Help! I don't want to pay FIL's bills!

[Blurp]

The background: DH has 3 siblings who live nearby. MIL died a few years ago, so FIL lives alone in the house DH grew up in. They describe themselves as "very close" and have always gone to FIL's twice a week for dinner (just the siblings and their kids, not partners). When MIL was alive, she cooked; since her death, they take it in turns to cook, so DH cooks once every other week. This costs about £25 each time, so about £50 per month.

FIL has recently retired. He has absolutely no savings (MIL was a HUGE spender and just spent it all), and gets only a state pension. He's realised that he can't afford to pay for all the bills. The house has 6 bedrooms, so it's huge, expensive Council tax, expensive to heat etc.

In my head, the solution is that he needs to move somewhere smaller and more manageable. However, DH & siblings are not in favour of this because then they wouldn't be able to go round all at once, certainly not twice a week.

His brother has suggested that they all chip in each month to cover the bills - about £50 each. So including the cost of cooking once a fortnight, we'd be forking out about £100 a month for this.

We could afford it, but we'd be sacrificing other things. For instance, we'd like to move to a bigger house (the kids would love some outdoor space). But that would be very tight financially if we had this extra money to pay each month. We'd also like to start saving some money for the kids each month too - £25 each would build up to a decent amount.

DH agrees with me in principle, but is being put under pressure by his siblings. He said he'd feel bad continuing to go to dinner twice a week if he wasn't paying his share. But he also doesn't want FIL to have to move, thereby possibly meaning that they can no longer all visit together.

There was a vague suggestion at one stage that if FIL didn't have enough space, they'd all take it in turns to go round each others' houses, so we'd host every other week. This won't work because both me and one of the other siblings partners work from home and it would be too disruptive (and anyway, I don't really want a big crowd of people in the house once a fortnight). Again, I feel like I'm getting in the way of the plans.

Any suggestions? Is it unfair of me to say no to us paying money to FIL each month? Or is it reasonable to expect him to live within his means, even if that means moving house?

If he has any sense he'd realise he can't stay in a six bedroom property on a meagre state pension. What did they plan for or didn't they? Twice a week for dinner sounds over the top anyway. Why can't each sibling host him?

Op,

Your repies indicate that finances are not the issue. Attitudes are. Living in the past.

My husband/partner spending two nights out a week with HIS family taking OUR children to what's basically a jolly whilst I had to pick up working hours I missed doing childcare would be him taking the piss. Expecting me to finance it out of my children's future savings? Hahaha.

Big family occasions, with kids and cousins and aunts etc are just that. Occasions. Not necessary twice a week. And family. Whole family. Not excluding 'the in laws'. It is not the mafia with your fil lording it up at the head of the table, mourning your late great mil favourite lasagne.

I think you've got a DP problem, not a fil problem. Perhaps he needs to challenge the status quo, or you do. How do your fellow outlaws feel about this?

I'd be very happy for dh to take the kids out twice a week

But yes, I see the OP does want to go over too sometimes...yes unreasonable if she can't and a DH problem

It's a tricky one - if he is staying in the house because DH and his siblings insist on making it their family focal point, then I think it's right and fair that they contribute to the bills. But also he could be staying for sentimental reasons - but again if all the siblings are supporting him in that choice, again fair enough that they contribute.

Both my parents are dead now, but I can't imagine begrudging them £25 per week if they needed it (and I could afford it as you say you can) and it made their later years happy ones.

I feel a bit bad for your DH as you don't want him to go to the family meals at your FiL's house, but you also say you wouldn't want to host them either. So he can't really win.

But on the other hand if it is adversely affecting your children by not allowing you to save for them, then that puts a different perspective on it. Without wanting to be morbid, a six bedroom house would be worth quite a lot of money, so can you see the £100 a month as being 'paid back' once your DH eventually gets his inheritance?

If he won't downsize, you can get income equity release rather than a lump sum to supplement income per month.

If you and your dh would like a bigger home and fil doesn't want to move would it be an option for you to move in with fil and buy the house seeing as there's 6 bedrooms, is the house big enough that fil wouldn't be under your feet?

I'd be very happy for dh to take the kids out twice a week

Me too! And it sounds as though OP needs that time to work undisturbed, so I guess it's down to whether you can afford to lose that time if FIL downsizes and can no longer accommodate everyone Blurp? Is that time worth the extra money to you and is there a viable alternative so you would still get that time/space to work? If DH has to stop going because FIL has downsized and you can't work with them all around what will you do?

I'm probably your FIL age group. My DH and I moved into a small 2 bedroom villa when we retired - we can still entertain the entire family ( 2 adult kids and their partners and kids , 8 all together). We just have a lounge/dining room with an extendable table which we pull out when they all come.

Your FIL doesn't need a 6 bedroom house just because some people come for a meal !

You mention that you and DH need to move to a bigger house - have you thought of buying FIL's house ? He could buy a small villa with the money , and have some extra money to make his life comfortable.

Kids and husband out the house, having fun and getting fed 9 times a month is amazing. It’s not bad value even for £100 a month.

It’s a little calculating but I assume the FIL will leave the house to his kids. If you don’t won’t to contribute how about you husband offers his ‘share‘ to the other siblings as long as they take over his share of the costs.🙃.

I have a 3-4 bedroom semi, older style so decent sized rooms, and i can absolutely seat 14 people in my dining room. (I presume your FOL already has a table big enough.)
So it's utterly daft that he has to stay in his huge 6-bedroom house just because it's got a big dining room! He could easily find a smaller but still suitable property and use the money left over from downsizing to fund his retirement - that's a very common solution, loads of people do it.

You absolutely do not have to contribute to his bills when it would mean sacrifices for your own family. In fact what sort of parent would take money from their own children in such a circumstance?
You say he has just retired so he is presumably in his mid to late 60s and it could be many years before he might need to go into residential care - if he ever does, it's not a given.
But if he does, his children would not be compelled to pay for it. At that stage the property would either be sold to cover the fees or the care home would put a charge against the house which would come into effect once it was sold.

You don’t really sound like you’re being open to solutions - you’re just looking for problems. He should downsize and you should agree to host every other week. It’s hardly a great commitment and it’s good for the family to see each other and socialise. I can’t really see the problem here, you’re just looking for problems where there are none, and coming across as a bit unhelpful tbh.

How big is your home OP? I ask because you said you would like to move somewhere bigger to get some outdoor space. If your home is small ish then how could you be expected to host this family meal, when they apparently fit into nothing smaller than a 6 bed house?

FIL is being ridiculous. He can’t afford his home so he needs to downsize. It’s not like he’s already in a small flat & not able to buy food - in which case I would be more inclined to help.

You also say this extra money would come from your own savings to move. Why does FIL get to stay in a 6 bed house alone at the expense of your DCs having more space? Bonkers idea.

Well presumably if FIL did sell his huge house and move into a 2-bed cottage or something, there'd be plenty of capital left over. So just add an extension or a nice conservatory, stick a whacking great dining table in there and carry on. No need for drama about it, surely?

Yanbu. If he is "so close" to his family it should be fine to tell them he'd love to help, but can't sacrifice his own family's financial health. There are plenty of houses with a few bedrooms upstairs but a large open-plan extended downstairs with ample room to entertain. FIL should move house and accept it isnt realistic to live in a 6 bed house as a single man.

FIL has just retired so he’s presumable mid 60s. Quite old enough to take his own financial decisions. He must have had a well paid job and I don’t believe he has no pension.

If he owns a 6 bedroom house he doesn’t need to sponge off his own adult children.

Plenty smaller houses can host 14 people. Do you really believe that no one with a less than 6 bed house ever has that many friends round?

This is all a lot of nonsense.

I’m currently house hunting and most two or three bedroomed houses these days seem to have a large sitting/dining room, often when two reception rooms have been knocked into one. I suspect they are deliberately sabotaging the idea of your FIL moving to a smaller place for their own reasons. People can be very resistant to change.

Is $100 a month that big of a sacrifice? it seems pretty cheap. Just wait until he needs nursing care

Nope. Don't pay. Help him sell his house and move somewhere smaller. A lot smaller

That is actually nuts. "Family" meals every week, minus spouses, in a house that's at least twice the size he needs and you're expected to chip in to his bills?

He needs to downsize. His bills don't need to be your problem.

Your DH eats out with his family 8 times a month, so 50 and 8 meals/nights out a month - very reasonable. Works out at £6.25 a night.

What does your fil want? Would he want to move house?

Fil can rent out a room to cover bills

He could probably rent out a couple of rooms to one person so there is a separate lounge.

If you live in a city there might be a professional or teaching/nursing student who would be interested

Yes I recon a three bed house with a good sized kitchen diner would be spacious enough for 5 adults to sit round a dinner table.

Porridge
Table needs to accommodate 14 people. Not including spouses.

Your Fil needs to downsize. He can have an open plan house or pay for an extension.

The only other solution is for you to move into his house and rent out your home. This would come with tax implications on your income. But your dcs would then have a bigger garden, more space etc. And I imagine there’d be space enough for you to work even if it was an office area in the bedroom. This would allow you to save money. The only caveat I could see (bar living with your fil, which may not appeal) is if your tenants didn’t pay their rent.