Emma Tustin is a murderer

[DueyCheatemAndHow]

Finally. We can say it.

I've just utterly broken down for Arthur.

Yes, life with a minimum sentence of 29 years and 21 years for him.

So will she served 29 years plus the 10 year sentences so 39+ years ?

Dislike of children also should not be allowed.

I'm sorry but you are bonkers - how would that work? How can you ban people not liking something? Children are inherently different to adults as they are not fully developed, they can be difficult, noisy, need a lot of attention and stressful to be around. None of that is their fault, as their brains are developing and it's up to responsible adults to take on parenting them, if they are able and willing. However we don't have to like those behaviours or be happy when we have to listen to screaming in a supermarket.

It's OK to not want children in your life - it doesn't make you an abuser to opt out of becoming a parent! Just like it doesn't make you an animal abuser to not want pets. It's different to not want to be around children and actively choose that, by not having them and not dating people with them. Knowing you don't like them yet choosing to have them purely to abuse them is something else entirely.

@onreeooh yes! I think a good thing for many of us to do is to look at how we speak about children. Can we improve.

It's great that she got 29 years

29 years doesn't seem long enough but am sure she will have extra punishment dished out by other inmates.

@AndreaC67

I must admit the sentencing seems rather lenient, unlike most people i don't wish her harm in prison, thats not what it is there for but they both should have got whole life tariffs, certainly she should have.

They will out late 50s early 60s, with plenty of life left to live.

Whole life orders are incredibly rare. I would not have expected one in this case.

At least there is no possibility of her ever having another child now.

Ive been here 13 years and I’ve seen them @Mufasa1118. Some really worrying ones. One in particular that has stayed with me from a step parent who is also a social worker.

@bluebellYellow

So will she served 29 years plus the 10 year sentences so 39+ years ?

No, she will serve a life sentence with a minimum of 29 years in custody, after which she will be eligible for parole. Parole does not end your sentence. You continue to serve it outside of prison and will be subject to restrictions for the rest of your life.

@Bagelsandbrie

Sentencing-

Not long enough. But there you go. It’s some form of justice.

Arthur asserted his dad would kill him before he met ET.

We should remember this. Arthur witnessed DV when his parents were together. He witnessed alcoholism when his mother and live-in partner were together and he lived there. There was DV in that relationship also.
He witnessed his mother stab her partner in a drunk rage.
He fortunately didn't witness the later stabbing that resulted in the mother's partner's death.

It was after this that he went to live with his father - in an annexe at his paternal grandmother's house. So even then, Dad was likely doing fuck all and leaving it to his mother to parent his child while he went on Plenty of Fish.

Is 60 years old a "wizened old shrew" now?

Only the evil bitter ones 😑

(I'm 60 in 18 years, I definitely don't think it's old 😬).

I think the Judge made it plain that 29 years is the minimum and that she might never be released. Her application for parole will only be considered after 29 years.

@Newpuppymummy

His actual mothers statement is interesting. She seems to be portraying herself as mother of the year.., I’ll never get to read him a bedtime story again. Well she’s in prison for 12 years for murder so presumably he would’ve been too old for bedtime stories by the time she got out.

It’s absolutely not her fault what happened to her son but given she is in prison for murder and was addicted to drugs and alcohol, he witnessed severe domestic abuse in her care I don’t think she is the best placed to be portraying herself in this way.

She's still a Mother who will never get to see her son again

@vickyp0llard it could easily work.

Hatred of children is not taken seriously enough. There is not even a proper word for it.

If a man is racially abused right now he can report that to the police.

So if I say to a man "you are a black b#$tard" he can report me to the police for a hate crime. It is taken seriously.

However, if I say to a child "I hate children". Or "I hate you because you are a child". That currently cannot be reported to the police. Even though I am discriminating against them because they are a child.

See how children have lesser human rights than adults?

Hate is a strong word and I rarely hear people saying they HATE children. Many people dislike them because they can't deal with their behaviours and excess noise, and they want to live a calm, quiet life. A lot of people also want to live for themselves and choose other experiences over parenting, which is a perfectly valid choice. Can you not see that is worlds away from choosing to abuse a child!

I don't like cheese - doesn't mean I want to ban it or burn down all cheese factories. Means I just personally avoid it in my life.

I think they both should have got whole life terms to be honest. Sarah Everards killer got a whole life term. I don’t see these two as any less abhorrent. But I’m happy to know they both have very long sentences.

@ICalledYouLastNightFromGlasgow

29 years doesn't seem long enough but am sure she will have extra punishment dished out by other inmates.

I think 29 years is a pretty good result. There's no certainty she'll be out after that, no half time for good behaviour, and she'll be recallable for the rest of her life if she does anything of concern. No crime needs to be committed to recall her to prison. In the absence of a whole life sentence which as a PP said is exceptionally rare, I think this is a good outcome.

@AndreaC67 Whole life tariffs are very, very rarely given and their are quite detailed sentencing guidelines around when they would be used, for example, in the Wayne Couzens case, the judge used the context of "terrorism" angle to explain his sentencing to whole life.

Whole life orders are incredibly rare. I would not have expected one in this case

The killer of Sarah Everard got one and quite right too but it could be argued that Tustin's crime is at the very least on par with what that monster did.

I 'm a great believer in the reform of criminals, look at the guy who took on the London Bridge terrorist with a tusk? but some people are beyond redemption and she is one of them, i do not think other people should have to live along side this woman in her sixties, perhaps having young carers tending to her needs as she grows old, unaware of her crimes.

They will out late 50s early 60s, with plenty of life left to live

He’ll actually be out at aged 50.
He’s 29 now, and got 21 years.

@Bagelsandbrie

I think they both should have got whole life terms to be honest. Sarah Everards killer got a whole life term. I don’t see these two as any less abhorrent. But I’m happy to know they both have very long sentences.

The fact he was a police officer and used that as a means of kidnapping her was aggravated enough to impose a whole life.

[quote Flapjacker48]@AndreaC67 Whole life tariffs are very, very rarely given and their are quite detailed sentencing guidelines around when they would be used, for example, in the Wayne Couzens case, the judge used the context of "terrorism" angle to explain his sentencing to whole life.[/quote]
Didn't she terrorise that poor lad?

@Bagelsandbrie

I think they both should have got whole life terms to be honest. Sarah Everards killer got a whole life term. I don’t see these two as any less abhorrent. But I’m happy to know they both have very long sentences.

Sarah Everard's killer was a police officer who abused the power of that role. It's a very different case to this, which is sad but unfortunately not uncommon.

Whole life orders are reserved for extremely serious cases (like serial killers, for example), not for extremely emotive ones.

@Mufasa1118

I see the people on this thread calling Emma Tustin a monster.

What all about all the women you see here on mumsnet saying

• I hate children
• I regret having children

-i hate being a mother

• I hate being a stepmother.

There are SO many threads like that on here. And those women are usually given sympathy on here like "oh yes being a mum is hard". People on here usually focus on how the adult feels, no thought at all is given to how the child feels.

The adults needs and wants are thought of first, you see that all over mumsnet.

I've seen so many absolutely disgusting "I hate being a stepmother threads on here" where the women talk totally about their own feelings and talk about their stepchildren like they are a piece of shit.

Emma Tustin was a stepmother . Taking out the murder. What is the difference between her actions, and the women on here on mumsnet saying they hate their stepchildren? Isn't that abuse ?

Let's not turn this into a step mother bashing thread. ET had her own children taken off her. She wasn't fit to be a biological mother either.

The majority of stepmother threads state they are struggling to bond, the father often doesn't set appropriate boundaries and then leaves them to cope with challenging behaviour etc. The vast majority state they treat their stepchildren with kindness but they don't love them as much as their own. A stepmother sounding off on an anonymous forum cannot be compared to what ET has done