BIL- I say this is a problem - DH gets interesting set with me and denies its wrong

[AlwaysTheLastToKnow]

Dh’s Family have huge issues. After ten years of putting up with bullying and lies I stood up to my PIL and told my H I’d leave him if he didn’t support me and the kids and so we went no contact (there’s a big back story as to why I’m wary of his brother but he’s the only family member on my Dh’s side that sees the kids)

BIL- is single(never had a GF, very wealthy and socially a bit awkward. (I have a SN child who can struggle socially) he treats the kids like they are 3, insists on touching them
Constantly (they hate this and always have) I’ve tried gently telling him not to do it and when they say NO he must respect this but he ignores it. I’ve been more firm and told him he will ruin any relationships with them if he continues (he’s good for 30 minutes then back to type)

He comes overly twice a month and the kids will make any excuses they can (seeing friends-sports stuff-being I’ll) dh will not listen

And I’m sick of it.

I don’t think any uncle has free reign to barge into their bedrooms and wrestle them on their beds. I don’t think he should grab them in between the crotch to lift them up. Moreover the kids tell him to stop and visibly don’t want him near.

It’s causing an issue because I’m supporting the children and my dh says “that’s just how he is they’ve got to be polite to him”

Errr- no. This is totally at odds with everything I’ve taught the dc about their space and their bodies and how they should be respected by anyone when they say no.

I’m at the stage now where I’m planning stuff to clash with the visits

Kids are 9,12,15

Ever thought about putting locks on the kids bedroom doors. (Only do be used when he visits, so they can lock him out) I think that would be a start.

Maybe getting the DC to write down how their uncle's behaviour makes them feel (but only if the DC actually want to do it) then show it to DH.

Talk to the NSPCC for advise.

Show your DH this thread. (Internet strangers can grasp how wildly inappropriate it is, why cant he?)

When you know he's coming to visit, take the kids out somewhere if you can or DH goes somewhere with BIL.

Tell your kids that they are allowed to say no, be firm and mean it.

Your husband really needs counselling to let him see how weird his whole family are.
he must think i's normal and he was brought up like it.
Tbh, your dh is a huge concern, next time it could be someone else or another inappropriate contact, he doesn't understand boundaries if he thinks bil behaviour is normal.
Why on earth be polite to an abuser.

Show your dp this thread, and agree NOW that he is never allowed near your kids again.

I would rather ask my dp to leave our home for good, than be forced in to have this predator in my house again. Your dc are far far too old for this, it is completely wrong.

OP your kids are telling you loud and clear what is going on here!

I don't agree with locks on bedroom doors, their home should be somewhere they feel safe and comfortable. They shouldn't have to lock themselves in their bedrooms. You and their father shouldn't be allowing the danger into their home. Your DH can meet him out of the house on his own there is no need for BIL to come to your house.

I think you should show DH this thread as it is, he is not seeing how serious this is - and leave in the 'what would happen if I left him' he needs to see this!!

Teaching your dc that they are not safe in their own homes by installing locks is NOT the answer. What happens when they need the bathroom/water, and he is lying in wait. Quite apart from the risk of fire.

You need to face this absolutely head on with your dp.

Get rid of his dangerous toxic family members or else.

Many helpful suggestions. However....

Putting locks on the bedroom doors, taking the children out before a visit, asking them to shout at him...

None of these 100% address the problems directly. As I wrote earlier I am a foster carer and have looked after many children who faced similar circumstances at home. And although putting locks on doors etc may seem a short term solution it really is no more than that. I looked after 3 children who faced inappropriate behaviour from a relative, their parents puts locks on their bedroom doors thinking it would be a good thing. However, when one of the children told a teacher of the inappropriate behaviour, social services were called in. When they saw the locks on the bedroom doors (which the parents had done to protect them) they were very unhappy that the parents had taken it seriously enough to do that but not seriously enough to report the person. It actually worked against the parents and the children were removed. I hope this makes sense (not sure it does). What I mean to say is please deal with the main issue and not just try ways to get around it.

Id be telling your kids to scream the house down if he touches them again, shout at him to get his fucking hands off. Maybe your Dh will notice then. Give each of them a key for their bedroom door and if they wish to have privacy while bil is visiting they can lock the door. I cannot believe your Dh thinks this behaviour is acceptable when your children have said they don't want it happening.

mayflower43

You make good sense

OP please read her post several times

I’d be furious if my dh said the kids had to be polite to their uncle. No they really don’t. He needs to respect their space and wishes. How are kids supposed to learn that no means no when the adults around them are showing them.

Good luck with your dh. Think you’re going to need it.

Maybe a bolt on the inside rather than a lock.

But yeah, it’s ridiculous. It sounds a bit boiling frog OP, that he’s been doing it since they were toddlers and no one has been questioning how okay it is.

Surely if you gave your DH an ultimatum he would choose to keep the family together over his brother?

I'm really concerned by the number of pp saying to put locks on doors, go for long walks when the uncle pops over etc

THIS IS NOT SOLVING THE PROBLEM THAT HE IS SEXUALLY ABUSIVE

Sorry for shouting, but there is so much minimising going on on this thread

The uncle is sexually abusing three children (at least three children - who knows who else he is "lifting by the crotch")

The parents are failing to stop this. They are not keeping their children safe in their own home. They are enabling the abuse to continue by allowing the abuser access to the house. They have not sought support for the children who have been abused. They have not demonstrated to the children that they are their priority.

Things like locks are just avoidance tactics. There is no excuse for not reporting this to the police and social services. Uncle has had plenty of warnings and chances to change his behaviour - he has not done so. What are the parents waiting for? How bad does it have to get?

x-post with mayflower, who put the point across better than me (ie without shouting)

Why should your children have to deal with the problem by locking themselves in their room or screaming at him, or have to leave the house because he is visiting?

He needs to stop visiting, your husband can meet up with him somewhere else if he wants to see him.

There's no way that touching them in the crotch can be innocent, if he really doesn't know this is wrong then he shouldn't ever be near enough your kids to do it again. And if he does know it's wrong, even more so.

x-posted with Oleannas and Mayflower, same conclusion, and maybe it needs shouting.

Please don’t put locks on their doors. They should be safe in their home, not only while locked in their rooms. You must keep your BIL away from your children. Either stop him coming into your home, or take your kids out somewhere every time he’s going to visit.

You must protect your children. It’s hard for you to hear this, but right now you are not protecting them. That they’re having to hide in their own homes when there’s a family member visiting should tell you that. You must do more.

It does make sense. Children should feel safe in their own home, their entire home.

Yes and all the "if he does it again..." crap. The children have been abused for years. It should stop now, not next time

Yes, by lock I meant something they can control from the inside. I do get everyone saying they shouldn't have to and it doesn't solve the problem.

I guess I was kind of hoping that such a move may make the dh realise how serious it is, that the kids feel the need to do it. Right now he doesn't seem to be taking it seriously. It might be a wake up call for him.

I do think though that avoidance tactics are better than no tactics. Which is what seems to be happening at the moment. Whatever the OP is doing isn't enough and isn't working. She says she's told her dh that "it's odd". She needs to be using far more serious language than "odd". I don't think in a million years either parent will call Ss or the police. And I'm worried they won't tackle the BIL.

Children shouldn’t have to lock themselves in a room to protect themselves from someone they’re are very uncomfortable with, what a crazy suggestion, what message is that giving them? Imagine them telling an outsider that they lock themselves away when a certain man is in the house. They need to talk to their dad and explain in no uncertain terms how this man makes them feel and their dad needs to hear them. Parents have a duty to protect their children and this is a horrible situation for them that had to be sorted immediately, they must feel unsafe and confused as to why their mum and dad allow this to happen.

Crotch? This word is too detached imo.
He's touching their genitals.

"they hate this and always have"

And your eldest is 15 now - this must have been going on since he/she was a toddler, and subsequently to the younger siblings. Years, absolutely years. Dear god.

I have to weigh in in support of brekkie. If this is true, a man comes to your home twice a month and inappropriately touches your children - they don’t like it and hide to avoid this man. You have asked him to stop and he won’t. But he is still visiting your house.

Your husband won’t ask him to stop, and thinks the children are being rude by not allowing this man to touch them in intimate places.

While it might be difficult to hear, you aren’t protecting your children and you need to start.

It is difficult to understand why you have been so passive in this.

I’m not surprised they are keeping away from him. Your children are not being protected against a man, who is acting like a predator. Whether or not his motives are innocent is irrelevant.

Your husband needs to get the message that his brother's behaviour is utterly unacceptable. No more visits inside the house, he can meet his brother in public.

There's every chance that your children will report the uncle's behaviour to teachers, triggering a safeguarding investigation. Or discuss it with friends, which might lead to accusations being levelled far more publicly at your BIL.

Your husband needs to support you on this. Your children need your protection.