Alex Salmond...

[justasking111]

He has now been arrested and charged. Not released the reason why yet.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-46984747

He refutes allegations of criminality. That's an interesting line. He's not saying "I'm innocent" he's saying "I didn't do anything wrong"

I wouldn't necessarily read too much in to that, it's the way he tends to speak/phrase things.

I wonder if more women will come forward, as is often the way of these things.

That's depressing to hear, DoAsYouWouldBeMumBy.

@GrandmaSteglitszch I know

The scariest and saddest thing about this is the men who are saying it’s not a court matter and these women shouldn’t have complained.

My indy obsessed friend has posted that she's 'team Alex' and that the timing is suspicious.

My heart just sinks. Really? The tribalism shows up everything that's wrong in Scotland and wider society. My guy can't do bad things unrelated to his undisputed good points, but yours can because I don't like him.

It's a heart sink moment and it's going to get so very much worse as this plays out.

He certainly comes across as a creepy opportunist, but he deserves a fair trial, and can then be found guilty or not guilty.

TBF MorrisZapp I think you get people like that in relation to any field, so fans of pop singers or actors or writers refuse to believe when allegations are made.

Not sure this is totally dividing down party lines - I have a really pro-SNP friend who is also a civil servant and while she's horrified at the level of the charges, isn't totally shocked whereas I know some really anti-SNP folk who are saying things like "I don't believe he'd be so foolish so it can't be true"

Of course he deserves a fair trial, but with his profile it's simply unavoidable that there will be huge press interest. Social media is out of control too, and the very 'grass roots' activism is allows will also let the other side say their shit as well.

Are we saying that men in well known positions can't be held accountable for sexual offences because their profile makes a fair trial impossible? Surely me too showed that this kind of crap is basically endemic and needs to be held up to daylight.

Yes, and that's my point. People don't understand what a principle is. It isn't holding your enemies to account, it's holding people you regard highly to account too, be they politicians, sports stars or singers.

I agree Morris. All it’s going to take is a few brainwashed Nat cult members who can’t see any wrong in AS no matter what and see the whole thing as a “wastemonster” conspiracy to be on the jury and there will be no chance of a conviction, no matter how strong the evidence is. On the other hand I can’t stand Alex Salmond but I would never find him guilty unless I was sure beyond reasonable doubt on the evidence but equally I wonder if some people who can’t stand him might just see any opportunity to send him down even if the evidence didn’t stack up. We’ll need to wait and see I guess but if I was a betting woman, I’d put money on him not being convicted.

Well said, MorrisZapp

It's the level of tribalism which makes me wonder how on earth they'll select a jury with any chance of giving him a fair trial. I don't doubt there are sufficient level headed people, but how they'll separate them out is something I don't pretend to know

That's interesting, because I'd do the opposite, I'd bet good money on him being convicted and sent to jail for a long time.

The police and cps will have been overly cautious in making sure they had enough to charge, which means they think they can win it based on thr evidence they have, and I don't think there has ever been a case where multiple women have made allegations like this against one man and it's not been proven to be true and he's not been convicted, I suspect it would be a first if he wasn't convicted based on the scale of this and the multiple victims.

False allegations happen, but it's always a lone wolf, always.

As such, I'd put money on him going to jail for a very long time.

I agree bluntness. If it was possible to bring vexatious allegations of sexual offences against controversial politicians on a whim then the courts wouldn't have time for anything else.

The Crown prosecute based on whether there’s sufficient admissible evidence and whether it’s in the public interest. That’s all. They don’t decide it based on the quality of the evidence as such (I used to work for them so know a bit about how it all works). You only need to look at the woeful conviction rates for sexual offences in general to see that cases where there is sufficient evidence for prosecution don’t always end in conviction.

In other words not being convicted doesn’t mean that the allegations in the first place were false.

School, true, but due to who he is, the publicity and bearing in mind how litigious he is, I think it's safe to assume the police and cps were highly cautious. In addition as said, if this was a lone wolf it would be very very different, but there are multiple women involved in these allegations, and is over an extended period of time. I think it really would be the first time many women clubbed together to maliciously target one man.

Yes, but none of that guarantees a conviction, especially if you get enough blinkered loonies and tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorists on the jury.

Nigel Evans MP was acquitted of raping one young man and sexually assaulting six others, so it’s not unheard of for a case with a string of alleged victims to be thrown out.
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/apr/10/nigel-evans-cleared-raping-university-student

Has it been confirmed to be reports from multiple women? Rather than several reports from the original two women?
If it is reports from several women, then that does seem pretty damning.

Pedantic but if we are discussing scottish law then can we get the terminology correct. It’s COPFS (or for laziness PF). We don’t have CPS in Scotland.

And even if there is more than one woman it doesn’t necessarily follow there will be a conviction. I frequently have non recent sexual offences with more than one complainer, they don’t all get convicted. Every case and trial is different.

Legally guilty or legally not guilty. Either way, doesn't change reality.

read some of the Twitter comments by the Cyper Nats. This is apparently all a conspiracy led by Theresa May and Gov. UK to divert attention from Brexit and turn people away from a second Indyref. AlexSalmond is , apparently, a martyr!

Cybernats are a very small minority of Independence supporters.