Just heard Nikki Grahame has died

[catherineofarrogance80]

What a week 😭tragic

@nolongersurprised

Fully agree, which is why I believe we need to be more attuned to very anxious children and support them with the underlying cause of anxiety (autism), rather than have to treat them for secondary presentations (anorexia, gender dysphoria) at a later stage. (Hope that makes sense, it’s late!!)

I see the story about Nikki is after 15 stories about Prince Philip on the daily mail.

A bit overkill about Phil?

Some of the ways in which Nikki presented (vulnerable, child-like, prone to anxious outbursts) made me ponder that, at the root of lots of mental health issues might be an autism spectrum condition, or at least a neurodivergence. It’s chronically under-diagnosed.

Someone upthread said that in her book she said that she never went through puberty due to her anorexia - this would also have a major effect on her brain development.

Most anorexia sufferers are child like there's a fear of being an adult body and mind it is very complex. Her meltdowns and eye contact could suggest autism but MH issues and anorexia are common in non NT people whether they're autistic is another matter but something is off line.
I'm not autistic I do have PMDD my co-ordination is terrible my DC have various extra needs, my volcano emotions lead to anorexia.

Some of the new research recommends assessing for ASC on admission. Patients with ASC need different pathways for treatment.

I don’t think most anorexic patients are childlike or fear being in an adults body. My dd has it due to ASC and struggling to manage emotions and anxiety. For me it was a control issue. No desire for a child’s body. In fact worrying about fertility was one of my motivations to get better.

@R3dFish

Really interesting. How does treatment differ?

@R3dFish My friend was treated from anorexia and banned from playing the recorder because it was ‘a child’s activity’ (she was Grade 8!!). It strikes me that the ‘wanting to be a child’ thing is a misconception/red herring.

I had awful anxiety as a child and couldn’t eat when I was anxious, which was most of the time. DS1 has been diagnosed with ASD/ADHD so I’m 99% sure I must have had a similar profile.

@R3dFish

I don’t think most anorexic patients are childlike or fear being in an adults body. My dd has it due to ASC and struggling to manage emotions and anxiety. For me it was a control issue. No desire for a child’s body. In fact worrying about fertility was one of my motivations to get better.

Yes. My son's OCD is definitely treated differently due to his autism.

It is a control issue but also an element of fear for growing up, sufferers don't always have coping skills for the outside world.
There is a good documentary with Doctor Kristian with 6 suffering, the majority found the pressure of adult hood from teenage years cause them to regress or start the journey.
One lady was a mathematician who became obsessed with her calorie in vs out in university their stories were very interesting.

@EmeraldShamrock

The mathematician in your example is exactly what I’m getting at: someone with a laser focus on a subject/special interest is likely to at least have autistic traits. These traits appear to predispose people to eating disorders.

It annoys me how anorexia only gets the headlines when a celebrity has it. My daughter lost a couple of years of her life to it, and we had to rely on the under funded CAMHS unit to help her. I’m so lucky my daughter is still alive. We went through massive struggles as a family, as do so many other families. It effected my whole families mental health. But yet again, the celebs news us the only news on this incredibly debilitating disease that effects so many.

I don’t think most anorexic patients are childlike or fear being in an adults body.

No, I don’t think so either. While there are a number of ways children and adolescents get to anorexia (and these factors need to be considered with treatment) starvation creates its own mental health issues, including social withdrawal.

There’s that fascinating study done on healthy college men where they starved and then refed them. They became mentally unwell and displayed disordered thinking around food with this persisting into the refeeding stage.

I am afraid I don't like the implications of some of the comments on here. I was never more strong or more adult than I was when I was anorexic. I was dealing with trauma so awful as to be almost unbelievable. Don't dismiss anorexics as child like or unable to cope with the normal adult world. I dealt with more trauma in the space of a year than many adults do in a life time. And I would say most anorexics I met are similar. Incredibly tough. Unbearably brave. Coping with more than most people could bear.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Starvation_Experiment

The Minnesota Starvation Experiment. Really interesting

(and for the avoidance of doubt, the only person who knows all that I went through is my psychologist. My family don't. My friends don't. So you cannot possibly know for sure what trauma might be at the root unless you are the patient).

@Sarahtrue11

I see the story about Nikki is after 15 stories about Prince Philip on the daily mail.

A bit overkill about Phil?

You must be joking 🙄

@R3dFish

I don’t think most anorexic patients are childlike or fear being in an adults body. My dd has it due to ASC and struggling to manage emotions and anxiety. For me it was a control issue. No desire for a child’s body. In fact worrying about fertility was one of my motivations to get better.

I agree. worries about fertility and a dislike of the loss of my breasts were with me throughout my anorexia. I didn't want the body of a child. It wasn't about how I looked at all. It was a coping mechanism in the face of unbearable pain).

I don’t agree Emerald, it’s complex and varies.

You must be joking 🙄

No.There are literally 15 stories about Prince Philp at the top of the Daily Mail.

I was looking through the news sites, trying to find the story about Nikki, it took me a while.

I see that there have been a lot of complaints from the public about the extreme coverage of Prince Philip's death.

I agree @KeyboardWorriers - my DD is the strongest bravest person I've known. She is in early days of recovery- she literally shakes with every forkful she takes, she self harms during meals but (at the moment) she perseveres and she eats. At its worst, anorexia both stripped her of her independence (would only eat with a parent lodged either side of - almost like we were a magic spell warding off the evil spirit) but she's not 'childlike' . She has just turned 18 and is missing out on all the usual cusp of adulthood experiences- no school, no university beckoning, no post a-level summer jaunts. But she is, in recovery, formidable

Exactly R3dFish all these generalisations are frustrating. I continued to accomplish things in the "adult world" throughout my suffering - top degree mark, university colours for my sport, a part time job I loved, a big group of friends.
These attempts to "other" anorexics are really frustrating me.

@KeyboardWorriers I'm certainly not trying to undermine your experience.
I was anorexic from a teenager to mid twenties. I've never been over 7stone 10lb even today at 40.
Throughout the documentary mentioned and through volunteering in a support group there is a high percentage who are child-like in body and mind.
I know I've an issue if feeling extra weight on my hips and tighs I fix it some call it shapely I find it irritating.

@myrtleWilson I bet she is. And she will know how much you care. Even if you get it "wrong" sometimes the fact you care will give her strength. Don't doubt that.
And please tell her there is a fulfilling life to be had when she has recovered and a few years out is nothing, there is a whole great future ahead for her.

This is the book outlining how those with autism should be treated differently and Beat’s summary of causes.