I’m a fairly secular Muslim: Ask me anything

[Byemelania]

I probably won’t know the answer but I’ll try

Well no I was trying to explain why singling out one religion as bad or whatever, when lots of others are just as bad,..

That wasn't my point. I wasn't arguing whether or not all religions are as bad as each other. Some might not agree that they're "all as bad as each other". Just like some might not agree that all political ideologies are as bad as each other

I'm saying people should be allowed to express their opinion on these things, whether we agree with that opinion or not. My point is about freedom of speech and censorship.

Do you agree with blasphemy laws?

But what if someone wants to single one out What if they disagree that religions are "all as bad as each other"? What then? Do the thought crimes dissidents get carted off to the gulag?
Given that many religions are quite broad with a range of groups if I heard someone decide that they had an issue with one religion as a whole and then decided that was a bad'un, it would be a big flag showing their intolerance and lack of knowledge to be honest.

If the response to this challenge was to jump to gulag etc then it would just make them look rather silly.

Hi all I’m quitting MN. This is too toxic. Bye and thanks to the nice ones.

• an actual hypothetical someone by the way

Freedom of speech does not mean freedom to avoid challenge.

If I heard someone decide thay 'Religion A is bad' and speak in very black and white terms then that would show their lack of knowledge to me, possibly an intolerant streak too

OP, you don't need to go. I get that some people have said/asked something you find offensive but really what were you expecting from an Ask me Anything (and about being a Muslim for that matter)?

Surely you must have known some questions would come up as per usual and those were part of the "anything" you were ready to answer or atleast accept as questions even if you didn't answer.

You could have written what was off limits in your OP in that case.

Anyway I agree some people have been relentless in their "I don't like Islam but don't mind Muslims" stance and questions. We get it. Can we let others get their questions in?

Ach no @Byemelania don’t go on basis of one rough thread
Dust yourself down,don’t get het up about online spat.
Hang about on better threads

@byemelania I'm so sorry you're leaving and I agree that MN can be horribly toxic. I think this thread has unfortunately shown a lot of us the kind of awful comments you have to put up with in life. We are not all like that, please believe me. Take care of yourself ♥️♥️

@Byemelania that is a decent line-up
My top 4 would have to be:
1.Digestive (King if biscuits...so simple, so versatile and so more-ish!)
2.Shortbread (pref clotted cream or any of the naice salted buttery type ones)

1. Fruit shorties (best for dipping in a cup of tea IMO)
2. And finally the humble bourbon (or naked penguin bar as i like to call it)

Oh no just seen latest post...don't go! We're not all toxic tightbums. Most peeps here are lovely x

@Byemelania

Hi all I’m quitting MN. This is too toxic. Bye and thanks to the nice ones.

I’m sorry you’re leaving, but I’m sadly not surprised as the islamaphobes on MN are fairly vocal.

@Statusless Saying things like "What did you expect?" and "You should have done this to avoid trouble" is just victim blaming. The OP is not responsible for the racism displayed here and she shouldn't have to modify her behaviour to appease racists.

@Byemelania I'm sorry you've been bullied off this site. Unfortunately Mumsnets moderators don't seem to notice casual racism (along with quite a few other things) to the extent that I have to assume they don't care or subscribe to the same brand of white feminism as most of the prolific posters on FWR.

@FeminismIsForALLWomen No OP shouldn't modify behaviour. That wasn't my intention. What I meant was OP seemed to have started a thread on AMA without thinking the AMA part through. I simply meant they should expect questions...not trouble. The trouble part is the trouble makers' responsibility, not OP's.

But I apologise for sounding like i was victim blaming OP. That's not my intention. I clearly agree some people had over done it.

What's this thought police and gulag stuff? This is a conversation. You are able to disagree without consequence

But some posters aren't. They are being labelled Islamaphobic and racist. But no reason is being given for why they are and the accusation alone, without any proof, is enough to shut conversation down

Earlier in the thread a pp asked about Charlie Hebdo and freedom of expression. The conversation became about censorship.

In Scotland a law is being brought in that you can be questioned by the police for things you might say in your own home.

There are worries in general about it being a crime to cause offence. This worry is also about blasphemy and being able to criticise religion

(If I heard someone decide thay 'Religion A is bad' and speak in very black and white terms then that would show their lack of knowledge to me, possibly an intolerant streak too*

Possibly yes but is that enough to label someone islamaphobic or racist.

It is not a crime to lack knowledge or be intolerant of an ideology or belief system. Well not yet

Byemelania
I am sorry that you are leaving, it was good to hear from what I would call a modern, liberal Muslim, someone similar to my wife and her relations and friends.

SiSeniora
I think you have some very mixed up ideas about race, religion and ethnicity, and have behaved in an insulting manner to someone who I believe came on here in good faith.

Flaxmeadow
Depending on what was said then I think it could be enough.

I think there's a difference between 'I disagree with Islam' (statement of personal belief) and 'Islam is bad' (intolerant and ignorant statement which ignores the breadth of beliefs in the faith) and 'Muslims think insert extreme position here' (goady and likely to fuel hate).

I think people should deploy some common sense before making inflammatory or ignorant statements about very diverse faiths. As long as they aren't inciting hatred then I will defend their freedom to express those views, but with that they cannot complain if other people use their freedom to challenge intolerance.

Anecdotally, people who are likely to be very black and white about faith groups are probably racist or intolerant because otherwise they'd have a bit more about them to have rational debate.

'I'm saying people should be allowed to express their opinion on these things, whether we agree with that opinion or not. My point is about freedom of speech and censorship.'

But you are posting freely, so I'm not sure who you think is censoring you.

Nor why you are talking about gulags and blasphemy laws.

Those posts were directed at me do you seem to think I want you imprisoned forced to work etc in a gulag or ? executed for blaspheming...? Seems a bit strong?

Your over reaction really undermines whatever point you are trying to make.

I mean unless you are using the word gulag lightly, as it were

Which I suppose is on accord with the cups of tea and cakes comment in response to a post about the harms caused by the RC church.

As long as they aren't inciting hatred then I will defend their freedom to express those views,

Yes, that was my whole point

Flaxmeadow
The thing is that I think sweeping, inaccurate statements about a whole faith in a black and white fashion are likely to be whipping up hatred.

Not sure why the Op posted if she didn't want to hear any views that didn't match her own. I also think it is not islamphobic to have a different perspective to the Op, nor to ask questions. If you're easily offended by others views, don't ask for them.

Oh well done guys. I'm embarrassed to be part of a forum with such ignorant views. OP, thanks for your thread.

@SiSeniora do you ever wonder if perhaps life would be better if you opened your heart and mind a little? Do you think you are a very likeable person? Do your friends really enjoy you company? Do you spread joy? Perhaps if you would like to go through life a bit happier and being kinder you might have a better time as may those who come across you.

@Byemelania I don't blame you for going. I've quit FB because of the horrible negative racist posts I came across and MN is not much better. Sadly social media brings out the twats. I have come to realise that there are many twats in this world. It is very tiresome fighting all the time and sometimes we just have to surround ourselves in a nice bubble of Non-twats and when feeling stronger poke our head out and fight against them.