Anyone in Hartlepool - what on earth is going on

[Purplecatshopaholic]

Genuine question. (Apologies if this is in the wrong place, I don’t post much). I’m Scottish and in Scotland, and I am constantly aware these days of how different the views are of Westminster up here, to across the border sometimes. We also have our own Labour Party leader up here. But really? Is Keir Starmer that bad? Are other parties not available? Who on earth is still voting for Boris…? Any WHY?

@TrickyD

Thick plebs voting for toffs.

Preferring to be told attractive lies rather than truths they don’t want to hear.

The truth you don't want to hear is that this attitude has made your party unelectable.

@AlecTrevelyan006

The whole Left v Right battle is over

The divide in British politics is now one of values

The Left is now .. woke, identity politics, the right is now the traditional core small “c” conservative voters who value common sense and have no truck with identity politics

Overwhelmingly the normal people are rejecting the “values” of the “new woke” it’s a simple as that

That's bullshit though, isn't it? Because anyone who is small 'c' conservative can't possible vote for this far right Tory party. What you have said would be true if all the moderates hadn't been kicked out.

I do think women and those who care about women will struggle to vote Labour though until Starmer sorts that out. No way would I vote Tory though. They don't give a shit about women or anyone other than their donors.

@Whythesadface

Because Labour have no policymakers, there is nothing from them to vote for. So right now you vote Tory, or you don't vote. The papers like to stir things, but even they can't magic a labour campaign from nothing.

This, also the liberals has disappeared into nothing

A few people have mentioned issues with Labour being ‘woke’.

Can someone define woke? Because I don’t understand?

Woke for me is not just about trans rights, although that is part of it.

The Labour party tell me I am racist (white privilege and do not want unlimited immigration), transphobic (I believe men cannot be women), colonialist (I don't believe we should rip down historical statues), offensive (cannot have free debate), privileged (because I have had a stable family background - that one is particularly confusing as that is what they claim they want for everyone) and also that women need a leg up to get on. That last one is something I especially hate - I don't want a job because I am a woman, I want a job because I am the best candidate - it is patronising in the extreme.

They also believe that all rich people are cunts. Despite the fact almost everyone is striving to become more financially secure.

The imported culture war stuff from the US doesn’t really help either - it just alienates people and doesn’t feel relevant to their lives.

Many traditional Labour voters are socially conservative. They don’t understand current wokery and also don’t like being patronised.

They would prefer a left of centre party with clear economic policies. But at least know where they stand with the Tories and prefer that to Labour’s batty culture wars agenda.

Saw this on Twitter, quite funny but also true.

People want a positive message.

In Brexit voting Hartlepool Labour put up a remainer former MP as their candidate. If you can't see what's arrogant and dismissive about that you need your head read.

OP - where have you gone?

@starfro

Saw this on Twitter, quite funny but also true.

People want a positive message.

Ha you could put so many posts here under that.

Because we’re living in a parallel universe where ‘money obsessed, selfish’ Londoners are voting for the party traditionally associated with boosting public services and social welfare,

Whilst the ‘down to earth, hearts of gold’ northerners vote for the party traditionally associated with reducing public services and helping the already wealthy.

Which all goes to show generalisations are pointless.

The reality is lots of people are pissed off at underinvestment in their local community, perceived over-investment in London (which has one of the highest rates of child poverty) and (I know no one wants to admit this), anti-immigrant sentiments.

The party they perceive will fix all that is the Tories.

I don't agree that trans issues have no traction when you combine them with the other related "woke"/ political correctness issues. The Tories decided not to change the UK gender change laws and Labour is committed to doing so. In a sense that issue symbolises the reasons Labour has not won since 2005. It is certainly not the only issue but it is an illustration of the gulf between normal views and the weird views of rich privileged left wing London people.

I agree that Stamer is trying to be so supportive of all views that no one knows what he stands for. My son works in working class jobs (postman now food delivery driver) and meets loads of different people every day and I am from NE England. The bubble of London Metropolitan elite who have time to fuss about plastic bags when most people can hardly afford to feed their children will never understand normal lives.

@hamstersarse 👏🏻

MarshaBradyo
I would have never considered voting Tory a few years ago now I am honestly totally lost with it all.
It doesn't help that none of the parties bother to give us any information in my area. There's never a door knock or even a leaflet through the door.

I want to be told what they stand for and what voting for them will do for me and my children. Supporters with attitudes like TrickyD will do nothing but push me towards the other party.

How spectacularly tone deaf do you have to be to put a candidate who voted against what 70% of the local population voted for in. The guy was from a neighbouring area where apparently his performance had not been anything to write home about.
labour treated the people of hartlepool with absolute contempt by doing this and they voted accordingly.

Whilst the ‘down to earth, hearts of gold’ northerners vote for the party traditionally associated with reducing public services and helping the already wealthy.

People want opportunity to be part of the 'club'. Never heard of the aspirational Tory faction? Labour don't even offer a dream of wealth - just misery and moaning about how hard done by they are

Woke is all about ghastly celebs telling us how we should live our lives. Not surprised people are rebelling against it.

@callingon you're exactly the type who won't see the problem. Labour have lost Scotland. The old status quo has gone. Unless Labour capture new voters they can't win. Instead they're alienating the voters they already had. You think women's rights aren't an issue but yesterday they were the ONLY reason I didn't vote.

@6Helen7

Because ordinary working people don't feel that the Labour Party represent them any more. My grandfather would be turning in his grave.

Exactly. Based on years working in public services in a very working class northern town I would say this: working class people want a hand up not a hand out; they are patriotic, they are socially conservative with a strong sense of fair play (in the level playing field sense), they or their father and sons have often served in the armed forces and they respect those that serve. They don't like Critical Race Theory (they don't want to vote for anyone on their knees and that does not mean they are racist, they just feel differently to middle class people about it) and, as they become aware of it, they won't like gender theories either, except for the gender critical sort. They will believe Boris on the the big stuff: his desire to level up. (I've spent 7 years at uni and have middle class lefty parents and I believe Boris really means he wants to level up). They could not give a stuff about wallpaper, small to medium lies, and jobs to cronies (well, if they run a small business - corner shop, chippy, taxi, they'd give their brother/sister/mate a job too and do). They see middle class people banging on about Tories sleaze as an attack on the one person (Boris) who they feel speaks for them and to them. They don't like being told what to do or what to think or being moaned at or criticised for voting the wrong way.

Call them thick, racist, get Stockholm syndrome trending on twitter and you're part of the problem keeping Labour out of power.

@EdwinPootsLovesArchaeology

At least the Tories aren’t hell bent on degrading my rights as a woman.

Some of them are. Crispin Blunt, Maria Miller and Penny Mordaunt spring to mind.

I think we need to stay very alert.

Sir Christopher Chope?

Yes people want opportunity

Labour has lost this, Blair managed to communicate it and get the landslide.

Right me too makes me think sod you enjoy the political wilderness.

But also I actually want a stronger opposition and Labour are very irritating atm

I don't agree with the SNP, but their popularity is linked to offering what they claim is a utopian future under Independence. It gives something positive to vote for, even if it's bollocks

This is such a good point. I'm personally not hugely enamoured with the SNP currently but I can totally see it.

@Livelovebehappy

Because the Labour Party are no longer relevant. People have their eyes wide open now, and don’t just vote for a party because their parents and grandparents did. They look into what the party represents and vote accordingly. We do though need another party which is a strong opposition party, because otherwise the Torres will become complacent.

"because the Tories will become complacent".

You mean as opposed to handing Covid contracts to their mates down the pub, hiding who paid for their flat decoration bill or "letting the bodies pile up"?

This is the problem with democracy. Everybody gets a vote, including people you consider to be utter idiots.

After brexit and the Scottish indyref there were serious calls on social media for voters to have to take tests before being allowed to vote. Because of course 'if they knew the facts they would agree with me'.

Lots of people are indeed ignorant, but the left has to accept disagreement too. It's allowed.

women need a leg up to get on. That last one is something I especially hate - I don't want a job because I am a woman, I want a job because I am the best candidate - it is patronising in the extreme.

The problem is that women are fighting an uphill battle to appear as the best candidate, even when they are. The 'leg up' bit is to counteract that. If you're fighting an uphill battle, you need to level the playing field. That's all Labour's aim is in those scenarios. There are many studies that show the discrimination against women in job selection processes. Women have to be better than men to get to the same point. That shouldn't be the case.