If there was a general election tomorrow and you were an ordinary woman on an average wage..

[Kreuzberg]

Who would you really vote for ? A party wishy washy on self ID and other trans issues with a gobby brash deputy leader who puts her foot in it and a lacking in charisma but well meaning leader or a party that implemented austerity, savage cuts to all public services, oversaw the deaths of 150,000, deceitful, pork barrel politics, corrupt, but with a teflon coated populist leader, plummy voiced slick mps and a less wishy washy stance on self ID (although not necessarily to be trusted)
What is most important to women earning £30,000 who are going to be hugely affected by the spiralling cost of living, struggling to heat their homes, feed their kids ? Issues very much the result of conservative policies like brexit, austerity etc or trans issues ?
I'm not pro self ID but not cat in hells chance I'd ever vote tory either. Their past record is not erased just because they say they know what a woman is. I'm addressing this to average earners too as they are on the front line.

I work in state schools. Nobody in their right mind would vote Tory if they really knew what they have done to schools.

Labour

Can you name a handful of benefits this 12 year old Tory government has delivered?

We have many more people in receipt of food parcels and loads more folk presenting as trans/non binary than 12 years ago. Does that count?

Is hat a joke ?

Don’t know, except not conservative.

I am a single mum earning average wage. I do not like Starmers stance and very disappointed in his leadership

I would vote Labour but I am centre left voter and always voted Labour (apart from last election I would not vote for JC)

But it’s not my vote that’s really needed it’s floating voters and those more to the centre. If LD got their act together I may have voted for them but they are lost in the wilderness too

women-uniting.co.uk/respectmysex/

Here's a list of questions to ask the unwitting doorstep campaigners if they arrive.

Most of them will look slack jawed and horrified.

Useful if people don't understand the issues too. The full size one is at the previous link I posted.

Whoever is best placed to give the SNP a kicking. My contempt and loathing of the nationalists overrides everything.

Pretty much how I feel. By choice I would vote Labour, but in Scotland the issue of nationalism dominates the political landscape. I can't get worked about trans issues and generally trust Labour to make life better for more women and children than the Tories.

I'd hope for a sensible small party or independent on the ballot to vote for otherwise I'd spoil my ballot. It doesn't matter anyway, our MP is shockingly awful but always gets a huge majority simply because they are Tory. Even if the opposition vote all went to one other candidate, our MP would have to lose a huge number of votes for it to make a difference. No one from any party ever even canvasses here, they know there is no point.

Labour, I tick all of the boxes you mentioned plus I'm single and living on my own, it seems like there is nothing to help people like me financially.

XDownwiththissortofthingX

@scorpio32
I'd vote Tory, and I'd vote Tory even if Labour went full volte face and declared that women were adult human females.

I've not forgiven them for the chaos they caused last time they were in power - devaluing education, loading the NHS with PPI, selling our gold at rock bottom prices, enabling the gambling industry, the war in Iraq, bankrupting the country

Anyone who things labour is better than the Tories have very short memories.
Fantastic absence of logic here

"I'm going to vote for a criminal cartel who are running the UK into the ground RIGHT NOW, because something something something that somebody else did over a decade ago"

Jesus wept.

The point is we need different options. Everything that has been done over the last 4 decades has served to make the rich richer. Not only that, but the whole system is now rigged against making a living by working.

Capitalism has failed here: we cannot make a living in the U.K. through our own labour (that’s small ‘l’). Anyone with any interest in economic history should know that pushing the interests of the rich, and having an economy built on nothing but inheritance, always results in the same issues. Whatever name that system carries: whatever else it claims to be: whatever means it uses to justify itself. People resent working for nothing to prop up the power and wealth of those who have never had to earn it. Resentment is spreading everywhere and people are finding scapegoats to attack.

We need other options. Where are they??

Local - there's an independent party wanting to focus on local issues.

Senedd - anyone who can get Labour out of power - 20+ years and in charge of NHS - which is worse than England - and Education planning big reforms which as a parent I think bad and have seen teachers on here express concerns about - and history of not listening and ploughing ahead regardless.

MP - my MP is Labour and has a poor record - and frankly on a recent police behavioral issue was dire.

So Senedd and MP tatical voting may well mean Tory but depends as some Tory polticans here have been pretty poorly vetted - so would depend on who they were.

Doesn't mean I'm not concerned about rising living costs, or that I think Boris Cabinet is doing even well let along good - but I've voted Labour, Lib dem and Plaid Cymru - and none look like good bets from my part of the world currently.

Howver there's a fair bit of time before next general election and much can happen.

Capitalism has failed here: we cannot make a living in the U.K. through our own labour (that’s small ‘l’). Anyone with any interest in economic history should know that pushing the interests of the rich, and having an economy built on nothing but inheritance, always results in the same issues. Whatever name that system carries: whatever else it claims to be: whatever means it uses to justify itself. People resent working for nothing to prop up the power and wealth of those who have never had to earn it. Resentment is spreading everywhere and people are finding scapegoats to attack

Absolutely. We need a reformer, no matter what colour flag they’re flying.

I was talking about the profits enjoyed by the elite few individuals/corporations who hold ridiculous sums of cash/assets that it is now impossible not to earn a profit from. They’re raking in obscene amounts just by existing. At this point they’ve won capitalism.

I’m not against capitalism, my life has been comfortable because of it; however we don’t have true capitalism (stamp duty holiday? What the f was that!?! It cost billions!) and a lack of honesty about the fact it does need intervention to work and can’t exist as a true self regulated system if we want lots of other social and economic factors to work too.

** Labour every single time. I'm sorry but there's bigger issues at stake than self ID.

This current government are a shower who only care about themselves and the wealthy, and they need to go.**

^This. I will vote Labour

Someone other than the Tories. Mr Johnson may know what a woman is, but his behaviour towards them in his private life especially makes him unfit to even be an MP, never mind leader.

@balalake

Someone other than the Tories. Mr Johnson may know what a woman is, but his behaviour towards them in his private life especially makes him unfit to even be an MP, never mind leader.

That’s an interesting point.

@Kreuzberg

Who would you really vote for ? A party wishy washy on self ID and other trans issues with a gobby brash deputy leader who puts her foot in it and a lacking in charisma but well meaning leader or a party that implemented austerity, savage cuts to all public services, oversaw the deaths of 150,000, deceitful, pork barrel politics, corrupt, but with a teflon coated populist leader, plummy voiced slick mps and a less wishy washy stance on self ID (although not necessarily to be trusted) What is most important to women earning £30,000 who are going to be hugely affected by the spiralling cost of living, struggling to heat their homes, feed their kids ? Issues very much the result of conservative policies like brexit, austerity etc or trans issues ? I'm not pro self ID but not cat in hells chance I'd ever vote tory either. Their past record is not erased just because they say they know what a woman is. I'm addressing this to average earners too as they are on the front line.

Re: the "oversaw the deaths of 150,000" comment.

I think you're referring to austerity being blamed for this and therefore the Conservative Government.

Two things problematic with statements like that:

1. the figure quoted was actually 120,000 between 2010 and 2017, so not an annual figure.

2. academic studies did NOT prove a clear link between austerity policies and these deaths. See here:

fullfact.org/health/austerity-120000-unnecessary-deaths/

A range of factors could explain that and not necessarily the fault of government policy. The figures only accounted for England as well.

Different parts of the UK have different reasons for voting Labour or Conservative. In Scotland, the Conservatives are the second biggest party as Labour has long been weak on the Union. An added complication for Labour is their poor record in the devolved government in Scotland as well as their claim devolution would kill nationalism dead.

I think it said a lot when the Red Wall in England voted Conservative as well. Labour has a lot of problems and they don't have a clear, consistent message.

As long as they do, the Conservatives and the SNP will benefit massively.

Labour are not automatically 'good' to vote for. They have to prove it too.

@DownWhichOfLate

By voting Labour you’re supporting their view that a woman does not exist in the way they used to.

That's 100% not true. Labour is clearly treading carefully to avoid prejudice to the trans community - this is laudable. In walking this tight, legally correct path, they haven't yet got their messaging correct.

@Nearlyeaster88

Boris might be a pillock but there's no way I'm voting labour as they currently stand.

But you'd vote for a criminal, a liar & a chancer. Ok.

@Ithinkitsadoughnut

Well, if they don't know what a woman is, it wouldn't give me much hope on what they can know. I don't see Keir Starmer as well meaning, I see him as terrified of giving an opinion or taking a stance. If labour were in power, we would all still be in lockdown. And as for our defence.....

The lockdown thing is absolutely ridiculous. You're swallowing the Tory lies. As for Defence, Tories have been in power for 12 years & it's not great.

I honestly don’t know, and I’ve voted in every election since I came of voting age. I’m really sad to step away from my party, but I’m afraid the issues around Self ID are causing me to struggle. I certainly won’t be out on the doorstep or delivering leaflets again.

@Nightlystroll

I haven't heard what Labour's policies are so, for me, it's difficult to judge who to vote for yet. Single issues like cakegate or self ID probably won't influence me, unless I felt it left me less equal. (Having been brought up in a time when I had less rights than men, I've no desire to return to then.) Nor would a person's accent or knighthood. 🙄 I never discriminate on class. Ball's in Starmers court.

Starmer comes from a very ordinary background & earned his knighthood for services to law and criminal justice. Vote for whoever you want but get your facts straight.

Once upon a time, I was Labour, but the last election here, SNP. I just can't do this shit anymore.

@Georgeskitchen

Have labour actually got any policies? We are still paying off the billions from Tony Blairs PFI and Labour haven't been in power for over a decade. After the last 2 years we have billions to pay back from 2 years of lockdowns, furlough, NHS, Covid etc. Money doesn't grow on trees so where in cloud cuckoo land do you think its all coming from?

Ask the Tories. Ask them where the 37 Billion they spent on Track & Trace, which never worked went. Or the billions on wasted PPE which went to Tory donors and was thrown away....