STOP LOOKING!! STOP LOOKING!! How can I help my son?

[NoBlueSkyComing]

My DS1 is almost 8 and has always been a very sensitive child. Very easily hurt physically and emotionally. He can react very aggressively, verbally and sometimes physically too. I have seen two family support workers about him. He likes to be by himself when he is upset and they have said this is a fine coping strategy. But it has reached awful levels. it is not that he takes himself off to a room. He screams and shouts and insists others leave the room. He is now ruining play dates. He doesn't have friends his own age but does a few years younger. But today he fell when out with a friend. Just a normal trip on the pavement. No big deal. But for the rest of the 20 minute work home he kept screaming, 'DON'T LOOK AT ME!!' at his friend or his brother or his friend's mum, if they turned around in his direction. I had to walk metres behind the others so he could hide behind me, except to scream aggressively at them occasionally if they turned in his direction. He screams repeatedly at strangers, adults and children if he falls when out, 'STOP LOOKING! DON'T LOOK AT ME.' He ruined another playdate recently, simply would not calm down, he did take himself off to hide but did not calm down, every time his friend came to find him he would scream at him. After 30 mins his friend started crying as my son would not play with him and told his mum he wanted to go home so they did. This behaviour is ruining his, and consequently my, ability to make friends.

I have no idea what to do. I can't talk to him. He just screams at me to shut up. Even if I try later when he is calmer; only very, very occasionally can I manage to very briefly talk about a recent behaviour of his. I have tried talking about that film Outside In and how being sad makes others care for you, and that is what happens when he falls. I've tried being blunt and saying no-one will want to be your friend if you behave like that, so let me help you to find a way to respond differently. But nothing works. He's getting worse.

I am at the end of my tether. He gets a lot of time and attention and love and praise. But I am starting to find him increasingly hard to like when he is like this. I worry desperately about him, but his refusal to even try to help himself is hard to take. He has just told me that he knows himself better than me and he can't change and never will be able to.

Sorry to hear this OP. I work with vulnerable young people. Ive read your responses on here and skimmed all the pp replies, so not sure if it's been fully raised, but the thing that struck me was when you said that your son's father has something deeply abnormal about him that has been deeply damaging

I presume you're not together. What is the relationship between DS and his father? Rather than trying to seek a diagnosis for autism or learning needs, might it be emotional and behavioural as a result of the relationship wit his father? It sounds like he is massively triggered whenever he does something like fall over, as if he's prepared to be fully shamed or worse. I would wonder where this comes from in terms of his learned behaviour. He's protecting himself from shame, humiliation or punishment in a terrified way, the only way he knows how. Could it be from his father? Would his father have responded unkindly to him in the past? Would his father have modelled ashamed, humiliated behaviour? Has the boy been emotionally hurt by his father and he's protecting himself now?

I definitely think a referral is needed and I'd be looking at talking therapy to get to the bottom of it.

Just my tuppence worth. Good luck

My brother does this and he does have autism. However, this doesn't mean your son is autistic.

We have some techniques to help with this behaviour. 1. Ignore the behaviour...this can be difficult 2. Try to distract him 3. Remove him from the situation. Don't force the playdates.

Your son was obviously very upset and self conscious when he fell. The fact he was screaming....I wouldn't have waited for the friend to ask to go home.

In terms on friendships. Try not to worry too much, especially as your son likes his own company. My brother found friends that understand him. At sleepover he would often go and find a quiet room for himself.

@Disabrie22

Hi OP, I have two highly sensitive children who tend to melt down at small triggers. Neither are autistic as I am knowledgable in this area but also have asked their teachers in the past to be sure. I have recently had some training in therapeutic thinking and feel it does help with the meltdowns with my children and others. It involves looking at things in a different way. For example - when your child started screaming after he fell over - how did you react? You must have felt stressed by that situation? (I’ve been in it btw so I know!) The way to handle it according to therapeutic thinking is that you stop. You give the child the emotional language they need “You have fallen, that must have been a shock,” “I can see you don’t want anyone to look at you right now” “I understand that them looking is making you unhappy - you look like you are angry.” “It’s ok to be angry when you have fallen as it hurts.” “Can I help you with your knee?” “Even though you are shouting you look like you are feeling a little better?” “I know when you hurt yourself it’s hard not to shout” “I know it’s important to you that people don’t look at you when you are upset - but they do it because they care about you.”

Honestly this works - validate their feelings and they will not feel so lost, confused and angry. Don’t worry about your friends feelings - if they are a person worth knowing they will be sympathetic to your child.
Your child probably has a lot of social anxiety? Do you have that too?

and @CoffeeWithCheese. These are both much better suggestions that the way I handled it today, which was terrible as I got annoyed with him when he wouldn't calm down. It used to be that he would calm down after 5 mins or so, but it just seems to go on and on now. After the meltdown last week with his other friend who ended up gong home in tears, I just went home and cried and cried, I just felt so helpless and lost. And then when it happened again today, I just thought, Jesus, I've worked so hard for three years, which has involved lots of attempts and lots of rejections and having to be rejected and keep on going out there and keep trying with new people, and managed to build this small friendship group for us, which is still pretty precarious and its just going to disappear and we'll all have no-one. So your posts have been a helpful and salutory reminder of how I should handle it and how my son does feel.

Speed read through and found that LockdownLocks has surmised the point I was going to make! The one thing that sticks out in your posts is early trauma (physical) and the lack ( I may have assumed that!) of a relationship with his father. Could be jumping to massive conclusions but I'd also agree that maybe early childhood experiences could hold one of the keys to unpicking this.

Poor lad though - it sounds like he is totally overwhelmed by his own emotions, maybe something that would respond to Elsa or Emotion coaching support through school regardless of the ASD vs NT debate that will no doubt continue to rumble on...

I really feel for you and think you’ve had a tough time on here.
I’m a teacher and this isn’t typical for a child of his age. Make a fuss with the school, tell them how desperate you are for help.
Could you try social stories? Where you show pictures of the situation he gets into and talk about his feelings and feelings of others? Could you work on strategies to deal with how he copes in these situations, like squeezing a stress ball, counting etc. Rewards for reacting more calmly.

He may be suffering from this:

www.webmd.com/add-adhd/rejection-sensitive-dysphoria

It's a very heightened form of rejection sensitivity.

Also please have a look at this page on Facebook. it's run by a woman who is autistic and although a woman it's fascinating to understand more about the breadth of difficulties (and gifts) that autism can bring.

She also has ADHD too.

Good luck with your dear son. Sounds very stressful. I hope you can find a way to manage things.

and it's not your fault, remember that.

www.facebook.com/Spectrumy-391000254586036

I do think you need to be kind to yourself. This sounds incredibly hard and like you’re dealing with this on your own. Try to think positively, somehow you will get through this.

The PTSD/ early trauma comment is interesting. I do think this is part of it. He had really bad reflux, which was late being diagnosed due to a fuck up at the GPs, and just screamed and screamed and everything terrified him. I remember being in a room with other new mums and babies and one of them sneezed, none of the other babies reacted but my son broke into terrified screaming and crying. I eventually stopped going out with him except to my local park which I could run back home from in a few minutes, so if someone sneezed or laughed loudly or crow cawed too near us and he started screaming I could run home and darken the room and make it quiet to calm him down. So I think he learned early on that the world was a frightening place full of pain, and that probably did shape him.

Are you a fearful/anxious person? Does he see his dad at all?

Well my son is diagnosed with autism.Hes very high functioning, very intelligent and incredible funny boy.However he has very very low empathy and it affects his and our lives on a daily basis
Over the years we have modelled empathy to him.He just doesnt get it.He says he doesnt care when people get hurt or someones in pain.He says he cant feel it or put himself in their shoes.Even when the situation is pointed out to him, he still wouldnt care.So yea .you cant just generalise that all autistic people are overflowing with empathy.

Have you considered vagus nerve regulation? It's a way of calming the flight/fight response which can be triggered with big emotions like anger or shame. Obviously not when he is in the middle of a stressful event but when he is calm there are ways to help with self regulation. Like practising breathing from the belly, breathing out for a slightly longer time than you breathe in. Singing is a also good. Drumming or dancing. Laughter. Exercise like throwing or kicking a ball. Yoga/meditation/EFT tapping.

I agree with PP he may be struggling with a high stress response due to the earlier painful experiences and need to reset his flight/fight reaction.

This does not discount the idea of getting a referral but might help in the meantime.

Also wanted to say you sound like a wonderful mum.

God, that RSD does sound like him. @BoomShakeShake

@1AngelicFruitCake His school have been awful. It has been a real battle to get support for him educationally, especially in lockdown. I am absolutely furious with them tbh, I'll never forgive them. I know plenty of other families who have had a lot more support for their children than my son has had, who has needed it more too. From their perspective he is fine in school, so behaviour isn't a problem. So being as I have had to push for him to get (still inadequate) learning support when the DO recognise he is struggling educationally, Ii think the chance of getting any support for behaviour, which they don't see as an issue, is vanishingly unlikely.

@NoBlueSkyComing

The PTSD/ early trauma comment is interesting. I do think this is part of it. He had really bad reflux, which was late being diagnosed due to a fuck up at the GPs, and just screamed and screamed and everything terrified him. I remember being in a room with other new mums and babies and one of them sneezed, none of the other babies reacted but my son broke into terrified screaming and crying. I eventually stopped going out with him except to my local park which I could run back home from in a few minutes, so if someone sneezed or laughed loudly or crow cawed too near us and he started screaming I could run home and darken the room and make it quiet to calm him down. So I think he learned early on that the world was a frightening place full of pain, and that probably did shape him.

Op, this really sounds like a sensory processing disorder, and is very usual in ASD.

It is all armchair diagnosis obviously, but to me this that you describe of your son as a baby is the same thing that he still has now.

Sorry, I realise there are loads of posts I have not responded to. I am going to do the bedtime routine now, so signing off for the night.

Thanks again everyone.

autismawarenesscentre.com/does-my-child-have-sensory-processing-disorder/

My DS is highly sensitive and has poor emotional regulation. We used to have a lot of meltdowns like this.

A massive help was to find a time when we were really relaxed and to talk to him about his meltdowns and particularly asking what he would like me to do when he is struggling in order to help him.

It helped him feel more in control, meant that my reaction was predictable and having a process made it less stressful for me.

I also felt less self-conscious because I wasn't floundering around whilst he fell apart.

We also have code words which he uses when he feels he is in a situation which is getting too much. It means he doesn't have to try and articulate himself when he is already stressed. He chose the words and we agreed on what we do when he uses them.

By bringing him into the process he will feel empowered and you will not feel you have to second guess him all the time

@NoBlueSkyComing

The PTSD/ early trauma comment is interesting. I do think this is part of it. He had really bad reflux, which was late being diagnosed due to a fuck up at the GPs, and just screamed and screamed and everything terrified him. I remember being in a room with other new mums and babies and one of them sneezed, none of the other babies reacted but my son broke into terrified screaming and crying. I eventually stopped going out with him except to my local park which I could run back home from in a few minutes, so if someone sneezed or laughed loudly or crow cawed too near us and he started screaming I could run home and darken the room and make it quiet to calm him down. So I think he learned early on that the world was a frightening place full of pain, and that probably did shape him.

OP I don't want to bash you as I did much the same with my highly sensitive (autistic, as it turns out) child but we need to expose children gently and in small manageable doses to things that make them irrationally fearful, or we teach them that they are right to be afraid and that they can't manage their fears themselves but need to be mediated by an external person (usually a parent). There is a really eye opening book that completely changed the way I parent called "Anxious kids, anxious parents". I would really recommend it. Essentially we need to teach our highly sensitive children that they need to become more comfortable with being uncomfortable.

Some children on the spectrum can be empathetic and caring. I have two children with ASD who are both very different; one shows empathy and is very caring. I am also a teacher and have seen many kids who show such extreme sensitivities and are later diagnosed with ASD. I obviously can't say that your ds is autistic or anything else over the internet but I can say that the behaviour you describe is very far from 'normal' at his age. You should get some input from a paediatrician.

I wrote a very similar post on here 6 years ago about my then 3yo DD, who would get really embarrassed about things like falling over or even gentle pointers (like ‘Be careful, there are stinging nettles there!’) and run away and withdraw into herself. I got some helpful advice but also an absolute pasting from a couple of armchair psychologists who had deduced that I was an unkind refrigerator parent who played blatant favourites with her older sister. I’m biased but this was really uncalled for and a huge leap from what I’d said in my OP. What I was really looking for is what you’ve had in some of your replies here, ie ‘my DC is autistic and does this sort of thing; here’s how you go about investigating it’ as I always had a hunch but could never articulate why as she didn’t obviously meet some of the usual criteria for diagnosis, especially around repetitive behaviour, liking routine etc.

Anyway, the point of this ramble is not to add to the voices suggesting you pursue a diagnosis, that’s up to you, but more to mount a defence of posters who suggest autism when situations like this come up. It was lots of little clues like this across various threads over the years that helped me gain a better insight into DD2’s difficulties and collect ‘evidence’ for CAMHS when we finally got to that point. She was finally diagnosed a year ago and it has made life easier in so many respects.

All the best with your DS. FWIW DD largely outgrew this behaviour although it still happens to a lesser extent sometimes. (One useful tip I did take from that horrible thread 6 years ago was to highlight when I make silly mistakes/am clumsy myself, so DD sees it’s not a big deal.)

OP - I totally understand how you feel about the difficulties of keeping a friendship support network around you when you son is being explosive. I have also been there xxx

disabri ... that might work for you and be very well meant ... but honestly, I find your post quite patronising. Honestly this works .. I can’t absolutely guarantee if I spoke to my dd during/after this kind of episode she would explode way beyond what she was already going through! It may work for you and your children but would have the absolute opposite effect with my dd.

During a meltdown I can’t speak to my dd - pointless as she just doesn’t hear me/isn’t processing anything around her. After a meltdown it’s like nothing ever happened/she remembers nothing or very little.

Hopefully the OP will move forward with the assessment route and see what that brings.

OP, my daughter is 13 and we are now getting her diagnosed for ASD
She masks very well at school.
I know that round here, the waiting list is 2+ years for assessment.

So we started her with a counsellor once a week. It has helped her enormously. After all, the main point of diagnosis is to get the right help.

I don't know if it would work for a younger child.

Definitely worth some assessment for his sake as he grows up. It could be both trauma and neurodiversity, or "just" a sensory processing disorder.

Anecdotally, almost all the autistic friends I know had massive issues with reflux and too much crying as babies (I did too). Which would make sense if our senses were going mad and we were too sensitive to pain etc.

With or without a diagnosis, you could look into suggestions for helping autistic children and try applying them - there's nothing lost if they don't help but something gained if they do.

Heavy blankets. Fixed routines. Watching for over-stimulation. If he falls over a lot, what about some sporty knee pads or arm pads?

Hi OP I apologise for not reading the full thread but I just wanted to get this to you quickly! Your son sounds a lot like my daughter and I wanted you to know ,,,,from being 6 my daughter who was such a lovely cuddly warm snuggly child suddenly changed over night and i mean literally overnight.No longer if she fell or hurt herself could I even attempt to get near to her,She would not have it at all,It was so strange she would get angry and embarrassed and storm up to her room often crying with huge shouts of leave me alone! It was heart breaking as a mum to see when all i wanted to do was comfort her.I couldnt bear it.It was like nothing I had ever known,Anyway I did nothing,I waited til she had calmed down and re appeared and then and only then she came to me for comfort,I asked why she wouldnt let mum help her and explained all I wanted to do was to help her feel better,She honestly couldnt answer me and I believed her when she said she didnt know why she did what she did.This went on for 2 years then and this is the good bit,,it stopoped as quickly as it started,She is 9 now and if she falls and grazes her knees as she does often with football and scooters and bikes and rollerskates she comes running and it feels amazing,She will sit and let me sort her out and give her a cuddle and then she limps off and carries on,No more tantrums no hiding away nothing just patch me up mum and shes off again,I look back on those awful days with disbelief really.Was that my child?Did we really go through so much angst well yes we did and I couldnt do anything.Now as before those awful dark days she just yells out for me,The relief I cannot begin to tell you.Now she can articulate more she said she fell over at school a few times and the kids laughed at her and she hated having the dinner ladies put stinging stuff on her knees and elbows she would have rather seen to herself with no fuss,she was embarrassed at standing out even though this happened by some lovely well meaning just doing their jobs fabulous dinner ladies who treated all the kids the same..it really was as simple as that.My sensitive child just took the hump at being seen as weak! Dear me how can a 6 year old even fathom that? I dont know but for 2 years and a bit it destroyed me seeing her try to cope on her own,Anyway now things are great as i \said.Kids are such funny little things arent they?! My dd has no shame in falling over now and yelling out and accepting help calmly and quickly and she is great! and I feel brilliant knowing i can comfort her and be the mum i needed to be be, She has no learning difficulties or behavioural problems at all so I am putting it down to one of those crazy development stages and glad it is behind us.There doesnt always have to be a complicated reason just wanted you to know,Light at the end of a really dark tunnel kind of thing.I wish you well x

Hi OP

I just wanted to empathise as your DS sounds extremely similar to my 8 year old DS. Interestingly also some difficulties in early life, and I’m now a single mum.

He did some work with an educational psychologist that has helped him with emotional regulation particularly in school, but has also now been referred to CAMHs for anxiety and also being assessed for ADHD. I have however had a very long battle with the school over this!