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Original poster

Ukraine Invasion: Part 19

999 replies

MagicFox · 06/04/2022 20:38

Welcome friends, still going

OP posts:
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39
Alexandra2001 · 08/04/2022 18:25

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

Stop defending these monsters, either way, its irrelevant.

I'm just making a linguistic point, and there is no need to have a go at me for that.

Didn't realise you can decide what is relevant or not, to be posted.

imho i don't think the kids or their parents blown to bits or those that have suffered horrendous injuries with little chance of safe medical care give a shit about language and neither do i.

Its an absolute abomination of a thing to do.

TargusEasting · 08/04/2022 18:28

I thought Finland have said they will be applying to join by the end of May.

9th May would be a better date.

notimagain · 08/04/2022 18:30

@TargusEasting

www.reuters.com/world/europe/russia-says-it-would-have-rebalance-if-finland-sweden-join-nato-2022-04-07/

Russia says it will rebalance by taking measures in Western Europe. Hmmmm....is Marine Le Pen still going to leave Nato if elected, which risk is higher if news coming out of France over the last 48 hours is correct. I suspect that is not what Picksy is talking about, but I could not help but notice the coincidental events.

I think a while back Madame Le Pen was threatening to leave the NATO command structure, not the organization itself…..i.e. do a de Gaulle.

FWIW even during the de Gaulle triggered absence where I was stationed we were worked with the French Air Force regularly (including detachments to their bases) and there were also a few French exchange officers in the UK, so ultimately below the (political, for window dressing) surface lots of operational links remained.

As for current events….Post the Ukrainian invasion Madame Le Pen has had to indulge in a bit of fast foot work with regard to previous meetings and previous statements…and she’s not the only one…

The truth may be revealed after the second round of voting…

www.france24.com/en/france/20220304-ukraine-war-puts-france-s-nato-sceptic-presidential-candidates-in-a-tight-spot

ScrollingLeaves · 08/04/2022 18:34

The point not that the Russian bomb didn’t blow children and others to bits but that the message on it shows the Russians were trying to give themselves an excuse.

I am interested in seeing how the Russians try to reverse everything they do and wouldn’t have known what the message said without someone else translating it. The Russians were trying to give the excuse, not the translator.

Igotjelly · 08/04/2022 18:41

@ScrollingLeaves

The point not that the Russian bomb didn’t blow children and others to bits but that the message on it shows the Russians were trying to give themselves an excuse.

I am interested in seeing how the Russians try to reverse everything they do and wouldn’t have known what the message said without someone else translating it. The Russians were trying to give the excuse, not the translator.

Exactly, it’s the propaganda point that’s important. Much easier to sell atrocities at home when you say it’s for dead children.
PaperTyger · 08/04/2022 18:50

That's how I read it... this bomb is on behalf off the children?

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 08/04/2022 19:39

A few weeks ago those people were taking their kids to ballet classes and doing up their AirBNB and planning Easter celebrations.

And now they are trying to escape war crimes.

I just can't get my head round it. Civilisation is a lot more fragile than I realised.

Alexandra2001 · 08/04/2022 19:40

Sorry but Russia doesn't give a shit about the fallout from their war crimes or the public back home, they tell people what to believe and they believe it
i doubt very much the Russian who wrote For the children or whatever had anything other than a basic education.

Russia shot down a passenger airliner, their MO is deny and blame, they don't need a painted slogan.

If not stood up to, Putin has no boundaries and the West needs to step up, i see the calls to open up the Black Sea are growing and not before time.

ChardonnaysPetDragon · 08/04/2022 19:42

mho i don't think the kids or their parents blown to bits or those that have suffered horrendous injuries with little chance of safe medical care give a shit about language and neither do i.

Well, don't. But don't go making comments on my posts when all I did was clarify a linguistic matter.

Where did I make an excuse for this?

Honestly.....

PaperTyger · 08/04/2022 19:44

Viva agree it's mind boggling.
Everything about us is definitely fragile.
None of us can take anything for granted.

Alexandra why is the black sea different to anything else though.
I agree it should be opened up but I also think peace keeping forces should go into Ukraine from the UN.

PaperTyger · 08/04/2022 19:45

Putin has been picture walking around with the Nuclear brief case.
He would know at such a high profile event that it would be photographed. He must be feeling Very powerful right now.

Natsku · 08/04/2022 19:51

I thought Finland have said they will be applying to join by the end of May.

Its not been decided yet, they're just saying they need to make the decision this spring. Though its pretty much certain now I think, as the President has been calling all the NATO member states to discuss if they will approve Finland's application, and checking the procedures and all that.

Natsku · 08/04/2022 19:52

@PaperTyger

Putin has been picture walking around with the Nuclear brief case. He would know at such a high profile event that it would be photographed. He must be feeling Very powerful right now.
Probably would be feeling quite 'excited' if it wasn't for his lack of male virility... (the deer bone or antler baths, whatever they were)
HappyWinter · 08/04/2022 20:04

@vivariumvivariumsvivaria

A few weeks ago those people were taking their kids to ballet classes and doing up their AirBNB and planning Easter celebrations.

And now they are trying to escape war crimes.

I just can't get my head round it. Civilisation is a lot more fragile than I realised.

I feel the same, they had ordinary lives and now they are trying to escape hell. The photo of a little brown horse soft toy covered in blood at Kramatorsk station made my heart break (it's on the Guardian live feed from earlier today). I dread to think of what happened to the little one who clutched it, hoping to be on their way to safety.

@MMBaranova I hope your family in Ukraine will get to safety, sending best wishes x

Shuuu · 08/04/2022 20:06

If Finland applied to join NATO & Russia do launch an attack of any kind in the process, how likely is it that NATO will defend them? Or how long does NATO membership take? Wouldn’t it be better to not report an application of membership ?

Wrongkindofovercoat · 08/04/2022 20:07

Been at work all day so just catching up, I can't imagine the countries that have supplied weapons to Ukraine, wanting them to fall into the hands of the Russians, so they have a vested interest in seeing Ukraine win ? Also re peace talks, there is one person who started this war and one person who can choose to end it without further bloodshed and barbarism and it isn't Zelensky. Zelensky just wants Ukraine to be as it was prior to the invasion, free.

Not being free isn't an option.

Alexandra2001 · 08/04/2022 20:12

Alexandra why is the black sea different to anything else though.
I agree it should be opened up but I also think peace keeping forces should go into Ukraine from the UN

There is no Peace to Keep, so any ground force going in would need to be huge & need air and sea cover, so a NFZ imposed, which means the Black sea would also need to be under full control of NATO, so first things first.
Also, the possibility of contact between Russian and NATO troops would be extremely high.

For example, the USA going into the Black Sea is going about their legal business, it is after all, international waters, they would be there to ensure safe passage of the various civilian ships stuck there.

Saltedeggplant · 08/04/2022 20:13

Think that's some panic stirring from the papers. There are plenty of photographs with it near him before this, same as the American briefcase/football always being carried by marines for the president. It has known its carried at all times, even the Wiki on it says this, would be a weird setup if it wasn't available to him at all times, same as the USA system.

PaperTyger · 08/04/2022 20:22

If the war is moving to the so called contested dombas region then peace keepers should be able too Go in at the very least to secure nuclear site's already put at massive risk.
The 100% peace to Keep was before he invaded and had his forces massed on the border
That's when the UN should have held the line.
But now it's%80 peace to keep , they can do that whilst we let Putin do his worst in dombas? Fair?

Igotjelly · 08/04/2022 20:22

It’s absolutely normal for Putin to be seen with the nuclear briefcase, same as the one that is always at the side of the President of the US.

Igotjelly · 08/04/2022 20:24

@Saltedeggplant cross post!

Ijsbear · 08/04/2022 20:24

OSINTtechnical
@Osinttechnical
·
1h
Russia is moving to mobilize 60k reservists.

Ijsbear · 08/04/2022 20:29

Statements from some of the better twitterati that 121,000 children have been forcibly taken to Russia and 600,000 people in all.

Igotjelly · 08/04/2022 20:29

@Ijsbear

OSINTtechnical *@Osinttechnical* · 1h Russia is moving to mobilize 60k reservists.
Looking at how well the real army have performed I wouldn’t be holding out much hope for what they have left in reserve.
Ijsbear · 08/04/2022 20:30

found the source:

121,000 children 'forcibly deported' to Russia, Ukraine’s rights commissioner says

Russian troops have “forcibly deported” more than 600,000 Ukrainians, including about 121,000 children, to Russia, Ukraine’s human rights commissioner, Lyudmila Denysova, said.

In a statement posted on Facebook, Denysova said residents of the temporarily occupied city of Izyum in the Kharkiv region are being forcibly moved to Russia.

Denysova said:

This is not the first time Russian troops have used such tactics. After bringing the city to a critical situation, the enemy offers a conditional corridor to Russia, ostensibly to save people, leaving people no choice.

Currently, Russian media report that they have deported 615,000 people from Ukraine, including 121,000 children.