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Where children really better behaved in the past or do people remember with rose tinted glasses?

461 replies

username5555 · 28/12/2018 09:17

This is inspired by a video online whereby a toddler was having a massive tantrum on a 8 hour flight.
A lot of the comments underneath basically were how terrible a parent the mother was and how in their day the child wouldn't have dared behave like that.
What is the alleged difference? What are we not doing that we did then? Or do people only remember the good parts and forget their children also behaved like that.
I personally as a mother of a toddler found the comments awful. I suspect the mother was not having the time of her life either.

OP posts:
3WildOnes · 29/12/2018 10:44

I agree with LisaSimpson teenage drinking, pregnancy and crime rates have all gone down.
The classmates of my children are much better behaved than my classmates at primary school were. I regularly hear people talk about how they were physically and verbally bullied at school but my children have never experienced this at their schools. I think because parents are much less likely to smack or shout at their children these days children are actually much kinder to each other, this is my experience.
I do think children are less inclined to do what their parents tell them and although two of mine are very well behaved one is more challenging (only for me and his dad) I think this is probably because we are less authoritative and don’t routinely smack like our parents did.

Biologifemini · 29/12/2018 10:49

I have noticed a lot of parents being fearful of their kids reactions.
When they are little it is odd because if they aren’t disciplined then, then they quickly become unmanageable as teens.
Also the ‘trust your teen’ nonsense. No way would I trust a teen with unfettered access to the internet.
Bullying? Violent porn? Naked selfies? Not sure I will be too impressed when the school calls up to inform me of something I could have managed myself at home.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 29/12/2018 10:52

I think what is considered acceptable behaviour has changed

This ^^

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HarrySnotter · 29/12/2018 10:53

Absolutely agree with every word in your post @Biologifemini

Some parents are so scared that their kids won't like them that they are nervous about discipline, so take the easy way out. I'm not here to be my DCs pal, I'm their mum and they don't like some of the boundaries they are set sometimes. Tough shit.

canigetaliein · 29/12/2018 11:09

Firstly all children are different, DC1 would be impeccably behaved in very posh French restaurants from the age of 2. Nothing to do with my parenting & this proved by the arrival of DC2 who I can’t even take to pizza express as he’s wild.

Secondly the world has changed, coffee shops, chain restaurants (not McDs), cheap flights were not that common in years gone by so children didn’t have the opportunity to misbehave. Also parents would leave kids at home, in the car, let them walk to school etc... which is now frowned upon.

I got the wooden spoon occasionally as a kid & it worked for me, my parents got the belt & the cane in school. My dad would walk to school alone at 5/6 & my mum would play out with her siblings/friends all day. Even though I grew up in London (80s) I used to play a lot with neighbours & we would go off in a big group, we were outside all the time. No way would my neighbours be ok with that now.

GloryforGloves · 29/12/2018 11:11

It’s incredible the amount of posters here who both claim that children are more poorly behaved these days but are also parents of children who ‘never tantrum’. No one wants to accept that their child might be one of the poorly behaved children - so where are these children coming from?

FishCanFly · 29/12/2018 11:17

No children were not better behaved in the past - that's utter bullshit. Just parents had different values and priorities re. discipline.

HoppingPavlova · 29/12/2018 11:18

Really? I’m not sure what it’s like where you all live but that’s not my experience of child/parent relationships.

Well, I’m not s teacher but I worked in A&E for nearly 30 years and in that capacity saw a huge shift in child/parent relationships from when I started to when I left. Not for the better. It may not be in your bubble but I saw people from all walks of life, all social circumstances and it was one thing that was pretty universal. There has been a definite shift with who is in charge and it isn’t pretty.

EwItsAHooman · 29/12/2018 11:26

Perhaps it's regional too. Kids still play out a lot here and are expected to walk themselves to/from school by age 9 (year five), school don't check to see if an adult has met them from year five and simply release them out the doors. The only people who I know for a fact smack their children (because they've done it in public) are the parents of the two worst behaved (non-related) children in the school, everyone else I know either doesn't smack or is doing it behind closed doors although I've known most of the parents in DS class since they were all babies so we have all had behaviour comparison/how do I handle this chats at some point and I know which have said they don't smack. I've seen very little of the 'kids today' behaviours described on this thread, the local children and teens have their moments of less than perfect behaviour because they're children/teens and it comes with the territory but for the large part they're alright, polite and respectful when needed, and the school encourages community spirit which the parents support - one of the local playgroups is run at the school library by year 10 and 11 pupils and the 6th formers do the Toddler Rhyme Time session, pupils helped plant a WW1&2 memorial garden at the local church, they helped redecorate the local preschool, and so on. I've been walking down the street before with the DC or standing at the cash point and there'll be a group of kids from the middle or high school nearby, messing about like kids do, and one of them has sworn or run across the road or something else they shouldn't have done and right away the others will round on them "there are little kids there! Don't do that in front of them!" and as a group they'll apologise. I see no problems with the up and coming generation.

canigetaliein · 29/12/2018 11:31

Abouttime1978 Good post.

I definitely struggle at times as a parent, would love some insights from some of the parents on this thread with how to deal with bad behaviour on a flight for example?

CarolDanvers · 29/12/2018 11:34

I think people spent a lot less time with their kids as they were always out playing or roaming so naughty behaviour was conducted out of sight. I got up to stuff that I shudder to think of my own kids doing.

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 29/12/2018 11:35

Red toddler tantrums - it's not always a case of rose tinted glasses.

My dd1 never had one - I am well aware that I was very lucky in that she was a very sunny-natured child.
My dd2 only ever had one, a real screamer, at maybe 20 months, and that was because I literally had to prise her fingers off the handle off a mini doll's pram in a shop - she wanted it so badly. I was going to buy it for her for Christmas anyway, she certainly wasn't getting it there and then. But I did feel sorry for her, since she was too little to understand.

But I remember that so well because it was the only one. And BTW I have never thought their lack of tantrums was down to my perfect parenting - far from it - I know I was just very lucky.

Frogletmamma · 29/12/2018 11:38

Some things have got better. When I was young there were words used against different races or the disabled you just don't hear now.

BelindaBellender · 29/12/2018 12:07

Laughing my head off at the “my 1 yo child ate so nicely at the table” post. Wait for it next year...!

Also judging tantrums in public. I was probably the same and now have a 5yo with complex sensory and social challenges who frankly is pretty much unpredictable when we go anywhere depending on anything from hunger to tiredness to what the fucking weather is doing!

He is well-behaved and well-mannered but can freak out at any given time (probably not unlike most 5yo tbh) and I would be gutted if anyone were to judge my parenting on a 5 min snapshot of him going crazy!

Be kind folks.

IfNotNowBernard · 29/12/2018 12:36

The behaviour in my high school was often atrocious and thats nearly 30 years ago.
Constant low level disruption, backchat, occasions of kids threatening teachers, throwing chairs,weed...arson..!
I definitely think young people have always needed shit loads of sport or other physical activity , fresh air and boundaries, and when any if those are missing mayhem happens.I do think kids today are inside more and more sedentary, which doesn't help.

BertieBotts · 29/12/2018 13:10

Hopping that is indeed all utter bollocks - it also bears no relation to any parenting advice I've ever seen anywhere. No "guru", no "fad". It's a straw man argument.

OTOH the argument that if smacking was a fantastic tool you'd only need to do it once is ridiculous as well. I don't know of any discipline or teaching tool which is so fantastic you only need to do it once! I don't agree with smacking but there are much better arguments against it than "it's not a miracle".

Palestperson · 29/12/2018 13:13

My DS has never had a tantrum either. He was a very very difficult baby who creamed and cried constantly but from around 16-18 months onward he became really easy and well behaved. I kept waiting for the tantrum phase but it never came. I think he hated being a baby and was just so pleased to be able to tell me what he wanted and walk about that it didn’t occur to him to be cross at anything. That was entirely down to his personality. That he has stayed really reasonable and well behaved ever since (9 now) is down to a combination of that personality and parenting. And I am well aware that all bets are off when he becomes a teenager.

taybert · 29/12/2018 14:00

Hopping I’m not in a bubble, as it happens I also work with children and families every day, from all walks of life. Of course things are different, some for the better, some for the worse, but to say the example of a 13 year old being allowed to drive a car “typifies” these relationships is nonsense.

Flamingosnbears · 29/12/2018 14:25

Children are exposed to more via internet so for that reason is say behaviour isn't as innocent as it once was look at the technology available children from a very young age are using ATS all about growing up fast and skipping childhood...

notacooldad · 29/12/2018 14:31

Some things have got better. When I was young there were words used against different races or the disabled you just don't hear now.

That's not what I'm hearing.
It's as bad as it ever was. Same type of insults just different words.

missyB1 · 29/12/2018 15:05

I don’t hear racism in my ds school (very multicultural). But I do hear homophobic comments Sad And yes I strongly suspect there are disablist comments too.

LongDecember · 29/12/2018 16:01

A friend of mine was on holiday with some other couples/families. One kid (aged around 6) got everything they wanted, no questions asked. If they were given something that morning and saw a 'better' version of the toy later that day they'd be given it too. Anything they asked for, they were given. My friend couldn't believe it, she got her own kid a couple of little things but said she'd never seen a child as spoiled and badly behaved as this.

Then another child's toy was lost and it was suggested that the other kid shared their toys. Kid had a HUGE tantrum and screamed at their mother that they hated them. Their mother just stood there looking defeated. One of the other parents turned to the child and angrily said, "Don't you DARE speak to your mother like that! Say sorry at once!! And be nice and share with other kid!!" Both the child and their mother were totally in shock my friend says but the kid let the other child play with their toys after that. The child has obviously never been pulled up on any wrongdoings or told no. Consequently run rings around their mother.

That's what's wrong a lot of the time, some parents try to be friends with their kids rather than parent them, and never say no. They're making a rod for their own back.

Oh and I definitely was't allowed to make decisions about stuff as a child, or factored in on any decisions. I don't even remember being allowed to choose my own clothes as a kid, not until I was a teenager at least.

BoneyBackJefferson · 29/12/2018 16:25

Late to the party but children have always pushed the boundaries of behaviour.

Yes children's behaviour has gotten (its old English get over it) worse, But its because they are allowed to get away with so much more.

ChocolateWombat · 29/12/2018 17:05

I'd draw a distinction between toddler behaviour from the under 3s and behaviour from older children.

Toddlers are prone to tantrums and often will have them, regardless of parents. I guess people used to be less willing to let them happen in public places and removed their children quickly if they started to tantrum, or were less likely to take that age child into restaurants etc because they felt such behaviour wasn't appropriate for a restuarant...but today, lots if parents see tantrums as normal (which they are) but also have decided that their day to day life shouldn't be impeded by being in a tantrum phase - so lots will think they are perfectly entitled to be in a cafe or restaurant or supermarket and to let a tantruminf child carry on for 30 minutes, because they don't want to leave. I think there is less consideration of others and the impact of children's behaviour on others and a sense of entitlement to do whatever you like and that everyone has to just put up with whatever children are doing. The behaviour might not be different, but parents attitude towards it is and their willingness to let it happen in public or inflict it on others has changed.

Once children are beyond the toddler tantruminf phase, I think it is possible to see changes in behaviour, and that much of that is to do with parenting. I agree that less smacking goes on, which is a good thing, but also that alternative behaviour management approaches haven't really replaced it. Many parents are very passive and allow children to choose their own behaviour even when very small and even when it impacts on others. They are often reluctant to use any form of discipline when in public because they use it rarely and when they do, get a bad reaction from the children and do t want to go through that in public. But that's the thing isn't it....it's all about consistency and consistency requires effort over a sustained period. When it is applied consistently, children learn what is and isn't acceptable and when it is applied in public they will then respond. However if it isn't usually applied and an attempt is made to apply it occasionally in public, not surprisingly it doesn't work.

Teaching children appropriate behaviour is hard work. It takes a long time and consistency from parents and across situations. Essentially, I think many parents can't be bothered to put in the hard graft that is required to make it work. Inconsistent attempts don't work but just cause conflict which parents find embarrassing in public, so decide it's easier to just let children mostly do what they want and largely ignore poor behaviour. And over time, when you ignore it enough, you probably forget the behaviour is poor as it becomes normal, and when you see good behaviour it is surprising and unusual, rather than the norm.

ragged · 29/12/2018 17:10

I grew up reading Tom Sawyer books & watching Little Rascals. Rose Tinted glasses all the way. Shall I mention the Home Alone movies, too?