I'm a hoarder, AMA ( except for my bank details 🤣)

[HoarderAMA]

Just that really. Inspired by another thread.

It's a MH condition as set out in the DSM5.

I often feel it is the most shameful MH condition and no amount of "Be kind" would ever change that.

I dont think it will ever be one of the accepted conditions and it is full of shame and secrecy. I cant see that ever changing

@HoarderAMA I am also a horder, although like you not of empty crisp packets, broken boxes etc. I do have more stuff than I have space for though. I'm slowly slowly emptying the house. Its emotionally exhausting.

for you (as long as you promise to bin them when they die )

@HoarderAMA is there any medication for this issue ? Sounds really hard. Is it linked to depression? Does it get worse when you're down ? Do you ever feel upset by all your stuff and the mess it creates ?

My mum is a hoarder in denial, she just laughs when you tell her so. It seemed to kick off after my brother and I left home. My room especially is full of junk, you can't even get in it now. She just says that she likes things. Well she doesn't even read yet she has books buried amongst all the other stuff: soft toys, CDs, trinkets, packets of sweets. I remembered a book I had in my cupboard back home some months ago and decided to dig it out but when I opened the door I realised that I couldn't even walk past the bed to get to the cupboard, let alone go digging around for the book.

I struggle sometimes with throwing things out and have to be really strict. She also tries to give me stuff and guilt trips if I want to throw away things someone gave me
"That's your grandma's scarf!" It's always prefixed as "person's" item.

I went travelling years ago when I was still living at home and she nearly threw a fit when she realised that I was taking a particular bottle of perfume with me. Begged me to keep the bottle for her. Several times she emailed and reminded me to keep the empty bottle for her.

The house is full of old newspapers, magazines and receipts. Their conservatory is full of junk. She has no shame when visitors come over. My dad has given up. She seems to think that certain items have value and that we can have it in years to come. No thanks. I wish she could get help.

@mummytobabygirl2020 no there isnt a medication that I'm aware of. Standard treatment is CBT. Yes it gets me down and I either let it suck me back in or I go the other way and sort it out. Depends on my mood. I think its linked to depression maybe in that it's a comfort to buy when I feel low. But most times packages once they turn up dont much interest me. The nice bit was buying it so it's a very short lived buzz.

I'm not depressed but some health professionals seem.to think I might be. I had Post natal depression so I dont feel like I'm in the black pit anymore. I do feel low lower constant stress.

Yes I hate the mess. If I could click my fingers I would make it go away.

Ironically the only person who can fix me, is me. I have all the tools to fix it. I want to. There is no excuse really.

The biggest challenge is getting to a manageable level where you can access everything and function, which every room is like that now. Stairs doors etc cleared. But my room. Total mess. The beds clear, a clothes are clean etc but its rammed full. Possibly a reasonable compromise if the communal spaces are ok ( if cluttered).

My dh shares the room. He has become blind to it too. I want his help to clear it, which he will but I guess he enables me to deteriorate. If he said clear out the bedroom or I will leave, i would, but he would never say that. I think i have started to rub off on him. Which is scary

@TheFormerPorpentinaScamander yes its mentally exhausting isnt it? It's like it can be perfect so your crippled by the enormity of making a start.

The only way to tackle it for me is have a constant in / out list and make sure say 50 out for each in.

A bit easier during the pandemic to see that my dd for example only needs say 5 outfits for each season. I let myself have a look around the shops but buy one thing. Or I sit up late at night and fill a online basket then dont buy any of it.

It's like death by a thousand paper cuts. You buy maybe five things a month for years but never get rid the moment they are no longer of use and years later your in right mess.

My next big challenge is a car seat and iCandy Pear I wanted to give to a charity who fix prams. I should dump them. But in my mind they was expensive, I am creating landfill etc. Once they are dumped I feel immense guilt, but its passed 24 hours later.

I really understand and what has made a change for me has been losing my mum and having to clear so much of her stuff . I don't want to put anyone through that although this has created a whole new problem for me because I wanted to keep lots of it!

The clothes thing too, my absolute desperation for a certain item of clothing, how much I wanted it, how happy I was when it was eventually mine, the money I spent on it! Accepting that it's now 3 sizes too small and the chances of me ever being thin enough to wear it again are zero and yet it's still hard to get rid of it!

It is a constant battle! You describe it very well! Thank you for being so open on this thread!

Op, I have not read the full thread because my rural internet is shit.
But have you explored CBT? I am currently marching along a CBT programme for my mild (I scored low on the tick list) hoarding and other compulsive behaviours. You have such strong insight, I wonder if it would be of benefit to you.
My hoarding is confined to our loft, and when we moved house my partner was aghast at the “just in case” stuff we had and do you know what? It’s all in the loft here too. But the baby steps are beginning. There is less stuff being kept in the house .to go in the loft. This week I’m getting rid of the packing boxes at the far end of the loft. Hopefully.

@cheesecrackersandcorona my dad was a child evacuated during the war. He was a hoarder too. He genuinely had nothing growing up and lost what little he had being shipped out London.

One of the kids has severe ASD and the other not severe. The lesser effected by SEN definitely works me that he keeps a lot of things in his bed, but at the same time he has no issues with getting rid of things, but yes I worry about him turning out like me. My eldest hates my hoarding and is definitely a minimalist as a result.

@LuciaLemon no you can walk around freely. Everything is clean but of course you can not keep things clean if you get behind or under piles of things. The kitchen is tiny so there is too much on the counters. If I'm honest with myself I could do better with the tiny space. I'm really mindful that the living room Floor has to stay clear. I have to make myself do that and it's a effort. It's not something that just happens like other peoples households. I have to make it clear.

I go to friends houses who are constantly moving, tidying, washing up etc. I'm not like that. I tend to do things in fits and starts during the day. So I build up three cups then wash up when I fit the fourth one down. I guess it all builds up as part of a bigger problem. Generally its swept up and out of the way in 24 hours ( cups, junk, dirt etc) but I'm not constantly keeping on top of things. So yes, maybe a element of lazy, lack of energy, motivation somewhere in the mix

well you seem to be aware of it so that is progress....!!...my mum hoarded...no childhood issues, no ww2 deprivation etc...it drove my dad mental....mum would eventually check the bins to see if anything thrown out etc....when she died, I needed 2 skips and 20 trips to the recycle centre for the magazines and old papers....2 lounges were full of the junk plus 2 spare bedrooms...no other hoarders in the family....i now hate junk and clutter and get rid of anything not used or needed !!

I forgot to mention...the absolute worst hoarder is a friends mum...she bought the house next door..knocked through and filled that up also with fridges, cookers, 50 skirts...all the same, 100 pair of shoes in same size and colour etc....she even falsified cheques to pay for it all when she ran out of money...!!...stole off family etc to continue buying stuff !!

I have binge eating disorder and think the mechanism sounds very similar.

In the same way you buy something, feel guilty, so buy something else to feel better....replace 'buy' with 'eat'.

...or drink

...or take drugs

Or any other addiction stemming from trauma really.

We are self medicating using the dopamine high.

@umpteennamechanges I agree.

I say that it would be better if I was a alcoholic. Less taboo, less shameful, better understood and people might even think I was fun company.

It's just the drug of choice isnt it?

I recognise a lot of myself in here. Sometimes I think it's about being brought up with not much money so everything needed to be kept. My h will say "just bin it" but I panic at how much it cost or the waste of having to buy again. Hoarding doesn't make me happy - it makes me feel chaotic and unsettled. I absolute love a minimalist hotel room but sometimes I look at friends or family bedrooms and think they look like hotels all the time. I can't imagine that being possible.

THank you for doing the ama op

I'm a hoarder, I'm a hell of a lot better than I used to be. At one point my house was on a 9 in all rooms that could be accessed, with help and support from a local charity I now have it down to a 1 all over except for one room which is currently a 3 but is waiting until the support worker is able to do physical visits again.

I can pinpoint the exact day it started and the reasons why, I have done a lot of work to get to this point and I am going forwards all the time, it has pulled me down, stopped me having people in when it would have been helpful. I try not to think of the amount of money I have wasted but onwards and upwards. This is a slow process and has been stop start but it is improving. It has been a healing process.

Also for anyone who may be considering contacting the GP if you go to Rainbow Red website they have an ice breaker from to help people to ask for help.

It does make a big difference if you are ready and willing to engage with the work as many years ago a clear out was enforced upon me as an intervention from my then landlord and my mental health team and the GP, a crew came in and physically cleared the place. I was given 1 cardboard box to save stuff in and one suitcase to save clothes as well. within a year it a as bad as ever!

This time round I was ready and willing to engage and it has now been 4 years on and off, mh team and gp on board with the reasons why and the manager from the charity when she took on my case, apparently went back to the office and by her own admission said we will probably be signing Frogs off within the month, she was delighted to be proved wrong.

I'm also a binge eater so as pp have noted the mechanisms are very similar. I intend to try and start to tackle it next.

DH hoards.
I want to get rid of so much stuff, as he just takes over.
Do you realise how much it affects everyone else in the household?

mum would eventually check the bins to see if anything thrown out etc....

DH has done that before now.
Drives me craxckers

@HoarderAMA thank you for the advice, I will try that. It's so so draining. Does it get less emotional with practice.

I hoard stuff. I also have ADHD and I'm convinced the two are linked, so those who've asked if there's a medication...well, maybe. I've been prescribed meds for ADHD but only recently and still in the process if getting the dosage right so I can't tell you if it's effective yet.

But, it's suspected that ADHD is all about chasing that dopamine high as our brains don't make enough of it.

Hoarder AMA have you ever considered you might have ADHD? It can be heritidary, along with ASD.

My mother and my DS are on the spectrum; I'm not but have ADHD. I wasn't diagnosed till my mid 40s, but it was a real lightbulb moment.

I wonder, also, if there's a psychological element to my hoarding. I found my mother's ASD tough as a child as she's not very good at showing emotion, doesn't do small talk, was critical of me without realising it hurt my feelings and didn't cuddle me. I genuinely thought she didn't love me.

(As an adult our relationship is miles better as I now recognise her as a loving and generous person who was doing her best but with ASD so she doesn't express her love in ways I understood as a child.)

I craved my mother's love and attention as a child. The things in the house were treated with a lot of respect / reverence. Both my parents would often tell me their "correct" way to look after or treat things. They had valuable stuff (my mum likes antiques) and I noticed when I stayed for a while with my DS when he was a toddler, that my DM resisted attempts by me to toddler proof the place eg I wanted to move her gardening basket off the floor, which had secateurs within reach of my toddler; her solution was I keep my toddler away from it. And all the other dangerous/ breakable things.

I remember we weren't allowed to kick a ball around in the garden as it might hurt the plants. (I notice the people who bought the house from my parents have got rid of all the fussy boarders in half the garden and put a lawn in that their DC play on.)

My mum's ASD means she likes things to stay the way they are, and we all need to work round it.

I wonder if this is where I got the idea / feeling that things are important and hard to let go about the ADHD is a bigger when it comes to trying to sort things. Hoarding has totally dominated my life. I don't have visitors as I'm so ashamed, but I'm a social person and it's making me really unhappy. We moved to a new town and I've got very few friends here as I've kept people at arm's length so they don't expect to come to the house. I realised how bad that aspect is this year when lockdown happened and everyone complained how awful it was. For me, it barely changed anything.

I feel so guilty about the impact it's had on my DC.

*borders!

And, I meant to say "the ADHD is a bugger when it comes to trying to sort things"

I really should proof read before hitting post!!

I paid a professional declutterer to come help me, after reading about them on here.

She's lovely and it did help. It wasn't cheap though and I can't afford it.

I've realised what I was actually paying her for was to keep me company and on taste while I tidied. That's what I cold really do with, someone to do it with me. It's not about help with the actual.tidying, it's help with getting started, staying focused and finishing the task. (All things ADHD makes hard).

I've asked DP to try to take this role, but he just can't. He doesn't really do small talk (a bit like my mum in that respect!).

All my good friends live miles away and are busy with their own lives.

I can do things to a deadline. eg I had to get the kitchen and conservatory sorted so someone could come fit a new oven as the old one broke. (The old one broke this summer, we got the new one fitted a week before Christmas!)

I misjudged how long it would take and found it hard starting, consequentky I only managed that by literally staying up all night, the night before, to get it done. The school run on zero sleep was horrendous! (Walking not driving!)

That's pretty typical. I couldn't walk properly for 2 days after that as I have damage to my pelvis since childbirth that means if I'm on my feet for a long time, it hurts when I walk, so for my body I should do little and often, but my brain just doesn't work like that.

I remember another time, my MIL was due to come to stay. DH had gone to visit her with the DCs so I had a few days to get the place sorted. I left it till the last day, but tripped on a paving stone while out and strained my wrist. I got the chemist to strap it up, ignored her advice to go to the GP and tidied the house one handed, slowlt, again by staying up.all night. It was ridiculous!

I really wanted the house all tidy for Christmas. DP and I have managed the dining room and kitchen, most of the front room (just a bit of clutter on the surfaces but the floors are clear) so I'm pleased with that bit and we've had a lovely Christmas.

But, the hallways, conservatory and my bedroom are still an enormous mess.

I'm really trying to get on top of it, to the point it's totally dominating my life. I don't know if I'll ever win. I feel I can't see the wood for the trees right now.

Should say, "I've realised what I was actually paying her for was to keep me company and on task while I tidied".

Having been through this with Father. I am not sure there is a cure. Sometimes for your own health and well being you need to leave them to it if they live on their own. The denial, defensively saying it’s not that bad until it gets so bad or something happens, a fall or a fire, an infection because honestly some people saying the place is clean is not true. You cannot get to very much therefore it encourages mice (or worse!).

My Father had social workers, the fire service, his GP, various friends who literally pushed their way in because they were concerned. Nothing worked. Even the neighbours asking him round for coffee and almost begging him to do something about the state of his house (nice area in London) and offering to help with moving stuff out.

He was so self absorbed and dare I say it selfish (according to his girlfriends over the years) he did very little and by the time I was allowed in it was literally overwhelming.

Interesting thread, thank you.

Apologies if this is a stupid suggestion, but as regards getting the high from buying things and then regretting it when you get home....could you pick things up and then rather than buying them just leave the basket and walk out, or put everything back and leave? You could get two highs from that - the high from choosing the things and the high from not actually then having the stuff you don't need and the guilt?