Should DH move abroad for job alone or should we join him? Dilemma.

[insertrandomusernamehere]

DH has been offered a job abroad in a Middle Eastern country to start in a few weeks and he’s accepted. As happy as I am for him; I’m absolutely terrified of what life is going to be like alone, raising our very young DC (18m and almost 3 year old). Both DC are at nursery PT and will be doing longer hours from September when I’d planned to return to work. This job offer has completely thrown me. It means changing our lives entirely- the children having to settle at a new nursery and adjust to a new way of life is panicking me the most. Or, maybe I’m projecting and am worrying about how I’ll cope in an environment/culture that is materialistic/superficial/misogynistic?

My plans for September also included taking driving lessons and becoming a bit more independent with a car for my sake and the DC. Husband is desperate for us to move but I’m not sure what to do. Should I throw caution to the wind, move us all out with him (pack our lives into boxes by the 2nd of July) and see how life works out for us all? Or, should I wait it out and let my husband settle there first, pass probation and get the ‘lay of the land’ before we join him? Or, should I stay put with the DC and we can take turns visiting one another every half term/end of term? The latter would mean less disruption for DC (my absolute priority) since they’ll still have their nursery space and key workers and other children they’re familiar with and would also mean I can focus on myself a bit too- I’m itching to get back to work. I’m scared I won’t cope alone but I won’t know until I try it, will I?

One of my biggest worries is that I’ve had horrendous PND since the birth of my older DC and I’ve needed my husband’s support to get things done and look after the children when I’ve not had the energy to get out of bed. I’m scared, left to my own devices, I might crumble. Massively. Having said that, he’ll be working silly hours in his new job so it’s not as if he’ll be able to help me out there BUT nannies/house help is cheap I’m the ME so I’d be able to buy in help? But, then I’ll worry they’re out of the British system/way of doing things and how that will negatively impact them when we come back? Argh, as you can tell, I’m struggling with all this massively. Can someone shed any light on living abroad with young children? Or even guide me on what I should do next? I’m so, so lost right now.

Apologies for the garbled post. I’ve been trying to sleep for ages but sleep just isn’t coming right now because of my anxiety around this impending move.

@insertrandomusernamehere

Our marriage is shit atm already so probably wouldn't survive the long distance which is why DH is probably insisting we move with him. We're currently doing couples counselling with mixed results. He wouldn't want custody of the DH if things went wrong- he knows how demanding being the primary parent is and he's not willing to sacrifice his wants and needs for the children. I'm scared I'd get there and be left just to get on with things.

I wouldn't dream about going giving your latest update. He'll be at work all day and getting validation and adult company there. You will be resentful because you can't work. There is no reason for you to be there. I just stay home and go to work and visit if I felt like it.

There isn't anything in it for you or the children. The children won't even see him really. You can't live the life you want over there.

No I wouldn't go

It's still very expensive to live in the Middle East even if it is tax free. You have to generally pay for everything a year upfront like housing car etc so it can take a couple of years to start seeing the benefits of a tax free salary

£2k is a phish amount to uproot all that way for. I'd want to see a £10k-£15k minimum uplift on the salary.

You said he isn't exactly a family man and this decision really shows. It's all about him

Why on earth would you go?!?

Also, I think the question from the PP regarding trust was in regards to other women? Which in your situation sounds a bit neither here nor there tbh -

Stay here and get a job and learn to drive.

^^

THIS

I really wouldn't do it. I have a friend who lived in Saudi for a few years and even though she managed ok out there, the heat and the fact she was basically seen as a 2nd class citizen really bothered her.
Speaking myself as a so called "trailing spouse", moving abroad with your husband isn't something you should do lightly. We are on our second posting abroad with DH's job. Our first posting was great, I got a job, we had a good lifestyle and we made loads of friends. Where we are now I can't work as I don't speak the language fluently. We've not met anyone really because of the pandemic, his work haven't put the usual events on where you would normally meet people and make friends. Which is fair enough, we are in a pandemic. We have a rock solid marriage but it has been really fucking tough moving where I have no friends, can't drive (the roads here are just too crazy) and can't work. I've really struggled to adapt. But I do live in a city where I can safely walk around, the weather is great, ubers are everywhere so I can get around and there is a huge amount to do. So I know once the pandemic has settled here that I will have my independence and can get out and about lots and soak up the incredible amount of culture while my son is at school and husband at work. Would you be able to say the same in the Middle East - will you have independence and be able to get out of the house? Will you be able to make friends? If your marriage is on shaky ground and you are forced to rely purely on him in a foreign country, how is the marriage going to improve? Something else to take into account - some ME countries are on the red list for travel - how easy would it be to get back home or for him to visit if the country remains in red for a long while? I would stay in the UK if I was in your position, I think you are risking an awful lot to move to the ME when you yourself said you're itching to drive and go back to work, neither of which will be possible where you are looking to go.

I'm all for doing crazy shit ( I emigrated to Oz even though I'd never set foot in it) but this would be absolute madness! Your marriage needs to be rock solid when you make a big move, and yours is not. When you throw into the mix that its the Middle East, you shouldn't even be considering it. And why move there for such a tiny pay rise? Tax free or not, its expensive out there and you will likely be worse off. Stay where you are, let him go.

If you asked him to stay , would he stay?

If the answer is no, let him go!

His need for adventure does not trump your needs. Fuck that shit

You're a woman of colour? So no white expatriate privilege either?

I have moved country a couple of times. Don't even consider it unless your relationships are solid. There's far too much to lose.

When you say £2k uplift, is that per month (I.e 24kpa)? Because if it’s £2k per year more that is a crazy amount to uproot your life for!

They would put the whole family up in a hotel for a month?

Have they agreed to relocate the family? 2k is sod all to move like that for.

Sounds like he wants a 'fresh start'. What will you all do out there? How will you find a good nursery etc?

In my old work relocation would involve a massive amount of help to get sorted esp if a family going.

I think he just wants to go. Let him go.

You're not happy anyway. The kids are settled. You know the culture language how everything works here etc. I'm not convinced that he has got/ negotiated a full relocation package, which is nuts.

Stay here. You really should.

The tone of your posts is that you don't want to. And your marriage is bad anyway.

If your marriage is shit do NOT GO. Don't. The pressure and stress of living abroad won't help.

Believe me, I know from experience.

If the country you're thinking of is Saudi Arabia, absolutely do not go.

Even if it's not, I don't understand what you think you're getting out of this. The increase in salary is barely enough to cover the costs of an additional residence, and once you throw in things like tickets for family visits and extra help for you at home, you may not break even. If you go with him, help at home will be cheaper, but you'll need to put the kids in expat-oriented private schools. Those are extremely expensive, and that's without factoring in whatever extra services your child with sensory issues might need. You might come out ahead here, but not by an amount large enough to be worth the upheaval and potential disaster.

Even if you're right that he'd never want primary custody of the children long-term, that isn't the only issue. Presumably he knows that you'd want it, and having the ability to deprive you of it would be a huge bargaining chip in an eventual divorce. Would you be willing to waive some other financial rights in exchange for him giving up his right to custody? Probably, and he probably knows it. Keep in mind that he can very easily divorce you under local law, and if he does, you'll probably get nothing financially. And if the divorce is valid under the law of the country where he lived at the time, there may not be anything you can do about it in the UK.

It is also worth pointing out that moving countries is very expensive.
I wouldn't consider it unless you are getting a decent relocation package on top of salary increase.

Do you have a house to rent or sell in the UK? Is the company providing an accountant to help with multiple country tax filing etc.
How is a the car you will need there being funded?

It doesn't really sound like a family opportunity from what you have said.

Leaving aside the issue you don't want to go and therefore shouldn't.

It sounds strongly to me that you shouldn’t go. If your relationship isn’t great, trust your instincts. Look after your own and your children’s interests.

If the marriage is Rocky absolutely not!

I went to live overseas with my ex 2 years after we married and that was with the army with a lot of the most stressful aspects (finding a home, having crucial infrastructure in place like healthcare...) taken care of and it is STILL incredibly stressful on a relationship leaving your own career prospects, family and friends, country and culture behind and having to adjust to a completely new country and culture - and this was in Europe where the national cultures don't generally vary a HUGE amount as they do between Uk and Middle East. Also we had no dc, the marriage was solid at that point and I was able to work, drive and socialise just as I do in the Uk.

As for not going for custody of dc - do not underestimate the motivation that hurt angry exes have for doing whatever they know will hurt you the most.

Frankly it sounds to me as if he is trying to end the relationship - but doing so in such a way as he can claim it is your fault! I think THAT is why he took the job - I think he's "running away"

He can't deal with the pressures of family life and is very open about it

Yep! Running away! I'd bet good money once he's out there you'll hear from him less and less and you'll have a job getting him to send money back - ducks in a row big time, crucially BEFORE he leaves this country ensure the family home is at least in both names and any debt in his if at all possible... I've got a really bad feeling about what he's doing here.

He’d be able to farm out the hard graft to a nanny and housekeeper. Yep and he'd be told as much too

He wouldn't torture/punish the DC to get back at me. He'd do what's best for them.

Famous last words of a not yet divorced woman - and I absolutely include myself there, I NEVER thought he would do anything to hurt dd and even his own family were shocked at how he behaved as soon as we split.

Hopefully you are right but you need to be fully prepared.

That's one of the reasons I want to stay here

It's a damn good reason

Agree also that a month in a hotel with young dc will be hell.

I would not advise going for as long as a month either - have you checked regulations re returning with the children without husbands permission if you've been there that long?

I've been a trailing spouse for more than 20 years in several countries. We're always had financial and practical support from HR, housing, medical, school fees, relocation costs etc, but it's still really really tough moving countries.
My marriage and family life is very happy but the stress every time we move is incredible and if you're already on shaky ground, this will put a huge strain on you.

I don't understand op, if you have had a full and frank discussion, how he has still decided to do this unilaterally. None of it adds up. Even if it is to get you both out of debt, surely his small salary increase will be swallowed up by having to run two establishments. And yet he is going anyway? A decision like this should be good for the entire family.

I think the answer to this is "no dh, especially while the DC are this young, the decisions we make should be beneficial to all the family."

With this decision you are stuffed either way. Working with no support at home. Or out in a country where you feel miserable and disconnected from everything around you. He really isn't thinking about your needs, especially given that you have recently had pnd.

And sorry a month in a hotel with two small DC sounds hellish to me too.

For me, I'm sorry, this would be a deal breaker for my marriage. And I say that as someone who has been a trailing spouse. Normally I would be very wary about marriage ultimatums, but in this situation, I think you would be justified in making one. And don't let any guilt over you having pnd sway you. You were unwell and it was not your fault.

I would go as far to say, given the bare facts here, that this is all about your dh trying to shirk his responsibilities.

Yet another trailing spouse saying just don’t do it. And another mother of a child with SEND further down the line from where you are saying that a good setting and the right support for your child is precious and worth hanging on to.

We only moved within Western Europe, to a place I could work, communicate with people, and travel back to the UK easily. We were happily married and the first year nearly broke us. It took two years to start to feel at home. I had never been dependent on my husband before and I found it so hard. We had very little support with the move in practical terms, our relocation package covered the house move but none of the costs of renting out our old house, a deposit on a new rental, set up costs (had to buy a car etc), and the cost of living was higher than we were used to, so we were struggling financially for a good while, even with a generous salary increase.

Absolutely nothing you’ve posted makes me think this move is right for you.

Stat put please. Moving is unsettling. The relationship issues one are a red flag. The country culture another one no matter how you paint it. You will be in a a foreign land, looked down upon and nkt as much of your husband as his job will take priority. At least where you are you are at “home” for you and your kids. Please do not move. Please.

Not a chance in hell would I go from everything that you've said. If he loves it there and doesn't want to leave and decides he wants the kids to stay you're buggared. You can't know how he'll behave should you split up over there.

Stay here, work on your independence and mental health. If your marriage isn't great you might feel happier without him around.

Your kids are still at high maintenance ages but this passes quicker than you think.

Please don't go OP, it would be a massive mistake for you and your DC. Don't even go to the hotel for a month.

(Tbh even if your DH goes by himself, his package doesn't sound good. He should negotiate better).

A trailing spouse (I hate that term) living in the ME, in the not very popular place pps refer to upthread.

You need a rock solid partnership to be able to handle the move abroad. I think that's the one solid piece of advice me or any of my other friends who are in similar positions, can give to anyone considering a move. Think carefully.

I don’t think you should go. For so many reasons.

Practically it sounds like he won’t be earning enough to support a comfortable lifestyle for you all. Housing and nursery/school will be expensive. You might struggle to pay for household help in that case and even more will fall on you, but in unfamiliar surroundings.

Realistically, with a rocky relationship already, this will be extremely tough. Even more so as your heart isn’t in it. You also need to protect yourself financially, so if you don’t think you could work there, you are taking a huge risk.

I say this as someone who was an expat/trailing spouse for 17 years. I’m pretty gung ho usually, but your situation is awash with red flags.

Lastly, having a child with SEND is incredibly expensive as an expat. Most medical insurances will not pay out much for therapy if you need it (and it will be $$$). Many nurseries/schools will be unwelcoming and/or will require you to pay extra for extra support. We paid about the same price as Eton for my ASD son’s specialised preschool.

I’m divorced now and back in the UK. I don’t regret anything apart from our final move which happened once our relationship was on the rocks. It wasn’t the fresh start we unrealistically though it might be, rather the death knell. I ended up staying for a year in that country although the relationship had clearly ended, and tbh I enjoyed the location much more than my ex did, but it would have made much more sense to have cut my losses earlier!

I've been in that part of the world over 10 years. First off, don't go with him and spend a month in a hotel room with two kids at the height of summer. That will be a nightmare.

I concur with the others - if your relationship isn't strong, don't move. The reality (sadly) is that your relationship probably won't survive this - I can count on one hand the couple's who've done this and the husband hadn't ended up cheating. But it sounds like your marriage probably isn't going to survive anyway. Locating a family is massively expensive (you will spend at least £8k on moving and set-up costs) and from what you've said doing that and then splitting up put you in financial hell.