Where children really better behaved in the past or do people remember with rose tinted glasses?

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This is inspired by a video online whereby a toddler was having a massive tantrum on a 8 hour flight.
A lot of the comments underneath basically were how terrible a parent the mother was and how in their day the child wouldn't have dared behave like that.
What is the alleged difference? What are we not doing that we did then? Or do people only remember the good parts and forget their children also behaved like that.
I personally as a mother of a toddler found the comments awful. I suspect the mother was not having the time of her life either.

In the old days you were taught to respect your elders

How, and to what end?

I saw the video and although I don’t agree with the comments underneath I would be fuming if I had been on the flight. People would have paid hundreds of pounds for that! I’m amazed the kid wasn’t hurt whilst running up and down and sitting on top of the seats fiddling with the ceiling of the plane! I don’t think kids are worse behaved but it’s much easier to spread videos like this that show one child behaving badly and making it a reflection on kids in general. No one ever shares the good.

I got hit by a 7/8 year old on a scooter in Lidl. I stepped back from a shelf and she hit me. Her mother told ME I should watch where I was going. I suggested a busy supermarket wasn’t the place for a scooter and the response was “she can use it where she wants”.

It was the week before Christmas and I couldn’t find in any staff to complain to and the check out staff were too busy to care.

The bruising is still there although fading.

As a teacher, I can categorically confirm that in my experience, the behaviour of children has changed astronomically over the last 20 years.

Back then, the parents were on side. Now they are obsessed with entitlement, which is being passed on to their darling offspring. There is also a massive raise in children with SEN being educated in mainstream schools which has obviously had an impact on behavioural issues.

I don't think people change much from one generation to another. Social expectations/behaviours do though.
I grew up in the 1970's kids were naughty and often pretty brutal to each other. In retrospect I was actually often pretty bad - just never caught out! You had much less supervision from adults.
Now I am a pillar of society! (Not really!) and a parent. I think kids generally aren't better or worse. Most of the kids I know are nice, police mostly well behaved people. At DD's age I had already shoplifted, nicked fags off my Mum and smoked them, tried (very half heartedly) to run away from home and had written on my Mums walls with permanent ink. DD has done nothing similar - or if she has, she's concealed it well!

Well you absolutely would not have seen a toddler having a tantrum on an aeroplane back in my day!

Nobody I knew could afford to fly anywhere and for anyone who could it was a once in a childhood kind of thing that wouldn't have been undertaken with a toddler in the family.

I was a teacher 20 years ago and I was horrified then with parents siding with children! So if it’s got worse ...

I think many parents have-thankfully- a more enlightened attitude today.

In the past, children were just labelled as naughty and no-one ever referred to special behavioural or emotional needs.

Today, we are aware that many children may be on the spectrum. I want to live in a world where the word 'naughty' falls out of favour and instead we think about why a child is behaving as it is.

The boy with the trainers upthread. There could be many reasons for his wanting to wear his trainers there and then and he might also suffer with PDA a condition which should be more widely known.

Children aren't 'naughty' and it is my fond hope that this silly word will soon become unacceptable.

As for children not being listened to...words fail me!

A few years ago DH (DP as he was back then) visited some friends of his. He was in the process of divorcing and the friends were relatives of his EXW (who were NC with her but wanted to stay in touch with him). He popped to the loo and their teen DGD looked me straight in the face and in front of her DGPs and DM said to me “If you hurt him, I’ll fucking kill you”. I would never have dared to speak to a guest like that and I won’t swear in front of my parents, or DHs DM or DS. Had I dared to speak like that....well tbh the consequences would have been so awful that even at my age (39) I can’t even imagine. She had zero respect for me (as a guest), her DGPs or DM and all she was told was “(Name)! Stop that!”. Obviously I don’t know if she got a massive bollocking after we left. To answer the original question, I do think that kids were, if not “better behaved”, certainly less indulged and behaviour that would have been seen as unacceptable when I was young (none of my friends would have dared swear at an adult) seems to be more tolerated now.

I remember as a child being too scared to misbehave when out (ie show my mother up) as I knew there would be consequences when we got home. So basically my good behaviour was driven by fear.
I’d rather children being more unruly than behaving because of fear.

trancepants - good point

toddlers/kids probably seemed better behaved in ye olden days because they were to a large extent excluded from many adult activities and places - thus others simply didn't see them misbehaving

Scooters in shops drive me nuts there is no need for scooting in Lidl.

We flew last week and there was a child in front of us who screamed for an hour or so. The parents were bloody useless at dealing with it. We have flown every year with our kids for 14 years and never have they behaved like that.

I have high expectations for my kids in terms of behaviour. I see parents all the time who just don't seem to be able to say no to their kids or pull them up on their behaviour. On holiday my kids wanted their picture done by a statue - it had big signs on it saying please don't climb on or touch the statue. My kids stood next to it. Whilst we were waiting for our turn one family just let their kids climb all over it - why? It spoils things for everyone. No doubt in time it will be removed or end up behind a barrier so you can't stand with it.

Not saying I get it right every time (I really don't!) or that my kids are angels but I try really hard to parent them the best I can and that means saying no sometimes!

MissCharleyP that's creepy, why would a teenage girl come out with that? Did she have a massive crush on your DP? Were they close?

I don't think that's a badly behaved child so much as a disturbed one, or at least one who's watched far too many age inappropriate films!

At my primary in the 70s if a child had answered back they would have been severely told off. Nowadays that probably would result in a parent going in to complain.
I think bullying was worse then though as teachers didn't get as involved. My kids are at the local comp. One is quite geeky and one has red hair. Neither has experienced comments or bullying. I believe they would have done in the 70s/80s when i was at school. Kids know it isn't tolerated now

Children in the past spent far less time with adults in adult spaces. They were left alone / with other children for hours on end so when they did sit down with adults it was for an hour only.

When I was pre-school age in the 70s we would not be in coffee shops and rarely in restaurants unless a very special occasion when we’d be pre warned to behave or face severe consequences.

I suspect in the “old” days children were left to their own devices more so adults didn’t know exactly what they get up to.

Me and brother used to be left free range. Now my kids are with me a lot of the time at home and they do piss about. It annoys me but then I think actually a lot of what they did, I did too and didn’t get in trouble as mum wasn’t there.

I think there’s a better understanding of what drives good and bad behaviour and, as a result, there’s more respect for children. Some people don’t seem to appreciate that children do behave differently and don’t have the same impulse control. They aren’t mini adults and need to learn and make mistakes in order to learn.

Personally I think it takes a village to raise a child and more adults should be able to tell children off - it helps them learn social boundaries a lot faster. I know my dcs will listen more to another grown up than me 😬😆🙈

I’m sure that less outdoor time, less responsibility and too much screen time has a detrimental effect on behaviour.

@MrsFezziwig interesting you say that, DH and I took our two (DD5 and DS19Mnth) to the water park yesterday, it was crazy busy with three kids scooting flat out, running in to other kids and narrowly avoiding other kids (small water park), by all appearances, no parents watching them.

The eldest who looked about 10 almost took out my 19mth old, I yelled at him 'get off your damn scooter' - my DH who was less than 1m away didn't even hear me.

A minute later a lady approached me and says 'those kids on the scooters, they are my kids', at this point I thought she was going to apologise but she continued 'my kids are just having fun, you have no right to yell at them, I have told them to be careful' I tell her 'your child nearly took out my toddler and they are banging in to other kids, going flat out and definitely not being careful' .... she replies 'I know it's hot and everyone is cranky but there is no need for you to be a bitch, they are just kids having a bit of fun and if I yelled at your kid you wouldn't be happy about it'..... at that point I replied 'well actually if my child did what yours did you would be well within your right to tell them off but I wouldn't let my children do something so silly and you should be considering other people's children's safety, the place is crowded and there is no room for scooters' then turned my back on her and walked off.

Her kids continued to 'carefully' use their scooters and one of her kids managed to run over my DD's foot about 20 minutes later, kid was sorry and apologised but because of selfish, self centred Mum my daughter was injured.

I agree that some parents do step on and defend their children rather than let them get a reasonable telling off when they should accept them/their kids were doing the wrong thing.

As others have said, the world was less inclusive of toddlers and young children in the past. No-one would have dreamt of taking a toddler on a plane (or probably afforded it unless they were super-rich) so the tantrum wouldn't have happened in the first place.

My DM was telling me how my DF used to have to go into a pub or restaurant and ask if it was Ok for them to take me in when I was a child. As he was v tall, he would often be asked by the wary publican if he was a policeman checking them out Generally as soon as they knew the coast was clear, we were allowed to sit in the garden but definitely not inside. And we were only asking as my DM wasn't British and so wouldn't stand for staying home the whole time or leaving me in the car with a packet of crisps.

Nowadays every restaurant and pub has a kids meal, a colouring in set and you expect to see children out and about but in the 70s and early 80s they were not the norm.

I'm not sure screens are to blame. The tantrummiest, worst behaved children I know are raised entirely without screens.

They probably were. But they were taught to "do as they were told" and not ask questions. Even further back theres the saying "children should be seen and not heard". So, generally, they were disciplined more strictly and - to my mind - too strictly.

Theres is a very young age when its not discipline but the child yelling to tell you something - they are tired or uncomfortable, perhaps. Its likely that a lot of these situations didnt exist many years ago so the young child would be put down for a nap or so forth. Or at least not in a confined environment (like a plane) when they kicked off. Im only 50 but the earliest I knew of a child flying was a mate when she was 14 to Majorca, and that was unusual.

There are a lot of useless parents on flights milking the specialness of flying with a baby though... I've flown on my own with a 5 year old, a 3 year old and a baby but the ridiculous hopeless drama a couple with one 9 month old between them can make makes preventing eyes from rolling a challenge.

As others say that isn't new though, and obviously a baby is just a baby, not capable of being naughty or good.

I think that nowadays a lot of empty threats are made and there are no real consequences for children.

I was terrified of my mum as a kid (I'm coming up 50), she was very free with her hands and what she said went, no argument you did as you were told or the consequences were physical punishment along with a lot of terrifying shouting from her.

I vowed to be different with my children. As it happens I have just the one. When he was small I used time out as an appropriate method of punishment, he got 3 warnings and then a time out. I told him "no" a lot! I think the most important lesson I learned was to be consistent with him. Also he got whatever I said he would, be that an ice cream for good behaviour or an early bed time for bad! He's got a fiery temper and has at times been difficult, but I think having the expectation that he would behave in a certain way and modeling that for him had really helped.

I cannot get my head round people being frightened of saying no(sometimes repeatedly) to their children, I know of someone who was prepared to change an expensive piece of equipment to one their child couldn't mess with rather than just repeatedly saying no and removing their child from the situation every time they are where they shouldn't have been. It takes patience and perseverance but it works in the end but it is hard work and I guess not the easy option.

I think that is probably part of the reason, raising a child is not all unicorns and rainbows it is a lot of hardwork, a lot of saying no, being consistent and following through. When people are working hard and running homes and everything else they have to do, sometimes it's too hard to stand in front of a tantrumming child and say no, it's much easier to give in for an easy life. The natural consequence of that, even if it initially comes from a place of love, is that the child had no real boundaries, and a sense of entitlement, which is not great for anyone else.

I was brought up in the 70s and the fear of being hit was real and present, so as previous posters have said our good behaviour was in large part achieved through fear. And we did not get taken out to adult spaces like kids do now - coffee shops, restaurants etc were such rare treats I can’t really remember it happening til I was in early teens.

I'm not sure screens are to blame. The tantrummiest, worst behaved children I know are raised entirely without screens

That doesn’t prove anything. Screens may make a child sit still but they stop a child properly interacting with the world around them and therefore they just don’t learn. Screens make life easier for the parents as it’s effort to engage and entertain a child.