I'm a hoarder, AMA ( except for my bank details 🤣)

[HoarderAMA]

Just that really. Inspired by another thread.

It's a MH condition as set out in the DSM5.

I often feel it is the most shameful MH condition and no amount of "Be kind" would ever change that.

I dont think it will ever be one of the accepted conditions and it is full of shame and secrecy. I cant see that ever changing

Interesting. I'm curious as to effects of hoarding on children. & Why it is that hoarders don't appear to care about the awful, negative impact on their childrens' lives? It never seems to be really addressed/answered.

@DeeCeeCherry surely the same is true.for children of alcoholics or substance abusers?

It's not about setting off to abuse anyone. Others are collateral damage to the condition surely? Like if your inna abusive relationship the kids suffer, but that isnt the victims motive for staying with a abuser?

People really do have their kids removed by SS when its required. Safeguarding is everyone's responsibility and partners who turn blind eyes where kids are concerned are enablers.

BUT it's a problem.on a spectrum. If I'm currently able to tick along mostly at a level four with zero rubbish and following say TOMM method daily should my kids be automatically taken into care? If you came around my house right now you wouldn't know I was a hoarder. You might think it was too cluttered in places for you to live in.

The difference between me and the persons who house has just gradually fallen into a tip because the owner has got overwhelmed is that I struggle with desisions and emotions ( innrelation to objects). Even if I did Marie Kndo my house to within a inch of my life and it was minimalistic and empty, I personally would still be a hoarder as I want to comfort shop and I want to keep every item.of my kids clothing as it holds a memory.

I get rid of things that I dont want to. I resist buying. I live ( most of the time) a normal life in a normal but clutter house. But it's a strong urge I have to fight. Like wanting a drink or a fag when you have given up. Like I'm.one drink away from a bender or one smoke away from starting chain smoking. I'm constantly challenging myself not go there. If I said I was over it or reformed, what stopping me falling back into that spiral? I domt know if that's possible. I'm not sure its curable?

My house is cleaner and tidier than some peoples houses that arent hoarders. The difference is that if they was offered a house clearance and deep clean they might bite your hand off, whereas I would need to oversee it. They might just be unable to stay on top of the house, a hoarder is dealing with desisions and emotional attachments.

I guess that's one reason it took so long to seek help. The fear and shame that people presume I pee in bottles and keep that around the house. How do you prevent people escalating to that and not seeking help when media depicts the most severe and helpless people? No ones hoard starts off as a rotting hell hole full of dead rats floor to ceiling. Its starts off with that irrational thought process that then attaches itself to material things

This is a really interesting and helpful thread OP. I do appreciate you being so honest & open.
From reading this it is helpful for me to realise I am somewhere on the sliding scale you describe. I want to be on top of things but paperwork is covering many surfaces and never gets sorted. I now realise I am emotionally attached to too much baby books & clothes & the attic and a corridor is full of other memorabilia. I know I couldn't get anyone else to sort it because of needing to make emotional decisions about everything myself.
I have thousands of emails uncategorised. Yesterday I spent an age looking for a receipt email from 2 years ago. Took some detective work but I found it!

I am glad it is new year's eve tonight. I will endeavour to make small baby steps starting tomorrow. Not too much at once because there is such a vulnerability in the emotional exhaustion.
Thank you for sharing.

@PC20 try to think about what you need to do to get where you need to be.

Try to forget the normal rules.

How old are the kids? My youngest is 6 and I have only just got rid of all her baby things. I have one pram.and car seat to dump, that's it.

So, some people keep two outfits? Who dictates that rule? No one. Get yourself one or two of those 20l plastic boxes for example. That's how much you can keep. Why not if it means you can then see a few bin bags worth go? You might then be able to go back and thin those boxes again one day but as long as some things go?

I sold some things on Ebay. I made 1k! After that it was easier to give lots away. I became desensitized to the uncomfortable feeling of letting go.

Or say you must get rid of 1 thing a day or 2 things before you get one new.

Each item think, will I use this again? Do I need it? Can I replace it? Can I live without it? Maybe you cant live without it today, that's ok. But somethings will pass that test out of the door.

Be kind to yourself. But know you deserve your house back. The gold standard I aim for is everything away. If that means there is two 20L boxes of baby grows in my loft that's ok. As long as I can access the loft, and it's safe. That's about the best I can do right now.

I had a professional organiser privately and she mostly just sat and talked to me. She let me sound off and redirected my mind to the here and now. Do you have anyone who could do that?

It's really good that you can see you have the emotional attachments creeping in. But if you can keep those treasures clean tidy and sorted they will give you more joy and comfort than in a bottomless pile.

Another thing, how do you feel when you get out the baby things? Do you really make you feel happy? Or sad at the kids growing up fast? I think I went through some of ds1 clothes when I was expecting his brother and they actually made me really sad. That's when I clam up and think "not today thank you!" The box in the loft never gets opened. But i know it's there.

Test yourself. Put some of the tatty bits into a clothing bin and i bet you will cope better than you think. Good luck

Such an interesting thread OP.

@HoarderAMA

Reading with interest as a fellow hoarder
I have so much stuff in our house and lack of storage for toys and clothes and christmas is just added chaos with loads of new stuff and decorations and trying to make things nice for the kids

It's become overwhelming and almost impossible to manage now I can't stand it. I love going away to get away from it all and prior to lockdowns/ covid never stayed in on weekends as I found the mess too stressful so
Now my anxiety levels are they the roof.

I have bags and boxes of all sorts of stuff, things people have given me like hand me downs and toys which is kind but I just haven't got the space for them and it's become a nightmare

I could do with going to IKEA and spending loads on furniture/ storage but we just can't afford it - we moved from a
House with lots of fitted cupboards to having no fitted cupboard space here.

Another terrible habit I have is if stuff is mega cheap in sales buying it, for presents, craft stuff (that I never use!!) and then every corner of every room becomes a mound of bags for life but thankfully the shops are shut in tier 4! And buying loads of kids clothes miles in advance then having loads they've grown out of without even being worn.

When people see us out my kids are imaculate and clean I feel like I live a double life. I never (obviously before covid) invite anyone round to my house I'm too ashamed.

I also am ashamed to say that during the first lockdown I did hoard a bit so have tonnes of tinned food and toiletries and some other stuff and nowhere for it to go and so that is all now piled up in bags and boxes.

Op I feel your pain - my New Years resolution is to try to de-clutter 🤦🏻‍♀️

@HoarderAMA
A professional organiser??
That sounds amazing
I'd be far too embarrassed to let any of my friends help me. I keep them away from the house and no chance in lockdown thankfully
I just want my house back I hate living here and I get to 4pm at work and dread coming home and having to find space to cook tea and then clear the dining table of the junk that's amassed - I fact I often give my kids a carpet picnic if I can't face it 🤦🏻‍♀️

Really interesting thread. I can see now the link with addiction. It’s just addiction to stuff rather than a substance. Glad you have it under control currently.

Is there a known assessment scale to test if you are a hoarder?

I definitely have hoarding tendencies, although I like to think it's at a lower level and I (just about) manage to keep it in check.

However I have my home office in a loft conversion which seems to have become the repository for stuff I just can't seem to deal with:

• kids old schoolbooks/artwork (I've already sorted through it a couple of times, but still have a couple of boxes
• boxes of stuff left from when my Dad died (8 years ago! ). He was the last family member, so he himself had boxes of memories from the rest of my family - grandparents/ aunts/ uncles.

My problem is that it takes too long to get rid of stuff, other than just chucking it all in a skip, which I simply can't bring myself to do. My dad had lots of antique books on a very specific regional subject which I spent ages finding a home for - eventually a museum very gratefully took them, but it took time and money to organise sending them etc.

@Hope4theBestPlan4theWorst

Would you feel able to approach your gp? It's not the best timing with a pandemic but it's never a perfect time is it?

CBT is the therapy of choice. I have had two lots of CBT, 1:1 psychologist / psychiatrist? therapy and really need talking therapy about my mums abuse. But I'm not really ready for that. Plus it would have to be face to face for me.

Do you have a partner? How do you think it would feel to say the words out loud "I have a issue with my belongings and letting go?" Saying it out loud actually felt quite a release for me.

It's hard because the only person that can ultimately help you, is you. But you can do it.

Think about how you feel when you find the brand new things that no longer fit the kids at the back of wardrobe. How does it make you feel? Was it a bargain really if you never used them? Feel that pain, bottle it up and keep it so that you can recall it when you see the next bargin. It helps honestly. It's like having a picture of yourself overweight in a bikini on the fridge door. "Mmm I need some chocolate ( clocks the photo) good God no!" ( walks away from.the fridge )

Clutter image scales.

hoardingdisordersuk.org/research-and-resources/clutter-image-ratings/

I also need to say that there is a level of denial or blindness or maybe delusion in hoarding, as if you ask me where I am on the scale, my loved ones always say I'm higher and I'm always a bit incredulous about it.

Painful but true.

Those clutter images are quite surprising to me. The level really steps up quite fast until its unmanageable. You’ve inspired me to do some clearing today. I’ve brought down about 7 bags of kids clothes to take to the clothes recycling tomorrow.

My sister and Bil are both firefighters, hoarding is a deadly affair, have you spoke to your local fire station on how to protect your family in case of a fire,

Those clutter images are fascinating. The difference between stage 1 and stage 2 in all cases seems quite high to me. Stage 7/8/9 seems almost incomprehensible but I know that a surprising number of people do live like that from watching the hoarding programmes. 1 room in my house is at about stage 3 and I feel I have a significant problem.

Those clutter images are an eye-opener. To a non-hoarder, anything above 1 looks appallingly messy.

@GalaxyCookieCrumble

My sister and Bil are both firefighters, hoarding is a deadly affair, have you spoke to your local fire station on how to protect your family in case of a fire,

We had a firefighter talk to us in group therapy. My stairs, doorways and halls are clear. They have to be anyway or I would attract attention of the wrong sort from SS.

My son is disabled and has a disability SW so it's not like I could hide that even if I wanted too.

Firefighter told us they found someone in a hoard. They couldn't find the person who passed out from smoke inhalation.

I find the pictures hard to relate to as my floors and beds are clear. Horizontal surfaces are a challenge. Another hoarder told me that we need to avoid them and I tend to agree. I have a vast empty space in my living dining room. Its crying out for a dining table but I dont think would end well. The table is in my kitchen diner and I keep that clear thank God. I can fill my sofas up in a blink. I can clear them a hour too. But it's like they are magnets to clutter.

I'm determined to try even harder this year as i have no shops open to temp me

@HoarderAMA my sister has too, she works for London Fire Brigade and regularly does house calls on known hoarders, and unfortunately as pulled body's out of houses hidden under their hoard.

Thank you for this thread , it’s motivated me to deal with my hoarding. It’s got gradually worse, and I spend my life miserable because of the constant battle against the mess.
I’m living my life surrounded by things I can’t get rid of because of the memories. And I’m unhappy because of it.
Over the last few days I’ve boxed/bagged so much stuff for the tip/charity shop. And it’s going tomorrow morning.
It’s been really hard, and emotional. I’m saying good bye to random things. And just trying to accept the bad emotions when I bin things.
I’ve got rid of 75% of the Christmas decorations, 75% of books, 95% of dvds, 50% of my kitchen stuff. Am now working on the crafts hoard/linen cupboard/clothes. And bathroom stuff.
Reading your thoughts on it being a life’s work to keep on top of it has really put it into perspective for me.

Do you think you’ll always have hoarding tendencies? Or could it ever get to a point where you don’t hoard and don’t even think about it?

@SwanShaped in group therapy one person said they was cured. But he did say he could see a pile of mail growing and he had to clear it. So I'm in two minds really. Yes you can better but I think the avoidance of dealing with things as and when they need dealing with must remain somewhat. I guess it feels to me that you need almost need to change your lifestyle and mindset to be cured. If you had a real good clear out then applied the CBT process religiously maybe it could become a new habit?

I think for me, even if didnt have a hoard I would still call myself a hoarder because to me, denial is the slide to downfall. So it has to stay in my mind if that make sense? So I force myself better, it doesnt flow or come naturally and I'm still waiting for a epiphany where it all just clicks and I wake up from my disordered foggy thinking.

It's not like I'm in constant dilemma either. But more like "oh that's a nice bag.... NO! You know you cant go there!" Whereas normal people presumably think "that's a nice bag, shame I dont need one / it could replace my current one " etc. I'm more about impulse control for me.

Mind you without a hoard can you be a hoarder?

I think yes because it's a disorder and it's a disordered thought process that has impacted your life. Maybe you can be reformed hoarder.

@BlueistheNewme
How are you feeling about your clear out? I feel your pain honestly. Take lots of before and after photos. Dont start with anything hard to part with. You will burn out. It's about slow and steady, little bits but daily to start with

It hasn’t been too bad, it’s getting easier as the days go by. I’ve been trying to do this for so long, but haven’t got anywhere.

I read this thread, and then looked at some other stuff online about hoarding. And thought about when it had started to get much worse. So thinking about what is keeping me from change helped.

I did then spend hours procrastinating about it, and looking at stuff online/writing lists 😂. Which is usually where I stop and don’t get any further.

But reading about how you’ve made positive changes, and how it’s an ongoing process helped the penny drop. Nothing will change until I make the change.

I’ve been thanking (Out loud to an empty room) the people who have given me things. And acknowledging the uncomfortable feelings throwing them is giving me. I’m also reminding myself that when I’m so bogged down by stuff and a messy house, I can’t enjoy the life that I have.

@JovialNickname

Thank you for this very illuminating and personal thread.

I find it very hard to understand hoarding, but would really like to know more in order to understand better. I do know and appreciate it is a mental illness.

May I ask you: I have a friend who is a hoarder. He says he hates it and finds it disgusting. His father was a hoarder and my friend loathed living in those conditions when he was growing up. Yet he is now the same. Is there any insight you might be willing to share as to why this might be? I know you can't speak for anyone else but I would dearly love to know why this has happened.

Q2: I read somewhere that all of the items in their hoard have sentimental value to a hoarder. In the same way that a treasured photo is not just "a bit of paper" to a non-hoarder (even though it is technically just a bit of paper) all the items hold sentimental value in the case of hoarding. Would you say that was correct?

Thank you so much if you are able to give a response to either of my questions, and thank you so much also for starting the thread.

Sorry just re-reading some missed posts.

My dad was a war child and a bit of a hoarder. He talked a lot about having nothing and waste and it was a dialogue of my childhood. Maybe it becomes a inner voice? What would dad say if he knew I threw that out?

Yes most things in the hoard are sentimental but some arent. But the non sentimental stuff adds to the "noise" so I grab say all my childs tops from.when they was 3. I would see things they never wore - ok it can go, a top that's shrunk - that can go. Oh look I love that top, I remember when.... then before you know it it's all too much and I keep the lot as I cant face it. The trick is to handle everything quickly. If something tugs at me, quickly keep it and move on. It's almost like your looking for a reason or excuse to get stuck sometimes. That's why you start with the easiest things

@SnowyOwlWan

No CBT never deals with the reasons why it started. I have had talking therapy for that. But its extremely painful and you put so much trust out there not to be judged. I have had all lovely therapists. No one has minimised my experiences.

I have only dealt with my sons SEND, not my mum. Not sure when I will able to do that as my MIL said I must have deserved that. So that has put me off. Maybe it's the missing piece I need?

@BlueistheNewme

Thank you for sharing that. I am touched this has been helpful. I'm feeling positive about clearing out too. I have a aim to reduce my daughters clothes by 75% when she returns to school. So much easier right now when she isnt going to parties or anywhere really. She needs about 7 outfits right now so I'm going to capitalise on the one good aspect of the pandemic. I love the shops being shut during the sales.

Seeing her room neat should be a far better buzz of happy hormones I hope. My aim is only buying kids shoes and uniform this year.

How does your hoarding impact your children and your husband? Do they have play dates? Has anyone tripped on anything and had an accident?