The Invasion is ongoing...Part 8

[Damnloginpopup]

Following on...

It’s crazy how the media twist things.

They’re reporting that Putin said the sanctions were akin to an act of war.

When you actually read what he said it was “But we’re not there yet”

Lots of people on Twitter saying things like “well if he thinks it’s a war then let’s go through with it, close the skies” and similar things.

I just can’t believe the media is out to stir this up. It’s not a video game!

@Jisforjelly

It’s crazy how the media twist things.

They’re reporting that Putin said the sanctions were akin to an act of war.

When you actually read what he said it was “But we’re not there yet”

Lots of people on Twitter saying things like “well if he thinks it’s a war then let’s go through with it, close the skies” and similar things.

I just can’t believe the media is out to stir this up. It’s not a video game!

Quite right, the sheer volume on warmongering on social media and the media in some places is shocking.

War is not fun
War shouldn't be glorified
War should be avoided

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-60631735

Workers are refusing to unload Russian oil from a German-flagged ship, which is moored at a major British oil refinery.
The Seacod vessel is berthed near the Stanlow Oil Refinery in Cheshire.
The UK government has banned ships with "any Russian connection" from entering its ports due to the country's invasion of Ukraine.
However, the Unite union said cargo was not included in the ban and has called for ministers "to close this loophole".

@Jisforjelly

It’s crazy how the media twist things.

They’re reporting that Putin said the sanctions were akin to an act of war.

When you actually read what he said it was “But we’re not there yet”

Lots of people on Twitter saying things like “well if he thinks it’s a war then let’s go through with it, close the skies” and similar things.

I just can’t believe the media is out to stir this up. It’s not a video game!

Agree with this entirely. It's appallingly irresponsible. Jen Psaki had to almost directly appeal to the US media not to ratchet up discourse around nuclear war.

@Clavinova hi Clav long time no see. Bill Browder who was responsible for pushing sanctions against oligarchs long before this juncture and knew first hand how deadly Putin could be and has long been beating the drum for sanctions and reining him in.

But he wasn't listened to or to be more precise wilfully ignored by many western politicians. Well, Ukraine and the west are certainly paying the price now. Well worth following to on Twitter and he bigged up this piece on investigatory journalism about matters closer to home and could be the reason why we are behind others now in taking decisive and swift action to punish Putin and his cronies now.

twitter.com/Billbrowder?

www.tortoisemedia.com/audio/lord-of-siberia/

Thanks for new thread.

Can anyone direct me to where I can see what Putin actually said?

@yoolia

Can anyone direct me to where I can see what Putin actually said?

Sky just payed it. I suppose they will play it again at the top of the hour.

Agree what pp have said about warmongering in the media and SM. The propaganda machines on both sides are well oiled.

@elephantmarchingin I know but it feels like they are trying to cause so much outrage that the world doesn't feel like they can stay out of it any longer - firing on the power plants, attacking civilians and journalists, violating the ceasefire. Its like they are trying to break all the rules of war and I don't understand why.

Can't copy and paste by sky have just updated their scary post!

@TheSillyMastiff so true in the old day's Kings had to fight with their armies and live or die on the field. Now they hide behind their screens and cheer on the sacrifices of others, mostly poor, hapless working-class conscripts in the case of the Russian army. The Ukrainians have shown in many instances real kindness to those they have captured their beef is with Putin and his cronies not the Russian people. That's why Zelinsky has so inspired the world he's not grifting, grandstanding and lining his nest but prepared to pay the ultimate price to lead his country, unlike the hollow men who run ours.

Is Bill Browder the person who was sentenced to 9 years in prison by Putin (in absentia)?

I love how Putin continually calls a bloody invasion 'special operations'.

This is interesting from a couple of weeks ago - how widespread this feeling is in Russian minds I have no idea. If this mindset still holds then they may see sanctions and their effects as further re-inforcing their 'support; behind their 'war leader'.

[quote Natsku]@elephantmarchingin I know but it feels like they are trying to cause so much outrage that the world doesn't feel like they can stay out of it any longer - firing on the power plants, attacking civilians and journalists, violating the ceasefire. Its like they are trying to break all the rules of war and I don't understand why.[/quote]
Exactly and NATO know this. Just have to hope that they continue to have clear heads

That is interesting @vera99 and so very sad at the same time.

I keep flipping from feeling less worried to more worried and then back to less worried. I hope clear heads prevail.

[quote vera99]This is interesting from a couple of weeks ago - how widespread this feeling is in Russian minds I have no idea. If this mindset still holds then they may see sanctions and their effects as further re-inforcing their 'support; behind their 'war leader'.

[/quote] This is where I also wonder if making pariahs of Russians themselves rather than only Putin's regime - throwing competitors out of sporting events, cancelling performers etc - might actually be counterproductive in the long term.

Putin will eventually fall, and when he does, we must have a policy of rapprochement and normalisation of relations with Russia.

@Natsku what is the mood in Finland. My son is flying back to Tampere this afternoon after a few days home. We had a serious conversation at the beginning of the week about what to do if Putin were to carry out his threats and it was probably the lowest point of a year that has already been utterly crap for me personally.

@Natsku

Why are the Russians violating the ceasefire? Are they trying to force NATO to act?

Cos they have no discipline or reliable communications.

Red.

It's simply not for us to judge.

I wouldn't ask my child not to not mention Ukraine but it's not for others to judge really.
Because they don't know the parents reasoning.

One of the Tory donors is Alexander Temerko - born in Ukraine -

2015
Former Ukrainian businessman argues that Cameron and Obama should send weapons and ammunition to support the government in Kiev.

www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/11/britain-should-arm-ukraine

Temerko fled to London in 2004. In 2006, Labour MP Chris Bryant led a debate on Russia:

Chris Bryant
(Rhondda) (Lab) (Nov 2006)
One reason why we are unable to extradite people to the Russian Federation is simply that every time an extradition case has come before the British courts, they have adjudicated—in my mind, rightly—that there is no opportunity of ensuring a fair trial for the defendant and no opportunity of ensuring that the person will not be subjected to torture. Nearly all of those cases have been heard before District Judge Timothy Workman...Indeed, Mr. Workman said explicitly in the case of Alexander Temerko, who was vice-president of the oil giant YUKOS:

“I am satisfied that the request for the extradition of Mr. Temerko is in fact made for the purpose of prosecuting and punishing him for his political opinions.”

The same Chris Bryant is now upset that Alexander Temerko is a major Tory donor having obtained British citizenship.

@ClaudineClare

Is Bill Browder the person who was sentenced to 9 years in prison by Putin (in absentia)?

He got kicked out of Russia, i think cos he was getting involved in a bunch of Russian companies financially. Then the company was raided. He ordered an investigation, found documents missing and a fraud that was about to fleece the company for millions, then the investigator was arrested and then died in jail after mistreatment. Or something like that.

The result was he got the
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnitsky_Act
Magnitsky Act through congress which sanctions anyone involved in human rights abuses

Its since been copied by other countries.

Russia then tried to go after him via legal means which didn't work. And Browder thinks he is at risk of falling out of a window. He campaigns against Russian gangsters and basically he pissed off some real nasty fuckers.

Clearly hit a nerve.

For a "Dr" you're not very good at reading! It wasn't your comment that was quoted

Fine, then hands up for an apology. I skipped 30 pages of the thread and had lumped your post in along with others still going on "…but NATO". This, after listening to XR activists talking about ‘NATO imperialism’ and witnessing a ‘No to NATO’ protest in our nearest biggest city. A while back you seemed to also be in the ‘but nato’ camp. If that’s a misunderstanding of your position then great.

Not sure that I see any real need to comment on my username.