Chasing up ambulance

[Mariell]

My mother fell and my father couldn’t get her up. He called ambulance 9.30pm.

Called ambulance again at midnight. Ambulance came 5.30am!

This was a couple of days ago and My mother is in hospital.

I live over 300 miles away.

My dad has recently given the emergency cord alarm people my phone number.

He has fallen and cannot get up so cant get to his landline or mobile phone and is stuck on the floor. He pulled an emergency cord and was able to speak.

They have called an ambulance.

Given the time taken recently to get an ambulance to my mother do I call and chase it up?

My parents were doing great but in a very short space of time have their health has rapidly declined so all this is emergency stuff is new to us.

Its extremely difficult in these circumstances and it feels like an uphill battle.

I think you do need to go up and co-ordinate with the hospital on emergency social services assessment and putting things in place for when they get home - you can liturally bring kit home from the hospital for using the loo, having a shower, sitting or perching in the kitchen if doing food, You need to advocate for them and get them to put on file that the hospital and GP and any nursing staff or social services can speak to you and share information. Longer term you need LPAs in place and there is a long lead time on them at the moment so get the applications done and get them in NOW as its a 4 mth lead time and things will change rapidly as you have already found.

If you can afford it there are a few things I would recommend for home. 1. a hot water dispenser rather than kettle, get them used to it NOW before they really need it but can't remember how to use it 2. Many elderly don't have microwaves, sort one now so that carers coming in can quickly do them a hot meal, again get them used to it before they really need it and can't figure out how to use it 3. Bed trays, easy purchase and if suddenly bed ridden can be really convenient 4. Lightweight crockery so its easy to use and not too different. 5. Tablets - get the chemist to box up in days/3 times a day - you generally have to request it and possibly also GP request it. 6 Note it is generally the district nurses that co-ordinate care between social, carers and GP and sometimes also hospitals. It is worth speaking to the GP around this and setting the process off. 7. Be aware of their finances and how they make it all work. Bills, insurances and also that there are Wills in place should one or other pass away and you have to sort the remaining parent out (you don't want assets in one name frozen till probate sorted etc) It is common for bank accounts etc to only be in one name which leaves the other party vulnerable when they pass away and there are bills to be settled etc.

It would also be worth considering if its time for them to move closer to you or a sibling for instances such as this. 600 mile round trips are not conducive to also living normal life whilst caring for parents. I managed it (3 times) with 200 mile round trips but with hindsight would have realised its not that feasible when you have responsibilities at home as well.

I would also look to set things up at home to enable you to drop and go. Have a bag packed with general travel items and snacks for hospital visits, work on car always having half a tank of petrol, make sure you and DH can do online food orders etc, kids are self sufficient for snacks. Everyone knows how to do washing and put away, same for dishwasher. Sounds really basic but after driving 300 miles last thing you want is to arrive home grab a cuppa and get on with washing, cleaning kitchen and so on - in fact I would in hindsight have a cleaner/housekeeper

Anyway I hope things are slowly sorting themselves out and you can get things in place for you parents asap

I'm pleased this distressing situation has a partial resolution.

I've no idea what the better solution is for people in the position of the OP's parents. So many older people won't consent to appropriate arrangements until it's too late - far less grant PoA or any power to make useful decisions.

You can't compel people to make advanced care plans or arrangements - and the result is that there are all too common wretched situations like this.

Hi @Mariell
So glad to hear your dad has been rescued!
Just wanted to signpost a couple of things that might help you for the future that you might not know about. I work for a large GP practice, with around 10,000 patients over 65 so we get a lot of issues like this!

1. Get permission for parents GP to be able to talk to you/other relatives or contact you in an emergency. You only need a signed letter to do that. Make sure you include all phone numbers and email addresses and full names of anyone needing permission. And highlight to the surgery that the permission needs to be a "high priority reminder on the patient's notes", which ensures it will be seen by anyone who accesses the notes. My mum was very resistant to this until I pointed out that if she was unconscious she would want me to be able to tell medics about her allergies and DNAR wishes if necessary.

Power of Attorney does not automatically authorise an attorney to be given information about the person's medical treatment.

1. Ask if the GP surgery employs or uses a 'Social Navigator'. These are non-clinical people who have all the local contacts for agencies who can help patients. Eg day centres, meals on wheels, continence clinics, community matrons, dial-a-ride, etc etc. They will usually do a home visit to talk about what practical help people need and can refer to certain agencies as well as just being supportive. They're not carers so maybe your parents would be amenable to talking to them about what there is available (some things would need to be paid for, others are free under NHS)

1. Ask if there's a Falls Assessment Service who can come and look at your parents accommodation and advise about changes or facilities (and actually refer for some things) which would lessen the risk or effects of falls. They are usually brilliant and get stuff done much more quickly than if you tried to organise the same.

Just a thought for the future (obviously not much help if he has fallen to actually get him up) but an Alexa would be a huge help, no cord to pull and he could have chatted to someone whilst waiting, also could have rung for help very easily.

So glad your Dad got help, op. Yes the Fire Brigade are wonderful. I was in a collision with a car, aged 12 (my fault) right outside the local fire station. This was in the 60s and we didn’t have a phone, let alone mobiles! I must have been with-it enough to give my address, and they went to tell my Mum and actually gave her a lift (we had no car) up to the hospital where I’d been taken! She always made a point of donating to the Fire Fighters Charity after that, as do I!

Please have someone check that their carbon monoxide alarm is working given the sudden nature of their symptoms.

Just a note on ALexa - My Mum had dementia - she could never remember its name and called it my little Robot, no good if you want to get it to do something we had to activate it for her.

We had terrible trouble with both my parents and MIL in getting them to do things in time. My MIL passed away having had only 3 weeks of carers, she died with significant cash assets for when she got old, they were untouched for years despite her dying when she was 89. She refused to use the commode in the am even though carers came in at 8am for cleaning & Brekkie and passed out on the loo down a flight of stairs from v low blood sugars (not diabetic) which meant an admission to hospital during lockdown so we couldn't see her (she wouldn't have understood that and would have felt abandoned) and died 2 weeks later.

I understand people can be awkward or not want things to see them as old (I had an all out row over Mums walker with my Dad and yes its very emotionally draining) but its really important to get over to them that its a back up - its to prevent them having to go to hospital and rely on others and help them manage safely. And ultimately hopefully be able to pass away peacefully in their own homes on their terms with loved ones around them.

So pleased to hear that he’s been “rescued”, even if you will still have worries about what is to come.

It’s so hard when parents become vulnerable. I’ve had so many scary calls, including the one when I was in hospital with Covid and both my parents had fallen and sustained minor head injuries. My elderly aunt kindly went to help them - but in doing so slipped on ice and broke her hip. The four of us ended up in three separate hospitals. Good times! But actually everyone is OK now. It’s not necessarily all downhill.

@SisforSarah

does your dad not know someone who can go round to help?

No-one

Slight derail (agree with PP who say don’t keep calling back).

But how do your parents not know anyone who can help? Professionally I see this all the time, but personally have no experience of it and simply don’t understand how people end up in this situation. My DM lives 120 Miles away. She was ill pre covid and her whole village looked after her- food deliveries, laundry done, dog walked. We have 80 yr old neighbours and regularly help them.
How do you get to a situation where you basically have no one who can help?

It’s good your DM has that but I don’t know a single elderly person (thinking of my grandparents and my friends grandparents) who are sociable. They all either rely on each other and if they unfortunately don’t have a partner then they rely on their children. If they didn’t have their children near them they would be in this exact same situation. Its very easily done. You see threads on here all the time about people not having close friends (or if they’re older and their friends have passed away) this is what happens. Not everyone lives in a village where everyone knows who they are and is happy to run around helping them. I’m not sure how that’s so difficult to understand?

Great update OP.

I was just about to suggest the fire service! DH is a firefighter and they go to a lot of this type of call. The ambulance service is so stretched right now that they are picking up a lot of the 'less urgent' calls and are trained to triage a patient etc.

Home care agencies near us can also be listed as an emergency contact for their pull cord service too. Near us you do pay a small fee but in this scenario where there aren't many people locally available to help, they will respond to cord pulls etc. And do welfare checks.

@GameSetMatch

Honestly it’s awful seeing a loved one on the floor but it’s more important they see to life threatening injuries first a heart attack is much more serious than an elderly person on the floor. They can’t get to you any quicker if you phone and chase up. We need more ambulances and paramedics.

It’s important to leave your father on the floor until the ambulance arrives as you might break one of his bones and cause him more damage if you move him yourself. Have you parents thought about a retirement appartment with an on call warden?

My dad waited 2.5 hours recently, on the ground outside and with a serious head injury. He was bleeding profusely (on warfarin) and had a fractured skull and bleed on the brain. I recently counted 23 ambulances lined up outside the local hospital when visiting DH. Presumably all waiting to drop off their patients. It’s terrible, just so scary where we are with it now.

If you parents are self funding for care they can arrange their own care they don't need to go through social services.

Curamcare is a good website for finding self employed carers.

@RB68 you can change the 'wake word' from Alexa to anything, which might have been a useful thing to do in that circumstance.

I would look at getting a couple of Amazon alexas around the flat, you can link them up to your phone and then just shout ‘Alexa phone xxxxx’
It’s invaluable in these sort of situations, although I know the older generation are wary of them

Alexa is a great idea and great that the fire service helped what a relief

Why doesn't your cousin drive him to hospital or have the GP come assess (given he already has an appt scheduled) rather than waiting for an ambulance when, as we've established, the service is clearly overstretched. There is probably someone equally low priority on the list with no cousin and no fire service to help.

Home care agencies near us can also be listed as an emergency contact for their pull cord service too. Near us you do pay a small fee but in this scenario where there aren't many people locally available to help, they will respond to cord pulls etc. And do welfare checks.

Yes, my mother's care agency were the contact for her Linkline service (I was not a useful contact as I was 3 hours away). It's good to know the cousin is willing to help but if a care agency is being employed anyway to help with dressing etc they could be listed as a contact too.

OP that is great news about the fire brigade, I would never have thought of calling them. I hope your dad recovers well.

Thank you for all the kind replies.

My parents have never used the internet nor do they ever want to and Alexa is ‘new fangled stuff’ that they have no desire to ever use!

They are very set in their ways!

When they get the bathroom door fixed have them do it so it opens outwards into the hall. My mothers retirement flat has this. It turns out they were built this way in case anyone fell behind it like your Dad.

I saw a girl knocked off a scooter and lying in the road recently. I called the ambulance and we were told at least a three hour wait. She couldn't get up and although conscious looked very unwell and had hit her head. Someone called her parents in the end who came in a car and scooped her off the road to be taken to hospital. I was pretty shocked at that.

My mum fell a lot in her last year. You need to find someone local that you can call upon to pick them up unfortunately as the ambulance service can't be relied upon anymore. Luckily I only lived 20 minutes away and we had carers but otherwise it would have been horrific.

We all need to complain about this though and not just accept it. It's horrific.

@Damnyoureyes

No. They ask that people don’t keep ringing as it clogs emergency lines up. This is the norm now. He is warm and safe in his home, the wait can be hours for a fall in the street. Even for obvious broken bones. People are asked to make their own way to hospital if they can walk. There are not enough vehicles. There are not enough staff. There are too many calls, including a large percentage of time wasters. It’s how it is now. Horrendous.

Warm and safe in his home. What's he supposed to do when he needs the toilet??

Glad your dad has someone with him. Hope the ambulance aren't too long

Your parents dont need a review by their GP to arrange carers- I think this would be done via Social Services, or they can arrange it privately.

See how your dad is today.

If he is admitted to hospital they will do a Care Assessment before he is discharged usually. It's just whether your parents will be safe to continue at home or whether their care needs have increased that they need something like a residential home.

When my mum fell he called an ambulance at 9.30 pm. He could not get her up. At midnight he called again and said she was still on the floor.

When the ambulance came after 5.30am and my dad said she had fallen at 9.30pm the previous evening they told my dad off for leaving it for so long in calling an ambulance and she may have developed toxins in her kidneys.

They apologised when my dad said he had called immediately after she had fallen sat 9.30pm and they said they were sorry for such a long delay.

I had never heard of this toxin thing and it may have been something that gave cause for my dad to worry about while he lay on the floor.

My parents are the kind of people who could be laying on the floor for a week and when asked how they are would reply with a stiff upper lip, ‘Fine, thank you!”

@FedUpAtHomeTroels

When they get the bathroom door fixed have them do it so it opens outwards into the hall. My mothers retirement flat has this. It turns out they were built this way in case anyone fell behind it like your Dad.

That is an excellent suggestion. Thank you.