I feel upset, sick and cheated by Leaving Neverland

[Persimmonn]

I was one of those people who kept saying the men are out to make money. That there’s no evidence etc. But I finally watched the documentary yesterday and it’s hurt me a lot. I feel like I was lied to my whole life. I know it sounds so melodramatic and selfish but MJ was my idol growing up. I remember being 7 years old and dancing and singing his songs.

Now I feel sick to the core. If Wade Robson and James Safechuck are lying, then they’re incredibly good liars.

MJ was a paedophile.

That’s complete rubbish @stairway-neither have ‘convinced a jury’ anything of the sort. What are you talking about?

See this is half the problem - people keep regurgitating nonsense like this over and over again and unfortunately, many seem to take it at face value.

Question to those who appear to doggedly protest MJ’s innocence - what ‘evidence’ WOULD convince you he is guilty?

There is a man who fits the perfect profile of a paedophile.
Two men claiming to be victims who are either telling the truth, or Oscar worthy actors
At least 5 accusations
A man who paid over 20 million to prevent a court case (why, if there was no evidence)
Former staff and his own sister who believe he’s a paedophile.
A man who lies easily, on camera to say he has never taken drugs or had cosmetic surgery when both have now been proved otherwise.
No meaningful sexual relationships with adults if either sex.
Proof of child and other pornography found during a search.
Videos backing up Safechuck’s claim he was bought a ‘wedding ring’
Evidence that at the very least he mentally abused children.

And that’s just some of it.
Seriously, what would it take for you to even suspect the allegations are true?

MJ’s lawyer said he put Robson on first to testify for Michael as he was so convincing.

Yes, so?

That’s why I wouldn’t say MJ was 100 percent a paedo based on that documentary. He probably was tbh but I’d need more proof.

That straw that you are clutching looks mighty fragile.

Anybody who could not see MJ was a paedophile needs examining. His behaviour was textbook grooming and paedophile behaviour played out on the camera. His wanting to isolate children on their own without their parents there or near for long periods of time, is highly concerning. If you watch his body language in interviews it is very telling.

Jordy chandler was able to draw accurately, distinct markings on the underside of MJ penis. He must have been exposed to MJ genitals a lot to be able to memorise it and be able to draw them like he did.

Indecent images of children were found at his Neverland Ranch, some very disturbing. Piece all these together makes MJ one big paedophile who pulled the wool and is still pulling the wool over people's eyes.

MJ had a preference for young boys, he sought them out and got them alone with him, not girls, I believe they spent time alone with him. Around him there were groups of boys and girls, but alone, it was the boys. Wade's sister said that he would have Wade alone, and she would be in another part of the house with her parents, same for another little boys sister.

stairway you need to watch Abducted in Plain Sight and read up about the grooming cases all over the U.K. I don’t know how you can say you need more evidence. I didn’t believe the claims either, but I watched the documentary and changed my mind. It was a slow game that was played. Slowly, building trust, offering riches and fame. Makes me feel sick that anyone would need more evidence. What would it take for you to believe?

stairway so what? The prosecutor in the same case, Rob Zonen - incidentally an expert in these kind of cases- says he was absolutely sure at the time (and now) that Wade had been subject to long term sexual abuse.

Of course this doesn't 'prove' anything, but neither do Thomas Mesereau's (the lawyer you're talking about) statements.

That’s why I wouldn’t say MJ was 100 percent a paedo based on that documentary. He probably was tbh but I’d need more proof.

What 'proof' would you be looking for?

These people that need more "proof". I always ask them if they'd have let their own children sleep in Jacksons bed with him.

Exactly Tenpenny I asked the same question to a friend, and she said erm no of course not!

Aeroflotgirl That's the point where they all talk themselves in a confusing circle about maintaining his innocence yet not trusting him to be alone with a child...

Exactly, hypocrites really. I believe now if MJ was alive, with all the evidence from his Neverland Ranch, and from the boys, I think that he would be found guilty.

Maybe posters who say they need evidence mean court evidence? Evidence as far as the law is concerned?

I don't know that much about law, but I do know sexual abuse claims are very hard to prove, with a low success rate.

Just playing devils advocate here, but imagine you were a solicitor or barrister and your boss told you that you had to represent MJ.

You'd try and rip their evidence apart. Unfortunately MJ's legal team did manage it, didn't they? I'd say ..... yeah so they shared a bed? So what? Doesn't mean he forced them to do anything sexual, doesn't mean he penetrated them.

Yeah, so James has a ring? So? It was bought with love.....
Etc etc. Hard to prove. As a juror, even if you suspected, you need hard evidence. In order to bring a result of guilty.

Do you think it would get a conviction now?
If someone argued that someone had porn. Doesn't necessarily mean he actually did a sexual act on the boy in question does it? How do prove MJ actually did?

Physical. Forensic evidence such as the presence of his DNA in some form proof of physical co fact.
He was sharp enough to get 1 of the boys to get rid of his underwear following an event when he had probs it injured the victim and left blood.
Any physical exam that could provide evidence of prior sexual abuse. Scarring?

Meant to add...Is that the kind of proof that people who are not convinced would like to see to prove 100% what was going on?
Cos I reckon, there would be plenty still out there claiming it was all a fix and Poor MJ is being set up..

That footage that Aeroflotgirl has linked (above) is pretty creepy. I was always on the fence about whether he was a paedo or an innocent, but looking at that I wouldn't trust him.

The smirk on his face during the police interview is shocking and so, so cold, so emotionless as if he were watching something that amused him
He came across as very confident that any efforts by the police to catch him out would be pathetic. He knew he held all the cards. Untouchable.

. Surprised his face didn't slide off when he did that over the top yawn.

That video above scared the life out of me. WTF is he laughing at so coldly? He was one creepy weirdo. And he just looked so bloody odd and ugly.

I wasn’t sure Wade was telling the truth before watching the full thing which is the first time I’ve ever doubted someone who says they have been abused but believed by the end. Someone has posted a video on the net from grainy cctv of Micheal and a young boy jewellery shopping, just like Janes said

I have never seen that footage before, it's quite shocking. If I had been accused of child abuse and I was innocent I sure as hell wouldn't be laughing

Everything shows us his obsession was young boys. .. why? Well he had one in tow for decade's.... sleeping with him, living with him, travelling with him.
Never girls,never a partner. Male or female.

His porn was full of kid's.

His home was named after a... young boy who had a gang of boy's.
. Micheal had massive art painted of himself with a loin cloth surrounded by boys.