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Men Behaving Badly- Dear God, was it always this horrible?!

190 replies

EreLongDoneDoDoesDid · 02/01/2021 18:06

A Tier 4 Christmas has caused DH and I to turn to the TV for some telly comfort food.

A few nights ago we started watching Men Behaving Badly on Netflix. This was a show that I remember with a lot of affection from my early teens and DH felt the same way. Aside from the Christmas episode- which I stand by as being a great slice of Christmas comedy- we hadn’t watched any of them since the early noughties.

For reference MBB began in 1992. I was 12 and didn’t watch the early series, coming in at around the series 4 mark (although I did see the earlier series later, probably in my mid to late teens). It ran for a total of six series and there was a Christmas special in 1997 and then a trilogy which ended the whole thing off in 1998. It launched the careers of Martin Clunes and Caroline Quentin and brought Neil Morrissey and Leslie Ash to prominence after some years in minor roles. Harry Enfield was also in the first series and my understanding is that he was pretty well known comedian and added a bit of a star turn to it.

In case you’re not British or were living in a hole during the 90s it was a bawdy, un-PC half hour BBC comedy (actually, it started out on ITV for the first two series) and the premise was that Gary, a 30ish year old security sales manager, lives in a flat in London with his flatmate (and friend from uni) Dermot. They’re both immature misogynists whose passions are drinking down the local (grotty) boozer, drinking cans of Stella at home and talking about women they’d like to shag. Gary has a girlfriend, nurse Dorothy, but Dermot doesn’t have a regular girlfriend, instead chasing largely unobtainable women, including the woman who owns the flat upstairs, Deborah. Gary owns the flat and has a steady job, Dermot pays him rent (or more often doesn’t) and is in and out of work. Dermot leaves after series 1 and is replaced by Tony, but Tony occupies the exact same space as Dermot, just with a northern accent. So far, so The-Inbetweeners-15-years-on.

But it’s just awful. Really awful. By the time the show ended I was in my late teens and I don’t remember the world being this....unpleasant nor the show being so broad and offensive. The men are just... idiots and the women shrill and nagging, hen-pecking the men and seeming to not like them at all. The language is really offensive, with the women referred to as “bints”, “bitches” and “slags” and constant references to sex that also border on being unacceptable.

The central romances between Gary and Dorothy and Tony and Deborah are horrible in their own quite different ways: Dorothy seems to despise Gary, and who could blame her because he’s knob. But equally he doesn’t seem to like her at all either, doing everything he can to avoid any kind of real commitment to her. Their relationship is depressing: They constantly argue, seemingly only getting along when it comes to sex (though Dorothy spends much of her time rejecting Gary’s advances). The relationship is quite parental, with Gary as the naughty school boy and Dorothy the mother who just spends her whole time telling him off. They aren’t really ever that nice to one another, and although the message is clearly meant to be that they’ve got each other’s backs when the chips are down, that isn't as clear here in 2021 as it was obviously meant to be in 1995. They also both cheat on one another more than once. Dorothy even sleeps with Tony, which Gary hardly seems to care about.

Tony and Deborah’s romance is equally depressing in a different way: Tony is a sad, sex-obsessed and mopes around the flat all day, drinking lager that he buys with his JSA. He pines over Deborah in the flat and she spends all her time knocking him back and going out with other people. Until the last series when she’s reached her late 30s and basically goes out with him out of desperation. They’re also not very nice to one another but with Tony being more thick bloke who pines and her being slightly less acid-tongued than Dorothy.

There are also some questionable running themes: marriage is often discussed negatively by Gary and Dorothy in a way that maybe was meant to feel modern because she wants it no more than he does, but they do end up almost marrying and later having a baby and you don’t get the feeling that either of them really wanted to (they were just out of any other options). The women as killjoys theme has been discussed and is weaved into the very fabric of the show, whilst the men act like teenagers and avoid the women’s attempts to spoil their fun. There is also a really unpalatable theme about very young girls being fair game throughout the show... Gary makes reference to his desire to shag his 17yo niece several times, at one point saying that she has “buttocks like a racehorse”. Watching it, me and my husband literally shouted “Christ no!” in unison. So bad!

We were also shocked at how much the characters drink and smoke. Culturally the world seems hugely different to now, much more different to how I remember it. Drinking and smoking is done constantly and without question. We also have a good laugh and how rich these characters are. Both Gary and Deborah are 30/31/32ish at the start of the series and both own the 2 bed flats that they live in (that seem to be a conversion of an older house). They live in Ealing and such a flat there now would cost circa £500k. No conceivable way that a middle manager of a security firm and a restaurant manager (which is Deborahs job) would be able to get mortgages, alone, on these properties now.

So my question is this- for someone who was a child and then a teenager throughout the run of this show... were things really this different? It looks like a different world to the one we are in now to the extent that it’s hard to believe it was only 30 odd years ago.

Is this how people felt in the 90s when repeats of beloved 60s and 70s sitcoms were shown? Will we feel like this about the big sitcoms of the teenies like The Inbetweeners, Him and Her, Friday Night Dinner and People Just Do Nothing? Or was this show actually really horrible at the time, I just didn’t notice because I was so young?

OP posts:
Dogsaresomucheasier · 03/01/2021 09:45

An Fab feels like it’s full of tasteless child abuse by self absorbed arseholes now. Again, we’ve moved on.

KnitsAndGiggles · 03/01/2021 09:57

@LilQueenie

dermot? don't you mean Tony?
Gary's first flatmate is a bloke called Dermot played by Harry Enfield. He moves out and Tony moves in
Aahotep · 03/01/2021 09:59

I still love Ab Fab

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

user1471565182 · 03/01/2021 10:12

Never liked it, but even watching it as a kid I used to wonder why dorothy and gary were meant to be together when Dorothy hated him.

Iamthewombat · 03/01/2021 10:19

Nicely put, OP.

This, from another poster, is also on the money:

I do kind if think that programs like this almost gave permission to the lad culture it was running alongside. The lads had to be the loveable useless rogues whilst the ladies had to roll their eyes and pick up the pieces.

I was in my twenties during MBB’s run. I remember it being very popular with the sad sacks at work who wore Oasis fleeces, had no imagination whatsoever and joyfully leapt on ‘lad’ culture when it emerged in the early 1990s.

They loved it because it made them feel part of a gang and gave them permission to regress to 1970s behaviour whilst complaining that anybody who didn’t like their mouse mat featuring knicker-clad models was humourless and just didn’t get it.

I think that the MBB scripts were written to appeal to those men. No wonder they were so lazy and predictable!

user1471565182 · 03/01/2021 10:21

oh christ that fucking Game On program. One of a series of results of 90s 'friends meets Men Behaving Badly' pitches you just know went on at the BBC.

I thought I wouldnt like GimmeGimmeGImme again watching it now but I watched the one with him going on about returning a book to the library recently and it was pretty funny.

supadupapupascupa · 03/01/2021 10:23

I'm afraid MBH is entirely representative of the time where I was. Except there was a lot of dope smoking at the same time.

Shudders

KatherineJaneway · 03/01/2021 10:30

I still laugh at Allo Allo. The jokes are the same each episode but that doesn't matter, I still find it funny.

I must admit I never regularly watched MBB but it is of its time.

user1471565182 · 03/01/2021 10:32

I saw a thing recently with Gail Porter and she said the incident with her being projected onto the HOP gave her agoraphobia and was the start of her mental health issues

Iamthewombat · 03/01/2021 10:32

oh christ that fucking Game On program. One of a series of results of 90s 'friends meets Men Behaving Badly' pitches you just know went on at the BBC.

Actually, I bet that is exactly how it was pitched. With a Britpop soundtrack, the kids will love it etc etc.

I only ever watched one episode. At the behest of a male housemate who to,d me it was hilarious. It wasn’t, or not in the way intended!

Kwiksavenofrillsusername · 03/01/2021 10:36

I suppose MBB just does the usual sitcom plots - nagging shrew and commitment phobic moron — but dialled up with that 90s attitude and the influence of lad culture. I agree, watching TV now reminds me of being a kid and watching the sexist sitcoms of the 70s.

Comedy seems to age a lot faster now. When I was bored during lockdown, I rewatched 30 Rock, which only finished in 2013 but had quite a few jokes that you probably couldn’t make now. Not because they were particularly offensive, I just don’t think the audience would be as receptive to that sort of humour.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 03/01/2021 10:43

I just watch old sitcoms etc as something of their time. I like seeing the world exactly as it was then, to look back with nostalgia at a time I remember, or even that I don't. I don't have to agree with them politically or morally to find it funny. My boyfriend and I watched Carry On films on Xmas day! Grin

I also don't think the world has changed for the better as much as is being claimed here.

And yes future generations will feel like this about comedy you like.

Sittinbythetree · 03/01/2021 10:54

We made the mistake of watching an episode a few weeks ago. DH was v excited as it was a favourite of his. We lasted about 10minutes, it’s unwatchable now, for us anyway.
It’s not true that all comedy dates badly - blackadder and dads army are older and still fab. Maybe being set in an earlier time insulated them somehow. They also don’t rely on misogyny as humour. I also rewatched Allo Allo recently expecting it to be horribly dated but I actually enjoyed it - it does rely on the sexy lady theme - but the women are in on it and using it rather than victims of it. Black books and Father Ted don’t seem particularly dated (yet!).

user1471565182 · 03/01/2021 11:02

Things like Father Ted and Blackadder wernt meant to represent people's real lived lives at the time so they dont date because they dont have those cultural markers of the time embedded in them like (for examples) these 90s sitcoms with the fairly anonymous attractive blonde woman, bad guitar music, lager and an overuse of 'shag'as cultural markers. Bishop Brennan getting a good old kick up the arse could happen any century.

user1471565182 · 03/01/2021 11:03

And obviously historical stuff like Dad's Army is a time most of us never knew and is very nostaligic for those who did so it cant feel dated.

Iamthewombat · 03/01/2021 11:03

Father Ted and I’m Alan Partridge were contemporaries of MBB. Both as funny as ever, but that’s because they were much cleverer. MBB was just lazy pandering to the zeitgeist. People who wanted to be associated with Loaded lad culture would have watched MBB in any event.

Youngatheart00 · 03/01/2021 11:04

As others have said I think most sitcoms / sketch shows date quickly.

However, I don’t believed they should be edited / sanitised for today’s audience. They are a product of their time

cariadlet · 03/01/2021 11:18

@Handsoffstrikesagain Actually, I do think that Only Fools and Horses has aged badly. We still watch it now because dp and dd love it. A lot of it is very funny but there's a lot of casual sexism that passed me by first time round.

The episode that really pisses me off is when Delboy books a policewoman stripagram and is shocked when it turns out to be Raquel. The way he treats her and the fact that she's so understanding infuriates me.

Phyllidakettle · 03/01/2021 12:18

Erelong You’ve got too much time on your hands to be fretting about things like this. It was of its time along with lots of other programmes. In the grand scheme of things, does it matter?

Iamthewombat · 03/01/2021 12:20

Well I enjoyed the OP’s posts, and other posters’ responses. Is that ok with you?

user1471565182 · 03/01/2021 12:22

But its made pretty clear DelBoy is meant to be a bit of a neanderthal with Rodney the more sensitive artistic one. You think a character like that wouldnt feel shown up if he thought his girlfriend was an actor but turned up in front of his mates as a stripper?

They wouldnt have written that storyline with Rodney because it wouldnt make sense.

user1471565182 · 03/01/2021 12:23

Yeah I appreciated the OP as well, wish there were more like this.

BikeRunSki · 03/01/2021 12:31

However, I don’t believed they should be edited / sanitised for today’s audience. They are a product of their time, as this thread goes to show, sitcoms are a very good social barometer. I bet our children will be tearing Motherland apart in 30 years time.

Sittinbythetree · 03/01/2021 12:33

I’ve enjoyed this thread too. And there is definitely value in reflecting on cultural changes and how media reflects that. As a side (or perhaps parallel) note we’ve been watching the bbc2 series on celebrity - and revisiting how the media behaved and society responded (and v/v) in the 90s was shocking, and helps make sense of where we are now.

Youngatheart00 · 03/01/2021 12:48

@Sittinbythetree yes I saw some of that programme too - the ‘paps’ and ‘circle of shame’ pointing out cellulite etc - the early 2000s were quite a nasty time.

Of course the Daily fail are still at it but I think that cruelty is generally less accepted in the mass media.

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