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Anyone follow the coverage of the Sarah Everard case today and want to vent?

999 replies

HangingOver · 29/09/2021 14:05

I'm home alone today and except for whatsapping my friends have nothing to do with this incandescent rage and hopeless sadness.

Anyone else need to talk? Sad

OP posts:
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7
LexMitior · 29/09/2021 21:03

@Offmyfence - The pre-meditation of what he did suggests that he had prior offending of some kind. Unless someone connects the dots to various abuse of prostitutes (which he did use) then we may not know. It would be very unusual to go from exposing yourself to this kind of crime. Its not very plausible.

If you look at whole life killers, or people who get more than 30 years raping of children, murdering them, they are usually profoundly deviant and have been for years.They are often charming, or nice in public.

wewereliars · 29/09/2021 21:05

Citycommuter I think LexMitior works in criminal law, that's the impression I get. I am a solicitor, though not in crime, and your comments on punshment are risible. HTH

Offmyfence · 29/09/2021 21:07

[quote LexMitior]@Offmyfence - The pre-meditation of what he did suggests that he had prior offending of some kind. Unless someone connects the dots to various abuse of prostitutes (which he did use) then we may not know. It would be very unusual to go from exposing yourself to this kind of crime. Its not very plausible.

If you look at whole life killers, or people who get more than 30 years raping of children, murdering them, they are usually profoundly deviant and have been for years.They are often charming, or nice in public.[/quote]
I agree, a lot is to come.

When it does and if the police force had "knowledge" then a massive reform is needed.

Too little to late, but it is needed.

RIP Sarah

LexMitior · 29/09/2021 21:08

@CityCommuter

"Well you want apparently to get some special torture for this guy? What kind of person thinks like that? A good person or a person who has a seriously odd idea about justice"

@LexMitior so you think justice is having that monster living in luxury and being treated with respect in prison for a few years? The only one who's seriously odd is you and you already know that... You're just one of those people who's always looking for a fight...

You're the one calling for torture, and its here for all to see. If you advocate for the death penalty, I'm just asking if you are up for it as we don't have such a person on hand and because lets see, it might just be after today a teensy bit alarming to have a member of the state with the ability to control you and torture you with authority.
pelosi · 29/09/2021 21:08

@Offmyfence

Do you think that he may have other victims? I have wondered that he may have.

Lies often have a germ of truth. WC claimed he ripped off a sex worker and had to give the grandma/pimps a woman to make up for it.

While that’s clearly bullshit, I’d be looking at whether he had been abusing sex workers.

pelosi · 29/09/2021 21:09

Gang not grandma.

Offmyfence · 29/09/2021 21:10

[quote pelosi]@Offmyfence

Do you think that he may have other victims? I have wondered that he may have.

Lies often have a germ of truth. WC claimed he ripped off a sex worker and had to give the grandma/pimps a woman to make up for it.

While that’s clearly bullshit, I’d be looking at whether he had been abusing sex workers.[/quote]
Yes, I think it all points to a "rise" in crime, culminating in rape and murder.

Could the force have stopped it? Maybe?

It's all so dreadfully sad.

RIP Sarah.

MrsRobbieHart · 29/09/2021 21:16

@wewereliars

and the hire car was booked in his own name, so maybe he's not the sharpest knife in the drawer
See this is what makes me think he’s done this at least once before. He’s not a stupid man. He planned this out to the last detail, he has managed to avoid any consequences for previous crimes of indecent exposure, he’s even known as “the rapist”, and managed to pull that off as just banter. He has his wife and everyone else completely convinced he was a normal family man. He engineered his career to allow himself access to vulnerable women. I don’t think hiring the car in his name was stupidity. I think it was the sloppiness that comes with the confidence of experience. A first time offender would absolutely have made sure it wasn’t in his name.
CityCommuter · 29/09/2021 21:19

@LexMitior ok point taken but since Sarah's horrific murder in March I have never heard of so many people (from all walks of life btw) being in favour of the reintroduction of Capital punishment. I live in London where people aren't shy at giving their views on any topic. I know there have been other previous terrible murders but for some reason Sarah's has been the one that's got people talking and expressing their opinions on CP the most compared to previous horrific crimes...

wewereliars · 29/09/2021 21:20

MrsRobbieHart yes, defintitely arrogance there. He may not be stupid, but he got away with a lot through his job and bullying the vulnerable maybe, so didn't need to cover his tracks.

I don't think he ever thought he would be caught, going down with his family, most likely to gloat over her remains, that is beyond words!

yourhairiswinterfire · 29/09/2021 21:21

Utter piece of shit. I wish him the worst prison experience imaginable, and I hope he feels the same fear at not being able to escape what's coming to him.

As for the police and ''we don't view him as a police officer''. Get to fuck. You viewed him as a police officer even though he was openly nicknamed 'The Rapist' by colleagues, other police officers. You viewed him as a police officer even after multiple allegations of indecent exposure. You don't get to wash your hands of him now that his behaviour, that you didn't take seriously enough, has escalated. He's one of yours. Own it.

minou123 · 29/09/2021 21:24

The police vetting process is not exactly a brilliant process, is it?

I just remembered that recently a police officer was convicted of terrorism, oh and having images of children sex abuse.

I looked it up and here it is

amp-theguardian-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/apr/01/ben-hannam-met-police-officer-guilty-belonging-banned-neo-nazi-terror-group?amp_js_v=a6&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQKKAFQArABIIACAw%3D%3D#aoh=16329465234878&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fuk-news%2F2021%2Fapr%2F01%2Fben-hannam-met-police-officer-guilty-belonging-banned-neo-nazi-terror-group

(Sorry the longest link in history)

This adds to my rage at the police denying they have a problem.
At least with the NHS, schools etc, they recognise failings and try to correct processes to stop it from happening again.

But the police always seem to say, nope nothing to see here, just one bad apple, trust us......You Must Trust Us

LexMitior · 29/09/2021 21:25

@wewereliars

MrsRobbieHart yes, defintitely arrogance there. He may not be stupid, but he got away with a lot through his job and bullying the vulnerable maybe, so didn't need to cover his tracks.

I don't think he ever thought he would be caught, going down with his family, most likely to gloat over her remains, that is beyond words!

I have little doubt he did it for his own arousal and pleasure. Again, he didn't think he would br caught. And he could visit her again and again, without any worry.

I'm glad he was caught. He would have done it again, I think.

sleeponeday · 29/09/2021 21:27

@SkinnyMirror

Because it was done by someone who is supposed to protect women. Why is that hard to understand?

Exactly. And she was doing everything we are told to do to keep ourselves safe.
It exposed the fact that none of that makes a blind bit of difference and it's frightening.

The thing is, even if by some miracle he'd chosen a woman who instantly refused to comply... this was planned. He'd equipped himself. All saving Sarah Everard would have achieved was a different victim. And while that would be everything in the world to her poor family, boyfriend, and friends, it would just have meant that a different set of loved ones were in hell tonight.

Statistically, there are women reading this thread who will have partners, or sons, who have raped or will rape someone. It's a dead cert. And those rapists are scaffolded in it by the society we all create, or allow, or turn a blind eye to. We can't believe they do it - but someone's partners, sons, and brothers are. Rapists aren't hatched in eggs before dwelling beneath a stone.

As for the squawks that, "It's less than 1% of men!" well, not quite, sweetie. This article discusses prevalence, when anonymous self reported surveys are done, where between 4% and 16% of male university students will freely confess to having raped someone, just as long as the act is described, and not called rape (almost all simultaneously claim never to have raped anyone). Several have raped several women. And the belief is that for these men to admit to what they have done - the acts - is an understatement of true prevalence. Of course that still means most men don't, won't, and have not. But taking the most hopeful of estimates, 1 in 25 have raped someone while at university. Nice thought.

We know that a girl reports a rape happening on school premises every single day of the school year in the UK. That's the girls who even report it. And that isn't counting the lesser forms of sexual assault. And yet we live in a time where girls are having their legally-required single sex toilets removed in favour of unisex.

Rape is very, very common. And men like Wayne Cozens know it. Most rapists aren't even charged - fewer than 2% of rapes reported in this country - again REPORTED, when we know most never are - see charges. Rape has effectively been decriminalised. And then something like this happens, and people are amazed. Why? Why are you amazed? Women do not matter in this country in the year 2021. Making rape threats to women with whom you disagree is acceptable now. Ask JK Rowling or Rosie Duffield. That's acceptable, and so is the most extreme, violent and degrading pornography - which teenage boys watch on their smartphones, with nobody around to challenge it other than their peers. A generation are growing up thinking it's normal to choke women and slap them during sex. That anal is fabulous for all sides, prostate and smaller frame or not. This is sex education done in 2021. And we are surprised by the rising misogyny, and sexual violence. Really?

This is the most misogynist time I can remember, and my mother - who was a Women's Movement activist in the 1970s, and started working before the Equal Pay Act - says the same. What use are rights on paper, when kids are being saturated in porn and sexism before they even start secondary school? When women are being referred to in the fucking Lancet, of all places, as "bodies with vaginas"? We are being turned into objects with genitals. And some women seem fine with that, too.

KylieKangaroo · 29/09/2021 21:28

I am in tears tonight, I can't think how to protect my daughter's when they are older, what chance do we have as a society?

Sarah and Sabine two women with their whole lives ahead of them. The world is such a sad place.

peaceanddove · 29/09/2021 21:28

What really frightens me is that I simply don't believe that Sarah was his first victim. I can't shake the feeling that he has done this before.

LeonardBobby · 29/09/2021 21:30

@Pikamoo

We need massive changes to try and go a little way to redressing the imbalance between men and women. A start can be women are not arrested for non-violent offences. If a woman commits an offence she is given a summons to present herself to a police station within an appropriate time period.

I hadn't read that about his nickname among "the lads". Disgusting. I hope they are all held to account. I'm sure they won't be. I hope they at least feel responsible.

This would only lead to more women being coerced by men into being involved in criminality. If a woman won't be arrested for the non-violent offence of handling stolen goods for example, men will pressure women into storing criminal property. Then it can be moved on as soon as the woman is notified to present herself at a police station.
SkinnyMirror · 29/09/2021 21:32

This is the most misogynist time I can remember, and my mother - who was a Women's Movement activist in the 1970s, and started working before the Equal Pay Act - says the same. What use are rights on paper, when kids are being saturated in porn and sexism before they even start secondary school? When women are being referred to in the fucking Lancet, of all places, as "bodies with vaginas"? We are being turned into objects with genitals. And some women seem fine with that, too.

I agree with all of this.

Songsinthekeyoflife · 29/09/2021 21:33

Am so so sick of this. Male hatred of women is absolutely everywhere. Sexism is engrained in every society in the world. We are considered less worthy of education, respect, a decent salary, a peaceful life, a life free of fear, and even life itself. Men are coming for our single sex spaces now; nowhere is safe. I'm so fucking angry.

Poor Sarah, the end of her life must have been unbearable, her suffering intolerable. All at the hands of a man we are supposed to respect by virtue of his job.

The police - as an institution - don't give a flying fuck about women. When I was attacked by my then husband (an ex officer himself), they did nothing, didn't arrest him, didn't inqterview me, nothing, despite two witnesses. Of course he went on to attack me again. They always do, the police know they do too. At last they listened Then he tried to kill me and my daughter. Maybe, just maybe if the police had done something, we wouldn't have had to suffer the second and third attacks .

The Met knew that Sarah's murderer was, at best, a sex offender. They chose to do nothing. She died.

When we aren't protected by those paid to protect us, we are not safe anywhere.

KaptainKaveman · 29/09/2021 21:34

Cressida Dick should have resigned ages ago. She is the definition of incompetence.

The death penalty would suit someone like Wayne Cousins. Years looking over his shoulder in prison is a far better punishment IMO.

wewereliars · 29/09/2021 21:34

It's just beyond sad for family, a beautiful girl destroyed, for some monster's sexual gratification.

It seems as though he was acting out a sexual / porn fantasy, and there will have been a long build up to this in terms of his behaviour.

The whole history of his behaviour needs examining and the Met police's response to it. This clearly did not come from nowhere.

Cottonheadedninymuggins · 29/09/2021 21:36

@MintJulia

The fact that he handcuffed her chills me to the core. She trusted the police apparatus to ensure her safety, even when she was being unfairly arrested.

And they knew he was a flasher, a pervert! Still they did nothing. Just boys being boys!

I hope his immediate superiors are dismissed without pensions - all of them.

I'll never trust a male police officer again. I'll lock myself in my car and demand a female officer until it gets through. Shame on them.

The key to do so (on police handcuffs) whilst off shift was bought from Amazon too (and thousands are still available!) Terrifying!
OvaHere · 29/09/2021 21:36

@yourhairiswinterfire

Utter piece of shit. I wish him the worst prison experience imaginable, and I hope he feels the same fear at not being able to escape what's coming to him.

As for the police and ''we don't view him as a police officer''. Get to fuck. You viewed him as a police officer even though he was openly nicknamed 'The Rapist' by colleagues, other police officers. You viewed him as a police officer even after multiple allegations of indecent exposure. You don't get to wash your hands of him now that his behaviour, that you didn't take seriously enough, has escalated. He's one of yours. Own it.

I agree. The details of this are sickening and there are people within the Met and the organisation as a whole who need to be held accountable too.

He was clearly a man who should have been kicked out of the force long before he decided to kill Sarah. That doesn't mean he wouldn't have eventually murdered some poor woman anyway - we can't know that and of course it's not impossible he's murdered other women before.

However he would not have had the power, authority and means to abduct Sarah the way he did. For that there needs to be a wider inquiry and as others have suggested reforms that limit off duty officers re carrying police equipment.

annacondom · 29/09/2021 21:37

Terrific post @sleeponeday

LetHimHaveIt · 29/09/2021 21:38

@peaceanddove

What really frightens me is that I simply don't believe that Sarah was his first victim. I can't shake the feeling that he has done this before.
Well, having never been certain that Michael Stone killed Lin and Megan Russell, it occurred to me that Couzens was pretty local to Chillenden in 1998. And doesn't look dissimilar to Stone. Almost certainly not old enough, though.