trusting relationship with the EU with either a different Tory PM or a different party in power.... crazy that we are damaging ourselves by restricting trade with Europe but seek a trade deal in the Pacific.

We also have 1000s of threads on abuse, cheating and terrible teenagers...

We certainly can rejoin, and in the fullness of time it's inevitable that we will do so.

There will be a slow creep back, starting with an realisation that businesses continue to follow EU regulations because it makes no sense at all for them not to (notice the complete lack of clamour for any change at all). There will then be a realisation that by formally aligning with more and more EU law we can take down the barriers and obstacles to trade that we have put up. Once that fact dawns (along with the fact that there are just about no regulatory requirements that people are opposed to, they are universally extremely dull) the direction of travel is inevitable.

I agree but think it'll be a very slow process. The people who voted for it will NEVER change their minds, doesn't matter the damage. Given the age demographics of Leave v Remain voters, we just have to wait for the conveyor belt of life to move along. In the mean time, as travel returns I think our young people are going to be mighty pissed off about having the freedom of Europe taken from them.

@LauraNicolaides @Kendodd No we wont, the EU wouldn't have us back, we have proven to be an unreliable untrustworthy country.

I also think that whilst older people do indeed die, they are replaced by folk who seem to become more right wing and tory as they age... i've seen this first hand.

The best we can hope for is some sort of EFTA style arrangement but i doubt i will ever see this (late 50s now)