Euro elections - remainers come hither

[Electionpondering]

Sorry if this has been done before.

It's the Euro elections on Thursday and I'm a remainer. I've been confused about which party to vote for to give the best opposition to the pro Brexit parties. I really wish Change UK had partnered up with the Lib Dems but alas, that wasn't to be. I think on balance I will be voting for the Lib Dems - I usually vote for them in General Elections although I admire the Change MPs who put their careers on the line for something different.

I just wondered what other remainers were thinking. My friends don't really talk about this sort of thing so thought here might be a good place to discuss but apologies if this isn't allowed in an election period.

Lib Dem here too (south west)

The Lib Dems could win two, three or more seats instead of one of enough people vote for them, surely? More Lib Dem seats is a good thing, in this specific context, ie a clear message to Remain. There isn't just one MEP per region, there's 3- 10 elected.

Yeah. Disenfranchised remainers who aren't supported by the big parties, that's who they're recommending LD/Green/Etc to, in order to use the proportional representation to get another remainer MEP in your area.
EG If your local area already gets a LD in, and you'd normally vote red or blue, vote green to try and get a second remainer.

Does the remain voter advice not make sense based on the maths of the PR list system? I’m not an expert so if someone could clarify that would be great. But I read in the 2nd round of counting, the winning party’s votes are halved, so if you have a safe LD seat they already get the first MEP and then go quite a way down the list again. So they idea is to get greens (for example) into 3rd/4th place ?

"Just because we choose a party aligned with remaining in the EU, that doesn't change the fact we are leaving"

agree. Short of a massive REMAIN win (which is what we needed in 2016, frankly) then nothing much changes. I suppose that's why I didn't vote strategically in this EU election, I don't know if my vote meant a damn thing this time.

Ive had a leaflet from the Brexit party personally addressed to me. God knows why.

There are claims on Twitter that some have been getting them in with their postal ballot papers.

I will vote lib dem. I would have voted changeuk. However I haven't had any leaflets about which people are standing so might change if I get some info on the actual candidates.

The latest polling figures I can find for the SW seem to be

BP - 34%
Lab - 18
LD - 13
Con - 11
ChUk - 11
Green - 9
UKIP - 3

2 BP seats, 1 lab and probably the LD are pretty much guaranteed. Seems a bit risky for LD voters to start changing votes though.

"Just because we choose a party aligned with remaining in the EU, that doesn't change the fact we are leaving"

I think some of it is a reaction to Theresa May's claim that as 80% of the electorate voted for Leave parties in the General Election (ie Tory and Labour) that is a clear mandate for "what the public wants".

By voting for unequivocally Remain parties, and making each vote count, that will hopefully put a clear message out that Brexit isn't what many in this country want.

It might just pave the way to a People's Vote.

What’s the point of voting in this if we are leaving the EU? Genuine question as I don’t really understand thanks 😊

HelenaDove I had this too, how did they get my name?

Yes Origin that has always annoyed me. The "clear mandate" from from last G.E. is totally disingenuous. That election was in no way single (Brexit) issue and the first past the post system means there really wasn't a feasible remain alternative.

Every time the clear mandate line is rolled out I want to shout at the tv!

I’ve just seen this posted on the of the remain fb posts...

Are you in the North East, too @TattiePants?

I was going to vote libdem, anyhow.

@pickachew yes I’m pretty close to Nissan (if that gives you a clue). Judging by what old school friends post on Facebook, I’m expecting a rather large vote for the Brexit Party unfortunately.

I know exactly where you mean, @TattiePants I just passed that way, today, in fact. The place where the turkeys really did vote for Christmas 😓

I'm wondering about the RemainVoter analysis, now, as Democratic Audit has the Lib Dems performing very poorly in the North East
www.democraticaudit.com/2019/05/16/european-elections-2019-what-will-happen-in-englands-north-east-region/
I'm not sure I can bring myself to vote green again, after all their recent gender based pronouncements, mind. And there's analysis been done that changes the order in which all the remain parties poll badly.

No ones answered me, obviously not much point in voting then....

There’s always a point in voting. In this case the biggest reason is probably because it’s far from clear that we actually will be leaving on 31st October. Or at least we don’t seem to be doing anything that might get us to a different position than the one we were in a couple of months ago.

The electoral system in use for GB (but not NI) is a version of proportional representation explained with an example here:
www.europarl.europa.eu/unitedkingdom/en/european-elections/european_elections/the_voting_system.html

There is a detailed worked example. It's a bit convoluted to explain: party with higher number of votes is allocated a seat, the their number halved, and the next seat allocated to the party who then has the highest number and so on until all seats are filled.
Simple example:
Brexit party 50 votes
Labour 26 votes
LD 20 votes
Green 11 votes.

First seat goes to Brexit party. Now the have half:
Brexit party 25 votes
Labour 26 votes
LD 20 votes
Green 11 votes

Second seat goes to Labour. Now they have half
Brexit party 25 votes
Labour 13 votes
LD 20 votes
Green 11 votes

So third seat goes to brexit again, the LD, then Labour. (If I've not made any mistakes working it out in my head). There is also a minimum threshold and I don't know what that is.

As far as I can tell what remainvoter is trying to do is figure out the allocation of the 'lower numbered' parties after the votes for the bigger scorers have been halved once or twice. I'm not sure I can quite grasp the minutia but as it's recommending I vote the party I support....

There is a simulation web site where you can enter your own data to see it for yourself what adjusting the numbers might do for your region:
icon.cat/util/elections/ZTrHIxyubR

RafaIsTheKingOfClay what if there is no one that I want to vote for? What do I do then?

Will definitely be voting Lib Dem.

ChangeUK have a super good website, describes all their candidates.

I get that the EU elections work on a PR system and vaguely understand the basis of vote transfer. With special thanks to my DH and DBIL for an evening of my life I'm never getting back. However, I am dubious that a clever computer calculator can call this right and won't risk my vote on that basis. If the even exit polls could call the Aus election wrong ( like, really wrong) the credibility of the Remain Vote website is surely doubtful, Hence I'm voting Lib Dem as both the strongest remain party and the party I genuinely prefer. Just as an aside though, I do think the fact that the EU voting system is to too complicated to explain without the assistance of diagrams and worked examples suggests that reform of the EU as a democratic institution might be a fair plan.

LD votes for them in the last GE though I think they need a new leader I have always liked VC but he comes across weary

I don’t believe that some of the Change UK won’t be scurrying back to their original party once it’s in a better position