Ukraine Invasion Part 12

[MagicFox]

I see the other thread is filling up so starting the twelfth...

The one thing it appears Trump was right about was that Nordstream 2 was a threat to European security.

BBC ukrainecast also very good. Although didn't appreciate presenter Gabriel Gatehouse shitting his pants about Nuclear War in the first week. My anxiety has subsided a lot since then.
I hope everyone is doing OK.

@Papertyger Can I ask what Egaltyne article you referring to, please?

@WhathaveIdoneagain think they mean this?
www.ft.com/content/503fb110-f91e-4bed-b6dc-0d09582dd007

Sorry sad. I don’t think it’s likely, although the armed forces will no doubt be expanded - back to what they should have been anyway. Conscription is for wars of survival and we are not likely to face that here. All of Europe is between them and us. Which is why we should support them though

No, Sunak is resisting any increase in defence spending, the cut to infantry troop numbers, from 23k to 19k is still going ahead - his argument is the UK already meets the 2% GDP target but of course GDP has dropped due to CV, so its cuts.

^^ yes that one. It's excellent.

@WeAreTheHeroes

The one thing it appears Trump was right about was that Nordstream 2 was a threat to European security.

In what way? It has never flowed any gas and even at the height of the cold war, channels were left open for the export of Russian raw materials (and payment in $) which we have always bought in huge amounts.

Kremilin now saying that supply routes into Ukraine are now considered "Fair game"

I can't understand your response there Alexander?

It may be empty now but the Idea was to use it?

[quote eglantine7]@WhathaveIdoneagain think they mean this?
www.ft.com/content/503fb110-f91e-4bed-b6dc-0d09582dd007[/quote]
Thank you.

@WeAreTheHeroes

The one thing it appears Trump was right about was that Nordstream 2 was a threat to European security.

Yes, agreed. When you look back at how intently the German Chancellor then pushed it through, and how he went to work for Russian resources companies days after leaving office, and how he's still not condemning Russia ... it's hard to escape the suspicion that the Chancellor of Germany was a Russian puppet all along.

Thank heavens that was a while ago and Merkel was after, and the new guy seems to have backbone.

Gosh ljsbear really?

@Papertyger

I can't understand your response there Alexander?

It may be empty now but the Idea was to use it?

Putin went into Georgia in 2008, Crimea in 2014, used Chemical weapons in Syria.

I don't see how buying Russian raw materials (which we have always done, even during the cold war) has anything to do with it.

The fact is we do not produce enough oil/gas etc for our own needs, so we buy from Russia or Saudi... both abhorrent regimes & it wasn't that long ago that OPEC pretty much wrecked our economies... hence the move to seeking new fossil fuel sources, leading that search were many UK companies.

Trying to pin the blame on one european country, is silly, we are all responsible, we stood by and kept voting in pro Russian Govt's for many years, as i pointed out, Putin was a proven dictator long before NS2.

@Papertyger

Gosh ljsbear really?

Article from February 4th

www.politico.eu/article/outrage-germany-ex-chancellor-schroder-gazprom-board-nomination/

Yes Britain also very much responsible for the rise of Oligarchs and Putinband co.
www.newstatesman.com/culture/books/2022/03/how-global-britain-props-up-putins-gangster-state
Neoliberalism

He may not be PM material but Corbyn has always been on the right side of history and dignified in spite of the attacks on his character
www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/russia-ukraine-war-jeremy-corbyn-right-putin-oligarchs

Agree eglantine - and of course it’s not just the Russian Oligarchs..

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/mar/10/sanction-oligarchs-britain-foreign-finance-trade-deficit-russia-abramovich

www.theguardian.com/football/2022/mar/11/shouldnt-someone-in-football-also-care-about-the-war-in-yemen-just-a-little

[quote eglantine7]He may not be PM material but Corbyn has always been on the right side of history and dignified in spite of the attacks on his character
www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/russia-ukraine-war-jeremy-corbyn-right-putin-oligarchs[/quote]
I can’t get behind Corbyn in any way. Tg he’s old news

@QueenOfThorns

Thank you for posting the link to the New Yorker article, MagicFox, that was a very interesting read.

I’m sorry if this has been asked before, but can anybody link to some good videos or podcasts about the history of the Soviet Union, please? I did history at school, but both GCSE and A level concentrated on late 19th and 20th century UK and Germany, so I don’t know much about the USSR. I lived through its ending, but I was fairly young, so I don’t remember a great deal!

If it helps, I've been using the bbc bitesize resources on the Cold War to teach my (homeschooled) children?

Re defence spending just heard we’re 5th highest or fourth

According to R4 right now

Thanks for that very informative article about the history and motivations of the oligarchs and siloviki, and the likely strengthening of ties with China.

Link again:

Inside Putin’s circle — the real Russian elite
www.ft.com/content/503fb110-f91e-4bed-b6dc-0d09582dd007

@MarshaBradyo

Re defence spending just heard we’re 5th highest or fourth

According to R4 right now

A reflection on how little others spend, rather than what UK does.

A sea faring nation with less than 20 frigates is quite frankly a disgrace.

So much of our budget is taken up with Trident, which doesn't really help in 99.99999 % of conflicts.

Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov speaking on Russian state TV: "We have warned the US that pumping weapons [into Ukraine], which they have orchestrated, from a number of countries is not just a dangerous move, it also turns these convoys into legitimate targets."
twitter.com/bbcwillvernon/status/1502646782651781120?s=21

Info on defence spending by NATO members, by country.

www.nato.int/nato_static_fl2014/assets/pdf/2021/6/pdf/210611-pr-2021-094-en.pdf

The NATO guideline is that to maintain armed forces of the right calibre and readiness, then spending should be 2% of GDP or higher. UK is amongst the 10 that meet that guideline

Well, if Russia bombs weapons' convoys on their way to Ukraine things could get very interesting. Sabre-rattling or an excuse to expand the war into another target?

Potentially positive development here.