I'm so upset with new neighbours

[hedgedrama]

I started a thread a good few weeks ago here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4195576-I-need-some-Mumsnet-sense-knocking-into-me

And to update on the hedge, they basically tore it down. Despite the agreement that some would be left. They have offered to buy me some new hedging for my side. I was sort of OK with it all, I didn't end up having much choice, just as people warned me on the first thread but I tried to just let it go and not create a war. The (probable) nesting birds was incredibly upsetting, but it was just too late - they sort of did it anyway.

But today has really been a new level of awfulness. They brought in some diggers to landscape the garden to install their astroturf, and I noticed something moving. It was a frog. As I paid more attention I could see literally tens of frogs so I went out and bearing in mind our gardens literally are joined at the moment as there is no fence or hedge, I went onto their garden could see there were a LOT of frogs being caught up with the digger.

The driver of the digger stopped when he saw me come over into their garden, and when I said there are frogs here, he was like "Yeah I've seen loads"

There was a natural pond there for years. It is breeding season, and as I went over I can see frogs everywhere trying to escape for their lives.

The owner of the house came out and we started to catch some and move them into my garden, but there were honestly everywhere. I said "you can't just do this. It is against the law. You are intentionally killing frogs etc.".

They have stopped the works and they have been out and caught about 60 frogs (no exaggeration) in a bucket and I have taken them to a local pond (within a mile as the wildlife conservation trusts recommend).

But I now have a message from them that they are starting work with the digger tomorrow again and will be on "frog watch".

I am so upset they would have just killed the 60 odd frogs that I put in the local pond, about how many have died already, but then also that they are going to start work tomorrow without being sure they have captured all the frogs.

AIBU? I feel so disgusted. I have called the council Environmental Health and am waiting for a call back, but I don't know what else to do??

I would suggest a report to Natural England.

Frogs return to the same place to spawn every year so they’ll be back next spring.

I be upset too. It everyone did this there be no wildlife left, they sound like nightmares with zero taste or regards for living things .

What utter shite. People like to claim that they are environmentally aware, until they have to make a compromise on what they want, then all of a sudden there’s a special reason why their hedge / tree / lawn is different and it’s fine for them to cut it / cover it in plastic.

I really feel that we are great in UK at judging other countries (save the tigers, don’t kill elephants etc) , but will happily destroy our own wildlife. Badgers, nesting birds, foxes.

It’s so sad.

Let’s hope for a heatwave and he can sit on his hot plastic with heat bouncing off his shiny fence that he has to paint every year.

Not sure why there is always this assumption that people are being hypocritical. I imagine there's a big overlap between those who would feel for the frogs in this situation and those who refrain from eating animal products. Equally, I find it hard to imagine there are many vegans among the posters who don't get what the big deal is!

Also, if the options are eat meat + kill frogs and eat meat + save frogs, then surely we can all agree that the second option is better for animal welfare overall.

That's before you even get to how wanton the destruction is in this case.

The hypocracy argument always comes up in discussions about fur and foxhunting, and I always feel precisely the same way about it. I'd rather imperfect individuals who do what they can than than people who avoid being hypocrits by not caring about anything in equal measure.

@JammyDozen

Not sure why there is always this assumption that people are being hypocritical. I imagine there's a big overlap between those who would feel for the frogs in this situation and those who refrain from eating animal products. Equally, I find it hard to imagine there are many vegans among the posters who don't get what the big deal is!

Also, if the options are eat meat + kill frogs and eat meat + save frogs, then surely we can all agree that the second option is better for animal welfare overall.

That's before you even get to how wanton the destruction is in this case.

The hypocracy argument always comes up in discussions about fur and foxhunting, and I always feel precisely the same way about it. I'd rather imperfect individuals who do what they can than than people who avoid being hypocrits by not caring about anything in equal measure.

I'm vegan. It does piss me off a little how much of a dick head I am for having artifical grass, but everyone else is ok to continue to fuck the environment up by eating animals and drinking their secretions

@Mojoj I'm quite happy being thoughtless in my manicured garden 💁🏻‍♀️

I'm vegan
Me too 👋
It does piss me off a little how much of a dick head I am for having artifical grass
It IS really bad for the environment though.
I do sympathise with the convenience for you but it is a very damaging product whichever way you look at it.

Fair enough, LST, and I'm certainly not calling you a dickhead. Most of us do what we can. I wish I had the resolve to be vegan. No excuse here, just poor willpower. But doing something (not eating meat in my case, buying alternatives to leather, etc.) is better than not bothering at all.

It doesn't sound like OP's neighbours care very much at all though! I mean, not killing frogs and destroying their habitat is fairly low hanging fruit in the caring-about-animals stakes.

@DiddlyWiddly

I'm vegan Me too 👋 It does piss me off a little how much of a dick head I am for having artifical grass It IS really bad for the environment though. I do sympathise with the convenience for you but it is a very damaging product whichever way you look at it.

Not as bad as literally anything to do with animal agriculture, as you well know. And I would prefer for it to live its full life in my garden instead of wasted on landfill and then if and when the time comes, to replace it with slabs or bark or something else that is low maintenance

It's threads like this, and the ones about laundry where people reveal they wash and tumble dry their entire family's towels, pyjamas and every item of clothing every single day, that makes me both understand why the planet is in the state it's in, and despair that we can turn it around.

So many people just don't get it. And just don't care.

Totally agree @BeforetheFlood
So sad.

Some people ( including some on her) don't give a shit about wildlife. They would happily concrete and astroturf the planet.

Well done for trying to protect them. It's a good job people like you exist.

I really appreciate you saving those frogs, you've done a really good thing! I hope your neighbour really does look out for the frogs tomorrow, maybe offer to relocate to the pond again to make it more likely they will collect them?

We need more people like you who are willing to stand up for nature.

@CrazyWantsALife

OP you don't deserve the slating your getting from some heartless people on here, well done for caring, if everybody was more like you the country would be a much nicer place. My neighbour shoots and maims animals in his small back garden and this year I will be gathering evidence to report him and do my best to stop him. If anybody wants to call me a busy body for that then they can go right ahead as I do not give a stuff, luckily some of us are able care about living things other than ourselves, and it's a nice way to be. yanbu.

Oh how horrific 😢🤬 Well come for gathering evidence and reporting him. I wish I could help get the b*stard prosecuted

@HappyRaven

We need more people like you who are willing to stand up for nature.

THIS!

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 Well done OP!!!

Would have appreciated an animal cruelty trigger Warning on this post :( how awful

OP, I agree with you. You had a jointly owned boundary with a long established mature boundary feature that was the hedge, Regardless of whether the root system sits on one or other side of an agreed legal boundary that line has been delineated for many years by a established flourishing hedge with associated wildlife, bees etc. I think ripping out that hedge without making any provision for your security and privacy is shit. I think then being forced by this lack of privacy to have a full view of the destruction of wildlife is really distressing. Regardless of people’s attitude to frogs your home is your sanctuary and all your privacy is gone, all the hedgerow wildlife and beauty is gone, next door is a pile of mud you can’t avoid looking at with mechanical diggers performing frog genocide. With the lovely improvement in the weather I think it must be horrible for you. You can’t let your dog out, you can’t fence while they need access over your land and they have trashed your gate. There are nightmare neighbours in this scenario but I don’t think any of them are you.

Thiis sounds so much like our hideous new neighbors

They destroyed their own garden, turned it into a monoculture and now want to cut our mature trees down too

They removed our boundary fence, ripping out rambling roses and climbers without asking

So crap

You can’t let your dog out, you can’t fence while they need access over your land and they have trashed your gate

Why has the OP given them access over her land? If it was a tacit agreement then I would rescind it immediately backed up by a solicitor's letter if necessary

I’d feel the same in your situation. We should all be concerned about our local wildlife because that’s how we save these species in the long term.

For example, we sit here worrying about losing rainforest but the people who live there think it’s just a few trees down to make their lives easier. We all need to worry about what we can do something about - local natural world. I’m glad some of those frogs got rehomed and sorry about what you have seen destroyed.

@sweetclems

Would have appreciated an animal cruelty trigger Warning on this post :( how awful

Well apparently it's only a few frogs, and maybe a whole hedge of nesting birds, so they dont really matter.

Some posters (in general, on MN) seem to think that it is their right to remove all living things (unless pets) on 'their' property. This extends from bleaching the 'germs' on everything in sight within the house, to removing/killing any insects or small animals and birds outside. Oh, and removing any habitat or food/weeds/breeding opportunities from within their boundaries.

These people will see the Scorched Earth as a Good Thing. Until they find that they themselves have no resistance to germs, no small animals in the bottom of the food chain, and no chance of anything growing or being fertilised in their entire area.