Tragedy on Alec Baldwin's film set

[Gingernaut]

Alec Baldwin has shot two people with what was thought to be a prop gun.

One person, he cinematographer is dead and the second has been hospitalised.

Absolutely stunning news.

www.nytimes.com/2021/10/21/us/alec-baldwin-shooting-rust-movie.html

Guns, by their nature are inherently dangerous. I've seen someone shot by a high velocity round from a rifle, luckily in the foot.
My question is, why real guns with real live ammunition on a film set.
Surely it needs legislation that only replica firearms can be used.
But then, this is America !

Even with an armourer on set, if gun safety has been questioned to the point of it being part of a walk out, it's no longer just on that one persons shoulders IMO. It's who appointed them and oversaw them and then ignored the very loud complaint from staff about the problem.

@rushedruined

Even with an armourer on set, if gun safety has been questioned to the point of it being part of a walk out, it's no longer just on that one persons shoulders IMO. It's who appointed them and oversaw them and then ignored the very loud complaint from staff about the problem.

Yes I agree, I was meaning that it’s not totally on the shoulders of the producer.

My question is, why real guns with real live ammunition on a film set.

I can cope with the real guns, but the need for live ammunition baffles me.

Fatal accidents waiting to happen.

The armourer is ultimately responsible though - that's not scapegoating, it's her job. She is only 24 and other armourers apparently turned down the job as so many weapons were needed. Neither her nor the AD have made any comment at all. Both are alleged to have been careless on previous productions.

Surely they should be using guns that are identical to real ones but which cannot fire anything.
They are supposed to be acting!

While it's her job and her responsibility, of course it's scapegoating to solely blame one person.

If they didn't check she was competent in previous jobs, it's on them. If they didn't respond to active charges of incompetence on set, it's on them.

@rushedruined

While it's her job and her responsibility, of course it's scapegoating to solely blame one person.

If they didn't check she was competent in previous jobs, it's on them. If they didn't respond to active charges of incompetence on set, it's on them.

I think a lot of that is hearsay to be honest, quoted from mysterious “sources” and when a tragedy occurs false reporting and someone waiting to spread some dirt always sadly happens.

I’d wait till the facts come out, which they will, clearly something went drastically wrong, how it occured and who’s fault it was remains to be seen. The armourer might not even have been on set that day.

@Bluntness100

She was on set. She placed 3 guns on some wooden structure/table.
This is as much as a fact as you can get from various sources of reporting based on witness statements up to this point.

and by various sources I mean reports by media outlets.
There's nothing mysterious about that.
It's a fact that she was there and that she handled several weapons, including the one that caused the accident.
There are warrants, affidavits, witness statements.
🤷‍♀️

The armourer might not even have been on set that day.

Surely any time fire arms are being used the armourer should be on set, isn’t their job to oversee the use of weapons? If they don’t have to be on set I’d question that as a process in general.

I’d have thought so but they had a staff walk out - it’s not clear if she was one of the ones that were basically on strike over conditions that day and they didn’t have any covering or even if they did.

@Hodgehog

I’d have thought so but they had a staff walk out - it’s not clear if she was one of the ones that were basically on strike over conditions that day and they didn’t have any covering or even if they did.

This is from the Guardian:

A police search warrant states that Halls selected the weapon from a tray of three prepared by the movie’s armourer, Hannah Gutierrez Reed, and handed it to Baldwin with the words: “cold gun”, indicating that the prop firearm was not loaded with a live round.

@LawnFever

The armourer might not even have been on set that day.

Surely any time fire arms are being used the armourer should be on set, isn’t their job to oversee the use of weapons? If they don’t have to be on set I’d question that as a process in general.

I went and googled because I wanted to know and yes an armourer does need to be on set if a gun is being used.

‘The weapons master is required to be on set whenever a weapon is being used. The Actors’ Equity Association’s guidelines state that, “Before each use, make sure the gun has been test-fired off stage and then ask to test fire it yourself. Watch the prop master check the cylinders and barrel to be sure no foreign object or dummy bullet has become lodged inside.” Further, “All loading of firearms must be done by the property master, armorer or experienced persons working under their direct supervision.”

apnews.com/article/entertainment-business-arts-and-entertainment-new-mexico-movies-2079a865611116a7301f5d755ac4ca0c

@Hodgehog

I’d have thought so but they had a staff walk out - it’s not clear if she was one of the ones that were basically on strike over conditions that day and they didn’t have any covering or even if they did.

Even if she did walk out, they would’ve needed a new armourer in place before this scene was taken because weapons were being used to be following the correct H&S procedures.

The walk out was originally reported to be over the fact the hotel conditions were so poor, it’s now being twisted to say it was about the guns, so I’m not sure what I believe on that one.

The rest is speculation as to how this went so tragically wrong, for example the assistant director is supposed to check the gun before handing it over and it wasn’t.

The reason they use live ammunition is because of the recoil etc, it’s hard to mimic it, and for me the practice needs to be made illegal. The other issue is the gun laws are very different in New Mexico.

The hotel walk out was because they were being put up 50 miles or minutes' drive away and they were concerned that tiredness would impact on their safety travelling to and from set. Not a huge extrapolation to imagine that on set mistakes could be made by someone tired who hadn't had as much sleep as they could have had had they been staying in a hotel nearer to the set.

I’m not sure three quarters of an hour is a massive commute to most people, it depends on th hours worked. I read it was due to the shit motel they were put up in. So the media is all over the place.

@Bluntness100

I’m not sure three quarters of an hour is a massive commute to most people, it depends on th hours worked. I read it was due to the shit motel they were put up in. So the media is all over the place.

Doesn't seem massive to me and I'm an old crock. I bet their roads are better than the narrow lanes I drive on.

Did anyone watch his new interview? I found it very uncomfortable. I didn't like the way he dismissed his wife. Seemed really ego centric.

@edisonbulb

Did anyone watch his new interview? I found it very uncomfortable. I didn't like the way he dismissed his wife. Seemed really ego centric.

I mean, that's him all over, his past behaviour alludes to the same.

You could also ask why his wife was attempting to answer questions put to him?

She also craves the limelight, I think he did right shooing her away.

@edisonbulb

Did anyone watch his new interview? I found it very uncomfortable. I didn't like the way he dismissed his wife. Seemed really ego centric.

I only saw a bit, picking someone up from the train, but she seemed a bit weird in the bit I saw. Was she wandering round taking photos of people on her phone?

just seen it

yeah, he is quite short-tempered with her but he looks so fucking stressed and I'd behave the same way if I had just shot someone by accident, was out of my mind with grief, disbelief, worry and was confronting the media stalking me (while my kids are in the car!) and tried to quickly say a few words for which I needed clarity and focus, not being interrupted.

I don't know why she was piping up, nobody asked her🤷‍♀️

Yes I have to say I found her irritating and the way she kept walking across him, He’s having the worst time of his life no doubt and she kept chipping in when he was trying to talk.
I get she’s trying to protect him etc but she was irritating.