Retired lap dancer- ask me anything

[yourprivatedancerEX]

It’s not something I tell new people I meet that for 10 years I used to be a very successful lap dancer. I have a very different career now but often reminisce about my secret lap dancing past, always with fond memories!
I think it’s still something that is frowned upon by many and in my view I think that’s largely down to being misunderstood. So if any of you have any questions I will answer them and hopefully give you some interesting insight into the secret world of lap dancing! Ask away.

Going to stick my neck out here and admit that I used to dance and it wasn’t all positive. I had poor self esteem due to adverse experiences in childhood and never really felt ‘one of the girls’.I drank too much and occasionally used cocaine. Neither did I make a lot of money (I danced in The Uk and Australia). I was also cursed with having too much empathy with the customers to be a successful dancer. My current profession suits me far better

*put her at a disadvantage

Fascinating thread OP.

Yes some women are trafficked.
Yes some women are coerced.

But that is not the fault of the OP or any other dancer. If they suspected and didn't report or intervene then sure, call her out on perpetuating abuse.

Let's be real here. If some men weren't so lazy to make effort and so sleazy and sexist - the industry would be very quiet.

But they aren't. Is that OPs fault? My fault? Your mamas fault? No - it's the men who behave in such a way.

If a man treats his girlfriend, wife or a stranger badly it's because he is a scumbag. It's like rape apologists - if she had not had a skimpy outfit on, he wouldn't have raped her, he couldn't help himself.

Is it demeaning? Fairly often. But if you can look past that, know your safe and laugh at the twat who parted ways with his cash then why not? That's up to you.

Would I want my daughter doing it? No! But would I be disgusted in her if she did? No.

Because you can't preach feminism and then say "But only my Branch of feminism."

Either a woman has body autonomy or she doesn't.

Instead of hating on these women perhaps the good men of the world could put pressure on the sleazy ones to be less so?

Maybe a better option would be to have complete transparency in these industries like most seem to and to have great resources for those who feel pressured, coerced and trafficked. Including anonymity, translators and access to housing.

Because of course I care about trafficked or coerced women. That's why I think by being open these women won't feel like they will be judged and are more likely to come forward with their abuse.

Stigma will not help these trafficked women. But some amazing support would definitely help.

Sorry post ended up so long.

Well said notanothernoughties

Precisely. As with prostitution, full legalisation and regulation would make it safer for everybody involved. Only puritanical, misanthropic sex-haters argue otherwise.

Only puritanical, misanthropic sex-haters argue otherwise.

Seriously! Way to go there to shut down any argument. If you don't agree with full legalisation of prostitution then you are puritanical, misanthropic and sex-hating. Do you stereotype everyone like this on absolutely no information?

It’s ridiculous to say that all lap dancers are responsible for trafficking and don’t care
That’s like saying all Tory voters don’t care about people with disabilities and are happy with all the shit this government is putting them though. Yet I know I lot of Tory voters disgusted by it but vote Tory as it is best for them and their family. (Just an example don’t want to detail the thread)
A lot of women lap dance as it is the best fit for them at the time, a lot of women do it to support a family as it’s better money then at the supermarket.

No one had he right to judge

Sorry, Pallisers, I suppose I was being semi-facetious after seeing posters like Crunchy make up ‘facts’ and put words into others’ mouths to prove a dogmatic and completely unevidenced point. There is an argument against legalising the sex trade, but I don’t think it stands up to evidence-based scrutiny. Too often, it’s tainted by a puritanical man- and woman-hating prejudice (‘I wouldn’t choose it for me, so no other woman could logically choose it for herself, therefore, she shouldn’t be allowed to’ etc).

Infantilising women in that way is not good for anyone and certainly doesn’t progress the cause of equality or liberation. Supposedly radical feminists increasingly sound like old-school moral conservatives which, I suppose, is largely what they are; imposing their world view on others’ lifestyles. Sorry, but I find it repellant.

This has been so fun to read! Thank you so much! I’ve been meaning to start my own one of these threads but never got round to it so it was cool to see someone do it.

Also I’m working in the states so it’s neat to see some differences and such as I never worked in the uk (was too young or in the middle of nowhere for most of the time).

I may actually start my own thread as long as I’m not treading on any toes. I didn’t realize there was this much interest and the questions seem to have been (mostly, besides some dickheads) very courteous.

Infantilising women in that way is not good for anyone and certainly doesn’t progress the cause of equality or liberation. Supposedly radical feminists increasingly sound like old-school moral conservatives which, I suppose, is largely what they are; imposing their world view on others’ lifestyles. Sorry, but I find it repellant.

Your last post was imposing your world views on others.

I find prostitution repellant. Funnily enough I find it mysoginistic - for obvious reasons - and sex-hating (because it is forcing women to commodify something that should be for mutual pleasure). I don't blame the women involved at all for any aspect of it. But that doesn't mean I think it should be lauded or legalised. Ditto lap dancing. Away with you if that is how you make your living/support your children - woman have always done the least valued jobs in society to keep themselves and their families going. I still think the industry is wrong and the men who avail of it are awful. I am not infantalising women when I believe this.

By the way - maybe the previous posters can answer this? Who owns these clubs? Is it a largely women-owned or men-owned industry?

Other than the cash how is there any job satisfaction. Is it literally only the money or do you get any job satisfaction from the fact the losers 'clients get turned in.

I could maybe understand it for a short term way of getting cash but managing to turn guys on seems a low bar in meaningful achievements.

My job meant so much more to me than just the money. Don't get me wrong The money was very important but I loved the fact I did something valuable and something that was challenging. I liked the fact I was always learning and progressing. No two days were alike and I got to meet all sorts of people.

I really do get the earning easy money side of it but getting your clothes of to turn guys on for year after year after year must be boring as hell. Even the venues seem like they would be depressing to work in. They always seem so dingy and dark.

I find male strippers awful. It isn’t a laugh or a giggle, it’s desperately uncomfortable and as someone else said, they seem to get off on how awkward they can make a woman feel - a real power thing. I can see a similar thing at work with female dancers in a way. It must be empowering to charge to give someone a boner and then walk away, particularly if you have a few burly bouncers to protect you in case the men object to you being in control.
Weird isn’t it. Male strippers try to force women to touch them. Female strippers have men to prevent anyone touching them. Huh.
Sex clubs are seedy. I spent waaaaay too long in the military all over the world, hanging out with unaccompanied men, to see the women’s point of view. I’ve sadly seen too much of the punter’s side and heard them deconstruct their experiences. I wouldn’t want to be the woman servicing that.

That sounds a bit weird. I think I mean - whatever illusion of control/ empowerment you have constructed in order to enjoy your job, stands in opposition to the client’s stories. Both can be true to the speaker as they are both engaged in the transaction. So the woman can think ‘poor little saddo wasting his money’ while the man is thinking ‘bargain - £30 and that hot slut is gagging for me.’ And then pops next door to select which lucky lady gets his next splash of more than cash.
To not accept that lap dancers affect women’s social and cultural roles is naive though.

Weird isn’t it. Male strippers try to force women to touch them

Do they? Male stripper night I went to definitely had no forcing women to touch them. Just stripping

Oh really? Maybe too general to claim ‘all’. The power relations are very different though - do the guys bring bouncers to prevent any women touching them? Fully clad bouncers looking after the nekkid men?
Is it the same dynamic in your experience? I always thought the dream boys experience was basically a group show, rather than giving private lap dances to women in booths. And then they grab some poor woman out of the audience to make an exhibition of in front of everyone? Whereas the men pay the female dancers for a one on one experience? (Not unequivocally obv - the floor show carries on but it isn’t based on humiliating individual clients?)

Hmm. Thinking about it - they do carefully select a quieter more reluctant woman, rather than a handsy one
I guess that’s part of the act.

I used to know a girl who danced. She always looked immaculate and had to invest a lot of time and money in grooming, waxing/hair/make up etc as well as having to maintain her figure.
Did that side of things ever become a bit of a pain in the arse? I like to think that I look after myself but there are times when I can't be arsed and would rather pig out on the sofa all weekend with hairy legs and chipped nail varnish. I'm sure this wasn't an option for you as your 'tools of the trade' were your looks but I was just wondering if it ever got on your nerves a bit

Also have you been able to relax a bit now in that department or do you still maintain your figure/beauty regime to the same standard.
Thanks for starting this thread by the way. Have always been curious about it

@blackdoggotmytongueagain I hope you challenged them making such comments and seeing women in such a way?

It is people who see such behaviour and say or do nothings responsibility - because if it wasn't for such behaviour it would be a dead job.

But nobody wants to challenge Danny Boy to rock the boat or it's not your job to criticise BIL. But you can always pick on someone who is already marginalised - that seems sensible not.

Nobody blames a person for disagreeing with stripping or prostitution or glamour modelling etc - that's fair enough. But that's why you shouldn't do it. But to judge someone else who does and to blame them for abuse of other women is just ridiculous.

Morning Lizzie

I’ll try and answer your question as best I can.

Yes I did maintain my appearance, as you say it’s part of the job just as it is for a model for example.

However I never saw it as a chore, perhaps because I was younger and let’s face it, in your early 20s it’s not hard to look good with a small amount of effort. I would have my nails done and go for a weekly tan, and yes I exercised and looked after myself physically because I needed to not only be in shape but be physically fit for the job.

Have I relaxed it now? Yes I have but I think it’s due to a mixture of not having all eyes on me anymore but also party age. I know I can only speak for myself but I think it’s natural as you get a little bit older you do tend to relax things a bit. That’s not to say I don’t look after myself. I do. I still exercise and I still wax and have my eyebrows done etc. But I don’t bother with the acrylics or the tan anymore, and it’s no big deal if I have chipped my nail polish for example.

When I compare those years I spent dancing with some of my old school friends who whilst I was dancing every night, they were going out and getting drunk, going home with boys, experimenting with drugs etc. I am grateful for my time dancing. It kept me focused on staying healthy and fit, it kept me away from bad influences and unhealthy habits. It made me learn that it’s unacceptable for men to speak to women a certain way. Seeing the bouncers regularly throwing women out for asking for extras or making derogatory comments really taught me that it is not ok.

I remember going on a rare night out with a couple of non dancing friends. It was for someone’s birthday I think. And I still remember to this day walking down the stairs in a club and a guy walking up the stairs past me, grabbed my arm and pulled me towards him really forcefully and said to me (sorry if this is offensive everyone but it really did happen) he said “you better watch my fingers don’t slip into your p**sy wearing that skirt”

I was HORRIFIED. My friends just rolled their eyes as though it was a regular thing. I went to the doorman and told him expecting him to go find the bloke and throw him out and all he said was ‘just stay away from him then’

This incident sticks so clearly in my mind because in the dancing club NOWAY would that have been acceptable. He would have been banned from the club in an instant.

I didn’t go out much after that, I much preferred the environment of the clubs and I think it really helped shape how I view myself (in a positive way)

I know I’ve gone off track there and not just stuck to the question about keeping up my appearance but it all seemed to be relevant to my answer so sorry for the long post!

• throwing men out that was meant to say. Just a typo.

I wasn't interested in the customer getting turned on, my goal was to get them to spend money on me, preferably a sit down (which I think has been explained earlier in the thread, my clubs price was £320 an hour, of which I received £250) to sit and spend time with them. If they spent money, that was my job satisfaction. Is it vocational? Absolutely not. It is rewarding? In terms of money, yes, in terms of personal satisfaction, depends what you want out of it. Many of the women dancing had other full time jobs and used dancing to supplement an income. I have met dancers who were care assistants, dentists, teachers, office workers, legally trained (although not practicing) hairdressers, retail workers, small business owners.

It's not "easy money" I think that's a misconception, you work, mentally and physically hard for every dance. It's perhaps easier once you know what you're doing, but it's not easy. Was it nice to make a years rent in the space of one weekend? Yes. Would I ever bank or rely on that happening, never. No two hours are the same, it's always different. It's the same as any other job in that there are high's and lows, that it can get monotonous and boring sometimes. The club's are kept dark and dingy because then the customer sees less.

Strip strip hooray great answer, I couldn’t have explained it better myself.

In terms of the classic whataboutery of these threads, I feel the need to point out that no one is talking about the exploitation of women in Primark-supplying sweatshops or nail bars because women from Primark-supplying sweatshops and nail bars don’t tend to bob up on Mumsnet disingenuously chirping ‘Ask me anything!’ and claim that it’s an empowering, benign and financially rewarding experience.

I think also in relation to job satisfaction, ok it cannot in anyway compare to a profession such as teaching or the medical profession etc where you are adding value to society. And of course we are not claiming for it to do that. But is there job satisfaction? For me there was yes. I found it in the following:

• excellent earnings. Making more in one night than I ever do now in a month.

• being independent. I relied on myself. If I needed more money I worked more. Had bills to pay or something expensive to buy? I just worked an extra night or two or stayed later instead of going home once I’d hit my target.

• genuinely getting in with everyone I worked with. It was like working with all your best friends or even better, sisters.

• the confidence gained from being physically fit and knowing you are in your best shape.

• the satisfaction when you’ve performed some pretty impressive moves on the pole and you just know you mastered it, got the timings perfect, the moves perfect etc. It feels good. It’s not something everyone can do and I was proud of that.

• knowing I was always in control. I never had to put up with anything I wasn’t happy with. It was a great feeling. I know there have been some disagreements upthread about whether is empowering or degrading. I think that is subjective and down to the woman involved. For me yes I did feel empowered. I had full control over what I did, who I danced for, how much I worked, and I was earning a lot so I felt very secure and independent.

So for me, I did get job satisfaction yes. Does everyone? Well no maybe not. As a few of the other girls have said up thread everyone is in it for different reasons but that applies to all jobs and all walks of life