The invasion has begun

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Russia has begun it's invasion of Ukraine. Who knows where this will end.

apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-europe-russia-moscow-kyiv-626a8c5ec22217bacb24ece60fac4fe1

What do you think it should happen then? USA, UK and the EU send troops to Ukraine and start an all out war with Russia with nukes involved?

No-one wants this. But what's the alternative to not challenging Russia. Just sit back and watch him invade country after country? There's no easy answers here.

China hold a similar view about Taiwan as Russian holds about Ukraine. They think it rightfully belongs to them. There is concerns that whilst the west and NATO is dealing with Russian and looking the other way, China will take the opportunity to 'take' Taiwan. whilst China and Russia may not work together, they certainly will not prevent each other from achieving their aims.

No-one wants this. But what's the alternative to not challenging Russia. Just sit back and watch him invade country after country? There's no easy answers here.

exactly!

The Russian people have a long history of uprisings so yes, I suspect with today's rapid information movement any rebellion would be swift to rise. Russian youth are plugged into the internet and wider globalised culture than their Soviet era elders.

Sanctions are one thing, but removing Russia from Swift and effectively cutting the country out of the world economy would pre-empt and encourage rebellion in Russia and lead him to have huge problems on the home front too.

This is on us. We have turned a blind eye to Russia's underhanded tactics in undermining democracy and interference in elections for years. Their social media "tactics" have brought us huge issues in the USA and here with Brexit. This is the consequences.

@Tigersonvaseline

I'm all for British sanctions but we're an insignificant small useless Island. China need's to do something and the EU and of course the states

It won’t just be us

30% drop in stock market will be due to combined effort

Which oligarch?
Not all " oligarchs" are in support of Putin?

Corbyn was lambasting NATO and Said they are provocative. Do we care about Corbyn except to thank the British public for stopping him coming to power?

This isn’t about the suffering of ordinary people or their opinions - our western govts will say enough to keep us in line but meanwhile the big boys won’t jeopardise their lucrative contracts.

Russian cities are left without gas so that the west gets their supply. Throughout the Cold War the US were supplying food to Russia.

The meaningless sanctions are a sop to our concerns. There’s the official version and then there’s the money.

What do you think it should happen then? USA, UK and the EU send troops to Ukraine and start an all out war with Russia with nukes involved?

Well, hopefully not the nukes part...

But I remember learning about the appeasement policy of 1937 in school. Where Britain and it's allies decided to basically ignore German agression in the hopes that if Hitler got some of what he wanted, he'd calm down and not take any more. Because there wasn't an appetite in Britain for war. And thinking how stupid that was as a policy, because the insane power-grabbing madman wouldn't stop grabbing shiney things just because you decided to turn a blind eye.

It does feel awfully like history repeating itself.

Putin takes Ukraine. Belarus is already effectively a puppet state. He's then pressing up against the Polish border, and in an ideal position for launching an attack on the Baltic states.

And China is watching the western response and thinking, "If they don't stop Russia seizing Ukraine, will they actually do anything if we seize Taiwan?"

I don't want a war - of course I don't - but I can't help but think that defending Ukraine might be the least bad option. Because otherwise we have an expansionist Russia, confident the west is all talk, and an expansionist China who's just seen that proved.

None of the outcomes are good.

@swirlsy

What do you think it should happen then? USA, UK and the EU send troops to Ukraine and start an all out war with Russia with nukes involved?

But at what point do we have to act? How far will he go?

Very simple. Go back to the guarantee Gorbachev was given in 1990 that NATO won't extend its forces to Eastern Europe and let Ukraine be another Finland.

The problem is that the actual government of the Ukraine sold out to American interests and won't hear of becoming another Finland.

This invasion should never have happened except there are too many foreign interests trying to control world resources, not just Russia.

@Tigersonvaseline

I'm all for British sanctions but we're an insignificant small useless Island. China need's to do something and the EU and of course the states

We’re incredibly important to the oligarchs. We’ve been utter whores- a playground and save haven for their dirty money. Kick them out. Freeze their assets, repossess their wives’ Kensington Mansions. Have their sons called into the Masters office at Winchester, their daughters arrested in Oxford and deported. Putin will listen to them.

@Tigersonvaseline

Which oligarch? Not all " oligarchs" are in support of Putin?

Corbyn was lambasting NATO and Said they are provocative. Do we care about Corbyn except to thank the British public for stopping him coming to power?

lol we instead voted in pro Russian Boris instead.

@GuyFawkesDay I think if we turned the screw so tight that it caused an uprising we in the "west" would suffer also. Putin would retaliate before it got to that stage

Terrifying, I can’t imagine the fear those poor civilians must be feeling. Where it will end is chilling. How many innocents will die, it’s sickening.

Completely devastating

What is the West learning from this?

How much we truly value democracy
The importance of NATO and the security alliance
To never ever trust Russia and its interests again, they are gangsters and exectioners
To prioritise our essential infrastructure

This situation, as awful as it is, will snap the West out of its indulgent slumber and we must all wake up and recognise where we are in 2022 and invest and prioritise accordingly.

@swirlsy

The only thing that will stop him is military support from the West. Will the west do this? No. It will cause world war III. It's a mess

It is a mess, but I also think not doing anything & assuming Russia will be satisfied & stop with Ukraine is deluded

I agree with you though. Putin will keep going, Belarus, Moldova. Slowly into each one. Just like a certain somebody did 80 years ago. I just believe the West won't rush to help militarily. I'm not saying that's right.

Lol I'd rather vote in Kermit the frog 🐸 than have Corbyn at the helm.

@Alondra Agree, former UK ambassador to Russian said that the West didn't understand the importance of Ukraine to Russia.

@GuyFawkesDay I think if we turned the screw so tight that it caused an uprising we in the "west" would suffer also. Putin would retaliate before it got to that stage

What can he do? He isn't going to take on the whole of the West.

We should absolutely tighten the thumbscrews, and then some more, flush out the little rat and deal with him before he takes everyone down.

I agree with you though. Putin will keep going, Belarus, Moldova. Slowly into each one. Just like a certain somebody did 80 years ago. I just believe the West won't rush to help militarily. I'm not saying that's right

Err these two countries are already Russian states in all but name.

Don't be afraid to say it fair

Putin is just like Hitler.

That is what he is. Invading countries for no reason apart from to control them and expand his aims and influence.

Hitler and Putin are one and the same thing.

@QuentininQuarantino

I’m so worried, my sons godmother lives in Kiev with her little family. She wasn’t expecting this at all and was staying calm only yesterday.

Poor woman. I hope she's ok.

I really felt for the people of Kyiv when the news showed footage of gridlocked roads, as people try and get out of the city to rural areas.

If I was there, I don't think I'd stop until I got to Poland. It's terrifying.

The UN seem to be very quiet. Is their silence because Russia is a permanent member of the security council or what?

Extinction

Perhaps the school's , Yes.

I can't see how we make any impact compared to Paris, New York etc.
Of course do our part but we have zero Clout except perhaps the " cachet" of some of our school and university.

Very simple. Go back to the guarantee Gorbachev was given in 1990 that NATO won't extend its forces to Eastern Europe and let Ukraine be another Finland.

How much importance do you place in what Ukraine wants?

We should have dealt with Hitler far more robustly when we had the chance, we should not make the same mistake again.

Putin has gone rogue, he has lost his mind - no one of sane mind triggers a war in a neighbouring country for no reason whatsoever.