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Original poster

I feel upset, sick and cheated by Leaving Neverland

999 replies

Persimmonn · 13/03/2019 10:30

I was one of those people who kept saying the men are out to make money. That there’s no evidence etc. But I finally watched the documentary yesterday and it’s hurt me a lot. I feel like I was lied to my whole life. I know it sounds so melodramatic and selfish but MJ was my idol growing up. I remember being 7 years old and dancing and singing his songs.

Now I feel sick to the core. If Wade Robson and James Safechuck are lying, then they’re incredibly good liars.

MJ was a paedophile.

OP posts:
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12
Sagradafamiliar · 04/04/2019 15:00

But what if one of your '4 children' doesn't want to or can't face a court case? And what do you mean you would go to jail? Are you suggesting violence is the answer?

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:01

YESSSSSsssss

Sagradafamiliar · 04/04/2019 15:02

Yet if one of the parents had resorted to violence, you'd be outraged!

Ginnymweasley · 04/04/2019 15:04

Often the victim is too traumatised to give evidence. If you knew that they couldnt/wouldn't give evidence so therefore the abuser would walk free or they could get compensation from the abuser that would pay for therapy etc which would be a better option? Families get compensation all the time when family members are killed or injured in traffic collisions or down to negligence. Is this any different in reality?
It's not as simple as presuming that they would go to court and be heard etc. They would be cross examined, a traumatised child would have to relive their abuse over and over again. Not sounding so great now is it?

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:04

No I wouldn't I would think good on them.

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:06

He defended Jackson in court saying it never happened and then ten years later it did.

Sagradafamiliar · 04/04/2019 15:07

Then you condone violence then. How compelling: the abuse couldn't have taken place because none of the parents were aggressive, knuckle-dragging thugs. Not to mention the ramifications of doing something like attempting murder on the wealthiest, most famous man on the planet. Not to mention the fact they were arguably gaslighted themselves.

PorpentinaScamander · 04/04/2019 15:07

I can quite easily believe the discrepancies in the dates.

I am a survivor of CSA. I have had 2 abortions as a result of the abuse.
I have no idea how old I was when it started. 7? 10? 11? Older? I honestly couldn't say.
I think I was 16 and 17 when I had the abortions. And after the 2nd one is when the abuse stopped. I might have been 18. It's such a traumatic period in my life I've blocked it out.

And I've never reported it, and never will because the repercussions will blow my whole family apart.

I believe James and Wade.

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:10

Yes I do condone it.

We all know Jackson is not normal so what about the parents are they normal people who were tricked into trusting him.

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:15

PorpentinaScamander I'm so sorry for what you went through was it family member or close family friend.

NotMyUsualTopBilling · 04/04/2019 15:22

In my mind I'd kill anyone who laid a finger on my kids. In reality I put their needs first and supporting them is far more protective than getting myself locked up!

I can't understand how the parents were groomed to the extents that they were, the bed sharing makes no sense to me, but I do know how manipulative and charming abusers can be so it's not beyond the realms of possibility.

Victims are often to involved with their abuser to understand or want to speak out against them. Can you imagine how terrifying it must have been to face (arguably) the most famous man on the planet knowing that there are millions of "fans" who will blindly follow his every word and speak of you with utter hatred?!

No, I wasn't there but based on information we have available to us from various sources, reports and testimonies I think it's pretty safe to say that I believe Wade and James.

PorpentinaScamander · 04/04/2019 15:27

Thank you @thetwits

It was a family member.

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:31

The only reason why I don't 100% believe is because they said he didn't and then years later he did. Why would parents allow there children to stay with a grown man. I think they done it so there kids could get ahead but they didn't. Were they abused or did the parents scorn when it all finished. Who knows. Didn't one of the men try to make a claim on the Never land ranch in 2013 that fell through?

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:33

I hope one day you find peace PorpentinaScamander.

NotMyUsualTopBilling · 04/04/2019 15:36

So effectively, you think the boys parents pimped them out to a celebrity in the hopes of a decent career in show business?

As I said, I don't understand the thought processes of their parents but regardless of whether they were complicit or not MJ is ultimately the one who lured and sexually abused young boys under the guise of stardom.

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:40

That's if he did no knows for sure.

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:41

*no one knows

BelindasRedPlasticHandcuffs · 04/04/2019 15:43

He defended Jackson in court saying it never happened and then ten years later it did.

This means nothing. Training victims to stay quiet is a central part of grooming.

Have you ever been cross examined in court? Do you know how badly the cross examining barrister can tear you apart on the stand? Making you doubt yourself and your recollection despite you knowing you're telling the truth? How they can twist every word coming out of your mouth to paint you as a liar or the defendant as an innocent sweetheart that wouldn't hurt a fly? Lying in court is a crime but making the decision to betray the man that groomed you and made you love him from childhood knowing what would happen to him if you did, going against a decade of practised responses, and opening yourself to that kind of experience in court would surely be a harder choice. There is a very genuine reason more victims don't come forward and it isn't because they're all liars.

I don't doubt it is a hell of a lot easier to stand in court and repeat a practised 'he didn't touch me' than it would have been for a victim to open up about abuse before they were ready.

Why would parents allow there children to stay with a grown man.

Why do some parents abuse their own children? Why do some parents allow their kids to have unlimited access to the internet at a young age which may ultimately result in them being groomed? Why do some parents bring new partners they barely know into their house with small children?

Some parents make stupid or negligent decisions and regret them hugely, others are actively criminal and deserve the full weight of the law to crash down on them, but it's easier for us to judge with the benefit of hindsight (and I say that as someone that is baffled that they allowed it and thought it was in any way normal behaviour). I don't think they knew what was happening. That's a step too far.

Didn't one of the men try to make a claim on the Never land ranch in 2013 that fell through?

I believe it fell through on a technicality due to the statute of limitations, not because of the the allegations were proven to be false. However I'll defer to more knowledgeable individuals on that one if it isn't the case.

NotMyUsualTopBilling · 04/04/2019 15:46

Again, just because the bloke is dead doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Those boys, along with countless others and anyone who was threatened/paid off not to speak about it probably know what went on!

ccmrob12 · 04/04/2019 15:46

Be interesting to know if they both end up getting perjury cases brought against them? They might up with a failed appeal and criminal charges for their lies.

What is interesting people saying that they both don't need money. However, why sue for millions if it is justice that they are both after? It's always down to money, I know if I were in their shoes I would try and make it just about justice by taking money off the table. It should be about trying to set the record straight, no more or less.

Another interesting point is the people saying his son being born triggered the change of heart. His son was born in 2010. He didn't make these complaints until 2013. He was still friends with the family through 2010 and 2011 when he begged to be a part of the Cirque Du Soleil show. Wade's money issues started around the time he made the claims, convenient that eh?

Another interesting article, he set up the Robson family fund after the doc to try and raise money. He now claims it was to raise money for child abuse charity, but why call it that in the first place. When are people going to see he is shady as ....!

finance.yahoo.com/news/wade-robson-changes-donation-page-171805180.html

thetwits · 04/04/2019 15:51

What has money got to do with justice. These people were taking Jackson to court. What went wrong?

ccmrob12 · 04/04/2019 15:53

Have you ever been cross examined in court? Do you know how badly the cross examining barrister can tear you apart on the stand? Making you doubt yourself and your recollection despite you knowing you're telling the truth? How they can twist every word coming out of your mouth to paint you as a liar or the defendant as an innocent sweetheart that wouldn't hurt a fly?

Exactly, if they were lying the first time, as we are led to believe, surely these prosecutors (who were the best in the game at the time), would have been able to poke through lies to show what they were saying wasn't true?

In regards to child porn, if they found anything like this or other illegal material, MJ would have face charges separately even if he was not found guilty in these cases. That's if they were genuinely found anything illegal. How could he have escaped that? He would have been banged to rights?

Quintella · 04/04/2019 16:02

Weren't you the person who raged for hundreds of posts on the other Leaving Neverland thread? Finding it all a bit hard to come to terms with no doubt.

thetwits · 04/04/2019 16:03

In regards to child porn, if they found anything like this or other illegal material, MJ would have face charges separately even if he was not found guilty in these cases. That's if they were genuinely found anything illegal. How could he have escaped that? He would have been banged to rights?

Good point unless there is a conspiracy theory with that one.

Sagradafamiliar · 04/04/2019 16:44

Whether the parents were in on it or not, whether they were themselves groomed or condoned it as a transaction makes not one bit of bloody difference! It was still abuse :/