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The Invasion is ongoing...Part 8

999 replies

Damnloginpopup · 04/03/2022 22:14

Following on...

OP posts:
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11
notimagain · 05/03/2022 21:43

@Damnloginpopup

I'm also a little sceptical that the videos I've seen are of actual Russian soldiers rather than Ukrainians in Russian uniforms making them for propaganda reasons. It would be very easy and very convincing to make and release and very effective at garnering support.

There is scope for that but in the case of one of the Russian pilots shot down today and taken prisoner there seems to be fairly compelling evidence that he is probably the genuine article (aviation, especially fighter aviation is a small world and I gather his face has been found elsewhere in images from a happier time).

I have to say we can quote the conventions all we like here but in the real world I think it was generally accepted by those in the trade that you’d just killed somebody’s mate or bombed somebody’s house and then got captured you might be lucky to survive very long.

youhadmeatjello · 05/03/2022 21:43

So what do we reckon this list of countries who have imposed sanctions are in for? Are there sanctions that russia can employ back? Is the “list compiling” designed to be another ominous threat?
We do seem to be being singled out a lot. I think our politicians should let NATO as a whole speak out tbh.

RedToothBrush · 05/03/2022 21:46

Spokesperson Maria Zakharova warned: “Russia will not forget Britain's desire to co-operate with ultra-nationalist forces in Ukraine and the supply of British weapons to the Kyiv regime.

"The sanctions hysteria in which London plays one of the leading, if not the main, roles, leaves us no choice but to take proportionately tough retaliatory measures. London has made a final choice of open confrontation with Russia.

"Such a development convinces us once more that Russophobia and the aim to undermine the Russian state are integral elements of Britain's foreign policy."

Zakharova previously accused the BBC of playing "a determined role in undermining the Russian stability and security", after it announced it was suspending the work of its journalists in Russia as authorities passed legislation cracking down on foreign outlets.

Oooo we properly pissed em off didn't we?

cakeorwine · 05/03/2022 21:48

I think our politicians should let NATO as a whole speak out tbh

NATO is not a political organisation.

It needs politicians to speak out. But carefully.

It needs to be a united message.

youhadmeatjello · 05/03/2022 21:48

That’s what I mean, sorry it was badly phrased.

BitterTits · 05/03/2022 21:48

Between @vera99's superb post and @TheSillyMastiff's hilariously astute one, I'm feeling a lot better than I did earlier this evening, so thank you Flowers

TheSillyMastiff · 05/03/2022 21:49

@youhadmeatjello

So what do we reckon this list of countries who have imposed sanctions are in for? Are there sanctions that russia can employ back? Is the “list compiling” designed to be another ominous threat? We do seem to be being singled out a lot. I think our politicians should let NATO as a whole speak out tbh.
Cut off from Gas, not oil that's too lucrative. Maybe some trading sanctions such as import fees. He still needs to make money.

Guesses would be Germany, Italy, France, and then he will keep mouthing off about the UK like we're some James bond villain and release some compromising "stories". More saber rattling at Finland and Sweden.

Tigersonvaseline · 05/03/2022 21:50

Anthony blinken v Liz TrussBlush

I totally agree she's not up to this challenge.
I admit o don't know much about her.... I'm judging how she comes across
But I feel it instantly is apparent just how deep and resonant blinken is.

Calm, intellectual.

But Liz????

At this crucial time???

I'm not sure who should replace her. Perhaps we need a war cabinet And see if any other parties have someone suitable???

otterlybonkers · 05/03/2022 21:56

@EmbarrassingHadrosaurus

I don't know how i feel about Zelenskyy saying that NATO is responsible for the deaths (no fly zone). I understand his anger and frustration and admire his resolve, but it is such a damning thing to say. I feel helpless in the face of it all

Have you written to your MP to show your support for accepting refugees and offering appropriate resources?

dont police me, please. Ive no time for that shit, ok?
RedToothBrush · 05/03/2022 21:56

He's not going to draw up a list of British MPs with significant investments in Russia to be sanctioned is he?

workisnotawolf · 05/03/2022 21:56

I also used to think we should have encouraged Ukraine to compromise quickly to save lives. However, my thoughts have changed and I have come to believe that the Ukrainian people are defending us (NATO, EU countries, in particular Russia’s immediate neighbours). If they had let it all happen smoothly for Russia, eventually Putin would have gone for the next country.

This is partly where my feelings of guilt and shame and cowardice are coming from. Yes, I do realise Ukraine have their own propaganda machine - but these are my own current thoughts.

TheSillyMastiff · 05/03/2022 21:59

@RedToothBrush

Spokesperson Maria Zakharova warned: “Russia will not forget Britain's desire to co-operate with ultra-nationalist forces in Ukraine and the supply of British weapons to the Kyiv regime.

"The sanctions hysteria in which London plays one of the leading, if not the main, roles, leaves us no choice but to take proportionately tough retaliatory measures. London has made a final choice of open confrontation with Russia.

"Such a development convinces us once more that Russophobia and the aim to undermine the Russian state are integral elements of Britain's foreign policy."

Zakharova previously accused the BBC of playing "a determined role in undermining the Russian stability and security", after it announced it was suspending the work of its journalists in Russia as authorities passed legislation cracking down on foreign outlets.

Oooo we properly pissed em off didn't we?

Ah fuck em, honestly. We are literally sat on the throne of NATO laughing.

We've obviously lied and lied to them as we've taken their money in to our political system and now we've stabbed them in the back and kept the cash 😂

But do we care, nope, not one bit. Putin can die a pauper for all we care right now, and were completely untouchable. And of India keep playing funny fuckers we will pull £55million of foreign aid, so they need to start towing the line soon.

Won't be long till they drag HMQ out of her covid isolation to address the world.

otterlybonkers · 05/03/2022 21:59

@workisnotawolf

I also used to think we should have encouraged Ukraine to compromise quickly to save lives. However, my thoughts have changed and I have come to believe that the Ukrainian people are defending us (NATO, EU countries, in particular Russia’s immediate neighbours). If they had let it all happen smoothly for Russia, eventually Putin would have gone for the next country.

This is partly where my feelings of guilt and shame and cowardice are coming from. Yes, I do realise Ukraine have their own propaganda machine - but these are my own current thoughts.

This makes sense to me. What would you think NATO should do now? It's very difficult to take in.

Asking anyone!

otterlybonkers · 05/03/2022 22:01

Also, is there any significance to the Israeli guy going to visit putin? Again something im not well up on, forgive me Blush
A few other websites stating this is important.

workisnotawolf · 05/03/2022 22:02

So nobody is concerned about cyber attacks targeted at U.K.? Have we strengthened in that regard? Other than utilities can they do anything to the stock exchanges? - hopefully there are mechanisms in place to suspend trading.
I am more worried about this kind of thing then anything else.

letmesleep123 · 05/03/2022 22:03

@RedToothBrush

Putting a warning on this one: This one is a difficult read

www.huffpost.com/entry/mariupol-ukraine-despair-resolve_n_6223cc08e4b04a0545d76c6e
Mariupol Diaries: Scenes Of Despair And Resolve In The Besieged Ukrainian City
Associated Press journalists document what life has become in the southeastern Ukrainian city, which would be a key victory for the Russians.

Mariupol unfortunately was always going to suffer the most. I grew up in Mariupol and still have family there so know it well.

The Russians are concentrating on Mariupol because it is geographically and strategically important, but also because from 2014 it became home to an extremist Neo-Nazi Battalion Azov, which started off as volunteers, but later became a very influential part of the Ukrainian National Guard.

The fear the locals have for them is unimaginable. They have links to terrorist organisations around the world, are influential, armed and kill willingly.

Since 2014 they have been reported for extreme violence, including rape, torture, executions etc. The first article links to the Report on the human rights situation in Ukraine in 2015 - 2016. It's 53 pages on violations of Human rights of Ukrainian Citizens.

I quote:

"In addition, Ukrainian armed forces continue to position themselves near towns and villages while armed groups have embedded deeper into residential areas, further endangering the local population. The risk of re-escalation of hostilities therefore remained high."

The same tactics are being used today. Ukrainian army position themselves in residential buildings, schools and hospitals.

www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/3/1/who-are-the-azov-regiment

time.com/5926750/azov-far-right-movement-facebook/

Human rights violations and war crimes

A 2016 report by the United Nations Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights (OCHA) has accused the Azov regiment of violating international humanitarian law.

The report detailed incidents over a period from November 2015-February 2016 where Azov had embedded their weapons and forces in used civilian buildings, and displaced residents after looting civilian properties. The report also accused the battalion of raping and torturing detainees in the Donbas region.

yoolia · 05/03/2022 22:03

Anyone have any idea what these "proportionately tough" retaliations are likely to be? Cyber attacks?

borntobequiet · 05/03/2022 22:06

He's not going to draw up a list of British MPs with significant investments in Russia to be sanctioned is he?

They’ll be OK having just had a pay rise.

youhadmeatjello · 05/03/2022 22:07

I think attempted cyber attacks have been happening since this all kicked off, as friends who work in relevant industries have reported they’ve had to tighten security a LOT due to an insanely high amount of attempts.
But yes, I wouldn’t be surprised if that happened.
I wonder what’s most likely to be targeted.

Hillsmakeyoustrong · 05/03/2022 22:07

Does anyone else think Putin is trying to prove to the Ukraine that the West isn't really their ally? By waging war on Ukraine, and threatening nuclear warfare on anyone who interferes, he knows they will have to fight alone and increasingly feel disenfranchised, isolated and betrayed. Already Zelenskyy has shown his (understandable) upset at us. I wonder if it's a divide and conquer strategy between Ukraine and Europe as opposed to the NATO alliance.

I honestly have no idea, I'm just speculating along with everyone else.

wheresmymojo · 05/03/2022 22:07

Does anyone have a link to the Flightradar24 thread?

I can't find it...

Interesting movement of a UKR plane which landed in Poland where there are 2 x US Airforce Black Hawks, it's now taken off again.

Doesn't say where it's going (but obvs not UKR).

changeyourname11111 · 05/03/2022 22:08

@yoolia

Anyone have any idea what these "proportionately tough" retaliations are likely to be? Cyber attacks?
Yes I am wondering as well and worried.
wheresmymojo · 05/03/2022 22:09

Has anyone seen the updates about the two missiles over Russian city Belgorod?

Not clear if it's UKR offensive or a ploy by RU to justify harsher tactics...

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 05/03/2022 22:09

@wheresmymojo

Does anyone have a link to the Flightradar24 thread?

I can't find it...

Interesting movement of a UKR plane which landed in Poland where there are 2 x US Airforce Black Hawks, it's now taken off again.

Doesn't say where it's going (but obvs not UKR).

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4490301-FlightRadar24-high-traffic-following-invasion
Shuuu · 05/03/2022 22:12

I think perhaps a cyber attack is coming, or he will refuse to trade with us. Whatever he does it won’t be a physical attack as he has so far avoided conflict with NATO countries. He can’t declare war against us as he doesn’t want war with NATO. We still rely on Russia for oil so it’s likely he’s securing deals with other countries and then he will cut us off