Poor, poor woman

[Mookie81]

Complete lack of support and nowhere to turn.
A terrible deed but I feel so sorry for her.
And where the fuck was her ex? Living in Spain while she was driven to despair.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9186243/Olga-Freemans-friends-reveal-agony-trapped-flat-son-loved-dearly.html

You cant hold the father responsible unless you want to start a very dangerous precedent for other cases where a parent decides to leave. Ultimately if they had both abandoned the child amd moved away, he could have been still alive now.

it is very nice for all those who are comparing her to their own experiences. Good for you for not having psychosis (she was getting messages in her head) or a severely disabled son. Seriously, what is wrong with you? Anyone with any emotional maturity/decency should be able to acknowledge that the child is an innocent victim AND that it is sad for a devoted caring mother to get to this point. Really, get over yourselves.

Ive nc as this is dark and terrible.
My son 5 has severe asd. His main issues are non verbal and violence. March last year his support went from full time nursery and 8 hrs respite to none overnight. His salt ot etc was cancelled too. We couldn't go out. I couldn't take him anywhere. His violence grew worse as the weeks dragged. He didn't sleep and when he did he would scream due to night terrors. My body was full of bruises and bite marks my hair fell out in clumps due to it getting pulled so often. He would scream for hrs while i begged him to stop. Throw food at me. One night i wondered if i could walk to the bridge with him and throw us both over. I closed my eyes thinking about it. No more pain no more anything.
Thankfully i spoke with a friend who literally talked me down.
Please dont judge a situation. When you know nothing about it

"You cant hold the father responsible unless you want to start a very dangerous precedent for other cases where a parent decides to leave."

Frankly I think there should be a precedent. I don't think you should be bringing a child into this world if you have no intention of taking care of it. At the very least, these people (men) should be publicly scorned. You can be damn sure that when a mother abandons her child, she is publicly shamed. When a man does it, especially a middle class white man? Oh he was off doing his big important man job.

I don't know what the answer is, because obviously you can't force someone to spend time with their child. But the fact that this is seen as acceptable or even normal is appalling to me.

asdson16
My heart goes out to you.

Sometimes we find ourselves in impossible and unbearable situations we are forced to endure, where there is simply no end in sight and the only end is to end it.

What could Olga have done differently. It would appear the only thing differently she could have done in her state of mind was to take her own life which isn't much better really is it. She had no help or support for months.

@SettledStatusQ

In cases like these, the father and extended family are always quick to declare their love of the dead child - where are they with the day to day tasks?! Can anyone of them honestly say they couldn't possibly do what this lady did in that moment of despair? No one, hand on heart can say that they couldn't get to that low point. Instead of judging women like this l, the family members and father should be ashamed of themselves.

I agree.

I read a statement from the ‘father’ and it was all about how much he loved his son and how he took him to museums and the trips they had gone on together travelling. I just thought immediately Disney dad. I’m sure you got the photos you needed for social media and I’m sure you’ll get sympathy now from many.

@Asdson16. I am so sorry to hear about how tough things have been. I hope you and your son are now getting the support you need .

The father should be charged with the neglect. He was able to swan off to a different country without a backward glance. Because he knew someone else was going to do the heavy lifting of parenting for him. If Olga had walked out in a similar fashion, and had told SS she had had enough and was unable to care for her son, I wonder would the father have ditched his job and come running back to care for his son full time in a two bedroom flat. I doubt it.

@Asdson16 I hope things are better for you now.

@Branleuse

You cant hold the father responsible unless you want to start a very dangerous precedent for other cases where a parent decides to leave. Ultimately if they had both abandoned the child amd moved away, he could have been still alive now.

Perhaps we should be changing the law on this. Legislation, not predmcedent, will be required.

It's completely illogical to absolve an absent parent from parental responsibility in such a case where there will have been a fairly well evidenced descent into the conduct which forms the basis for a plea of diminished responsibility by the primary caregiver. It's an outdated, old fashioned way of thinking designed to facilitate the mainly make tendency to abandon their children. The father could and should have been more involved to assist in the upbringing of this child, if not in person then by paying someone else.

It's quite frankly ridiculous to absolve the father in thus case of blame because he chose to work abroad while the primary care giver found herself in the situation of having to guve up her job.

I believe the Coronavirus Act 2020 and associated secondary legislation removes the risk of local authorities being held liable for their failings in such cases, although I would need to check to be sure.

I wouldn’t vote for a law like that. To blame a parent hundreds of miles away in another country, unable to travel back due to a pandemic for the actions of the other parent. It’s fucking ridiculous. It’s a fucking long arm stretch to absolve the mother who killed her child because where was her ex-husband? That just goes back to patriarchy- men control your womenfolk, and if you’re not there to keep them on a short leash, you are at fault not the poor infantilised tiny brained woman.

That just goes back to patriarchy- men control your womenfolk, and if you’re not there to keep them on a short leash, you are at fault not the poor infantilised tiny brained woman.

It's quite the opposite the way I see it.

The father taking responsibility for his child is not oppression.

Also, it seems that thousands of people manage to travel for trivial reasons, like holidays.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

That just goes back to patriarchy- men control your womenfolk, and if you’re not there to keep them on a short leash, you are at fault not the poor infantilised tiny brained woman.

It's quite the opposite the way I see it.

The father taking responsibility for his child is not oppression.

Also, it seems that thousands of people manage to travel for trivial reasons, like holidays.

Sorry I see it that way because posters have latched on to the idea that if the father were there in person, then Olga would not have killed Dylan. He would have prevented her by being there and in charge. So therefore, he is at fault for “swanning off” on a work trip instead of being there to control Olga.

Think of the precedent this will set for women in courts trying to get NC for their DCs. Oh, well can’t do that because legally an absent father is now responsible for the actions of his ex-wife/partner. Ridiculous.

@PlanDeRaccordement

I wouldn’t vote for a law like that. To blame a parent hundreds of miles away in another country, unable to travel back due to a pandemic for the actions of the other parent. It’s fucking ridiculous. It’s a fucking long arm stretch to absolve the mother who killed her child because where was her ex-husband? That just goes back to patriarchy- men control your womenfolk, and if you’re not there to keep them on a short leash, you are at fault not the poor infantilised tiny brained woman.

Until quite recently, we didn't have laws which permitted gay marriage, or considered racism as an aggravated offence. Times change, and its an increasingly outdated way of thinking to consider that one parent should be absolved from legal responsibility fir their children just because they effectively abandoned that child.

Especially in cases such as this where the father had full and detailed knowledge of the child's condition. It us highly irresponsibke to leave the burden of looking after the child to one parent only.

The father will undoubtedly have been aware that support services had been removed during this period and, if not, should have made himself aware. If unable to look after his own child in person, he could have paid for additional help.

He would have needed to be in charge, just provide support and respite. I think you are looking at it from an odd angle.

Also, an absent father will not be responsible for the actions of his partner, only for his own actions and or failure to act.

Sorry, would not needed.

Putting my makeup on at the same time as typing seems to be beyond me.

@GreenlandTheMovie
I’m shocked you’re comparing making a person in a foreign country responsible for his ex-wife killing his child to racism and gay marriage.

But anyway, no it’s not outdated to recognise that single parents can raise children on their own. What you propose is to rewind women’s rights by a couple hundred years by thinking there should be a law in place to prevent a spouse/partner becoming and ex and leaving the other as a single parent. To legislate that the male partner must be responsible for the daily care of their children especially.

We used to not allow divorces because of that thought. Have a read over the marriage ceremony and the bit about the purpose of marriage..It is given as the foundation of family life in which children are [born and] nurtured

Then when divorce WAS allowed, for many years the father automatically got full custody of the child. Because it was the father who was ultimately responsible if anything bad happens to the child.

That’s what you’re proposing. It’s not modern at all. You are literally going backwards. Regressing.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

He would have needed to be in charge, just provide support and respite. I think you are looking at it from an odd angle.

Also, an absent father will not be responsible for the actions of his partner, only for his own actions and or failure to act.

Well equally Olga had the right to form care bubbles with friends for support and respite, but she refused her friend’s offers of help according to a few articles.

@Asdson16

Ive nc as this is dark and terrible. My son 5 has severe asd. His main issues are non verbal and violence. March last year his support went from full time nursery and 8 hrs respite to none overnight. His salt ot etc was cancelled too. We couldn't go out. I couldn't take him anywhere. His violence grew worse as the weeks dragged. He didn't sleep and when he did he would scream due to night terrors. My body was full of bruises and bite marks my hair fell out in clumps due to it getting pulled so often. He would scream for hrs while i begged him to stop. Throw food at me. One night i wondered if i could walk to the bridge with him and throw us both over. I closed my eyes thinking about it. No more pain no more anything. Thankfully i spoke with a friend who literally talked me down. Please dont judge a situation. When you know nothing about it

Sincerely hope you have some respite. A schoolfriend had a very violent severely Autistic older brother.

I can understand easily how a single parent can 'snap' especially when isolated and mentally ill themselves.

A tragic situation for them both.

That's, quite a bit of invention about what I'm supposedly proposing going on there, because I'm actually suggesting nothing of the sort.

You've gone of at a bit of a tangent and I think what I've suggested has gone straight over yiur head.

Especially in cases such as this where the father had full and detailed knowledge of the child's condition. It us highly irresponsibke to leave the burden of looking after the child to one parent only.

Especially as he knew the mother was struggling to cope. Yet apparently he still turned his back on her. I can imagine how the argument went. "Not my problem, I'm in Spain working, you'll just have to struggle through. Oh, you haven't slept for months. Still not my problem. You're his mother. You should be able to care for him. You're the one he needs most, not me".

I would refuse an offer from a friend, but I would be happy for the father to muck in.

It’s completely different situation.

@PlanDeRaccordement

I wouldn’t vote for a law like that. To blame a parent hundreds of miles away in another country, unable to travel back due to a pandemic for the actions of the other parent. It’s fucking ridiculous. It’s a fucking long arm stretch to absolve the mother who killed her child because where was her ex-husband? That just goes back to patriarchy- men control your womenfolk, and if you’re not there to keep them on a short leash, you are at fault not the poor infantilised tiny brained woman.

I agree I wouldn't vote for the suggested law. However, the suggestion that the father couldn't come back at any point between March and August is obviously incorrect. And what was to stop him helping to finance respite care?

Can I just point out, in the interests of accuracy, that I haven't suggested any specific law?

What I am suggestng is that it's possible to think about reframing duty of care (in the Bruder sense) of absent parents in such a way that in certain circumstances, where they can be proven to have had full knowledge of a potentially harmful situation, it might be possible to make them criminally liable? Defences would obviously be available.

In exceptional cases. I think this might be such a case. The absent parent could and should have done more. He should have made it his business to find out how lockdown was affecting respite and other third party care for his child and done something about it before it got to this stage.

#in the broader sense