Prince Andrew stripped...

[Sarahlou63]

Of all royal patronages and military titles.

Guess mummy has finally had enough.

He's certainly lost any opportunity to play a major role in the commemorations of the 40th anniversary of the Falklands War that are planned for later this year

I hadn't spotted that angle.

Yes, it'll sting

Epstein paying Fergies debts is murky business, who did she owe money to and why?

Fergie owed £78K to a former aide and Epstein negotiated it down to £15K which he then paid off. It must have been well worth what was effectively peanuts to him to have 'royalty' beholden to him

It's worth noting once again that there were more contact numbers listed for Fergie in Epstein's little black book than there were even for Andrew who had plenty.

I'm curious as to how Epstein made the contacts he did

Maxwell was his facilitator. She had a glittering list of contacts and was seen gadding eveywhere that counted.

*That's one way of looking at it.

However he has lost titles which, if you're someone who cares about that shit, must hurt like hell. His mum has basically made a public announcement that he is not worthy or respectable.

No amount of money makes up for that.*

No but the amount of money he has for doing absolutely nothing must go quite a way to making up for it.

Let’s not pretend this is a real or valid punishment because it just isn’t. It’s nothing more than an empty gesture.

Aides are just normal everyday people aren't they earning a normal salary?
I can't imagine an aide being willing to more or less write off £60k, and the £15k that Epstein paid must have been peanuts to him.
What the heck else did the aide get out of it 😳 ? Why turn to Epstein and not to Andrew, the bank for help?

But I agree Epstein must have enjoyed having both Fergie and Andrew in debt to him.

@Lockdownbear

Aides are just normal everyday people aren't they earning a normal salary? I can't imagine an aide being willing to more or less write off £60k, and the £15k that Epstein paid must have been peanuts to him. What the heck else did the aide get out of it 😳 ? Why turn to Epstein and not to Andrew, the bank for help?

But I agree Epstein must have enjoyed having both Fergie and Andrew in debt to him.

I was thinking the same.

@Kanaloa

*That's one way of looking at it.

However he has lost titles which, if you're someone who cares about that shit, must hurt like hell. His mum has basically made a public announcement that he is not worthy or respectable.

No amount of money makes up for that.*

No but the amount of money he has for doing absolutely nothing must go quite a way to making up for it.

Let’s not pretend this is a real or valid punishment because it just isn’t. It’s nothing more than an empty gesture.

I hear what you're saying but effectively he is being shamed before his family and underlings and that must sting.

The humiliation is far worse than any financial punishment.

But that may well follow too.

His mum has basically made a public announcement that he is not worthy or respectable.

Actually she has repeatedly rewarded him and stood by him after he has done things that clearly demonstrate that he is neither worthy nor respectable.

He just finally got the sack when it became unavoidable.

By the age of 61 many people have suffered worse.

Yes, although he was supposedly crying, boo hoo, his mother never would have done this. And action was only taken when it was unavoidable. They ignored the situation for as long as possible.

I think it shows that although she is The Monarch, when it's 1 monarch against two in line, the two in line can trump the monarch.

''I hear what you're saying but effectively he is being shamed before his family and underlings and that must sting.''

Yes, now, finally he feels shamed.

@Lockdownbear

Aides are just normal everyday people aren't they earning a normal salary? I can't imagine an aide being willing to more or less write off £60k, and the £15k that Epstein paid must have been peanuts to him. What the heck else did the aide get out of it 😳 ? Why turn to Epstein and not to Andrew, the bank for help?

But I agree Epstein must have enjoyed having both Fergie and Andrew in debt to him.

According to this article Fergie was pretty much on the verge of bankruptcy at the time and part of the £78k was money the aide had invested in her failed company:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1363468/Prince-Andrews-ex-Sarah-Fergusons-aides-accept-quarter-debt-owed.html

Maybe he just thought it better to cut his losses and get out with what he could rather than take the risk of seeing just a few pence in the pound months later.

I hear what you're saying but effectively he is being shamed before his family and underlings and that must sting

He's been a graceless boor in full view of family, underlings and plebs alike for years.

I don't think shame is in his vocabulary.

He hasn't lost the HRH title but won't be using it. Talk about smoke and mirrors.

@Viviennemary
I may be wrong but I don't think they can legally remove the hrh or the Duke of York title. I think it's s his constitutional place in the firm, but he can agree to no longer use it,just like Harry.

[quote Zombiemum1946]@Viviennemary
I may be wrong but I don't think they can legally remove the hrh or the Duke of York title. I think it's s his constitutional place in the firm, but he can agree to no longer use it,just like Harry.[/quote]
Its that basically a very very very fancy way of saying "trust him" ?

For some reason, I'm not inclined to trust him ? Anyone care to give me a reason to ?

Or is there a very slight undertone there of "trust him, because he's a royal" ?

@Viviennemary
For me this is likely Charles saying you can't be trusted, you're sacked, go hide behind the gates and don't darken the royal public platform again. This is a screw up to far.

He's certainly lost any opportunity to play a major role in the commemorations of the 40th anniversary of the Falklands War that are planned for later this year

To my shame I'd forgotten that - not the Falklands of course, but the fact it's the 40th anniversary

And yes, I've no doubt he'd have enjoyed strutting around that ...

To my shame I'd forgotten that - not the Falklands of course, but the fact it's the 40th anniversary

Somehow, I don't think anyone is going to be allowed to forget that in 2022. Obviously we start with Boris winning it single handed and how it's somehow all connected to why Brexit was needed and finally the UK being a world leader in penguin preservation.

Personally I feel sorry for the families of the fallen that will see their sacrifices shoehorned into an obscene display of nationalism, patriotism, and deflection. But that's what you get if you choose to wear the uniform, I'm afraid.

Who could forget Maggie in the tank, with a union jack scarf. Dad reckons that's the only reason she won the next election. Yes, I can see Boris being that desperate.

@Zombiemum1946

Who could forget Maggie in the tank, with a union jack scarf. Dad reckons that's the only reason she won the next election. Yes, I can see Boris being that desperate.

Your dad’s not the only one. Most of us around at the time thought that.

*I hear what you're saying but effectively he is being shamed before his family and underlings and that must sting.

The humiliation is far worse than any financial punishment.

But that may well follow too.*

No it isn’t. Do you genuinely think not being allowed to wear an outfit is worse than losing all that money and luxury that protects him?

And nobody would say this about ANYONE else. Why bother punishing anyone if being ‘shamed’ is the worst punishment ever.

Why bother asking for fine payments, you’ve already been shamed? Why sue any businesses that do something wrong, they’ve already been shamed and that’s far worse than financial punishment.

This is just another one of those times when the blatant stupidity of the royal family is clear and obvious.

He’s just like the rest of us, but worse. He doesn’t have some inbuilt nobility that will render him somehow immune to financial punishment because he’s already been ‘shamed’ by an empty punishment that will have little to no affect on his real daily life.

@Zombiemum1946

Who could forget Maggie in the tank, with a union jack scarf. Dad reckons that's the only reason she won the next election. Yes, I can see Boris being that desperate.

Story of that picture…

iconicphotos.wordpress.com/2009/04/23/thatcher-in-a-tank/

@Zombiemum1946

Who could forget Maggie in the tank, with a union jack scarf. Dad reckons that's the only reason she won the next election. Yes, I can see Boris being that desperate.

Not sure it it's too OT, but my memory:

...
Mr Neil Kinnock re-opened the row over the Falklands war last night when he told a Television South audience that it was a pity soldiers had to die to prove that Mrs Thatcher had guts.

Mr Kinnock, Labour's spokesman on education brought boos and protests when he said that until the Falklands war Mrs Thatcher was "the most loathed prime minister in modern history."

Someone in the audience shouted that Mrs Thatcher had "showed guts." Mr Kinnock replied: "It's a pity others had to leave theirs on the ground at Goose Green to prove it."
...
www.theguardian.com/politics/1983/jun/07/past.richardnortontaylor

[thread drift]

Pity MT and her advisors weren’t paying more attention in the Spring of 82 and also that they didn’t learn from this:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Journeyman

She was very fortunate she had a Foreign Secretary who was prepared to take responsibility….

The rest is history.

[/thread drift]

@DGRossetti
Whilst I wasn't a Kinnock fan, to me, he had a point.