I just don’t want to do secret Santa!

I think she is trying to say that whilst OP might think her gifts thoughtful and pretty and magical

it’s quite clear SIL is giving clear “stop giving me tat”
messages without actually saying those very words because OP would be upset if she was told that to her face

and SIL is perhaps slightly more perceptive than op

has OP ever said “no secret Santa but happy if you want us to stop exchanging gifts “

I think you might be being a bit unreasonable here OP. Yes it brings you joy to buy gifts and find a wrapping theme, and that’s wonderful for you. But not everybody does enjoy those things - Christmas when you’re an adult comes round again very quickly, and regardless of money, it could be that having to think of a number of surprise thoughtful gifts for adults who probably don’t want or need anything, plus sourcing them and wrapping them every year is just extra mental load and pressure which actually takes some joy away from them? Life can be stressful already, and I don’t think it’s reasonable to say “well they can just not get anyone gifts”, no-one would feel comfortable receiving gifts and not giving them.
Perhaps you could just ask people to put some ideas in the group of what they might want if you’re all really against Secret Santa? Just take some pressure off.

Apparently 1/3 of the people involved have felt it needed to change, though. And since it went the way of the other 2/3 of the people involved for the past two years, again, it seems that makes it SIL and her husband's turn this time, correct? Why are you not getting the point I've tried to make to you three times now?

I’m the SIL here. I buy for children but I don’t have the time or energy to buy for adults. I dislike “token gifts” and think gifts should be thoughtful. I spent a few years pushing secret Santa too but have given up and it’s now accepted that everyone does their own thing. An entire family doesn’t have to follow the same rules.

But secret Santa is generally tat too? And OP says no-one else wants to do it either? If SIL is the only one driving it, why is OP the one being unreasonable?

if no one else in the family wants to do it, then why is it a problem? You all say no thanks, problem solved.

Meh, I couldn't care less. If people want to exchange gifts or not or do secret santa or anything else, I'd just do it. So maybe I don't belong in this conversation in the first place lol.

I think there are some situations where an optional and well organised secret santa can work (large groups, groups of acquaintances, workplaces, big extended families) but among such a small group including parents, adult children and one child it’s not that practical. Obviously I don’t know PIL’s ages etc. but in general many people have less social contact as they get older and therefore the family socialising and gifts become more important to them. My parents are older and one is quite ill, I wouldn’t be pleased if my sister’s husband suggested I couldn’t get them a Christmas gift because he wanted us all to do secret Santa!

If I were your husband I’d put it to them that he completely understands if they want to reduce consumption/ costs/ effort etc. and he would be happy to not exchange gifts with them/ choose from a list/ get them a charity goat etc. but that he’s not happy for their choice to stop him exchanging gifts with the rest of his family. I’d also try and find out from BIL if there’s any further reason behind SIL’s repeated asking (e.g. they don’t want/ can’t have children so can see the gift giving becoming more unequal over time or your household buys gifts from Temu/ Shien which they have ethical problems with).

i think some people see secret Santa as a half way house - meet in the middle solution -

think OP is doing the right thing

be interested in how SIL responds !

no I agree. I do love christmas but this is not a hill I'd die on.

Then youre sorted - don’t do gifts. If you can’t find a compromise which involves gifts, don’t do them and move on.

Is it all adults? I’d just stop buying for adults except elderly relatives/your partner and just buy for the kids. I find generally adults buying Christmas presents for each other a bit strange. I can buy my own stuff I don’t need someone else’s “specially chosen” item

I have a relative who loves giving gifts, putting thought into what to buy and making them truly special.
The issue is, they're nothing we would choose ourselves and generally get shoved in the back of a cupboard.
You may love gift-giving, but others may not appreciate your passion!
You also say that your SIL is under no obligation to buy a gift for you, but you understand that she will feel obliged no matter what?

It may be "joyless" to you, but I really enjoy receiving some thing I really do need and have asked for, rather than something that I have to feign love for and then find a home for.

It could be causing them problems. My husband has some family we don't see very often, we don't know what they like and we have very different tastes. My sister-in-law (my husband's brother's wife) insists on doing a present swap at Christmas where everyone gives each other presents because she enjoys it. It was costing us a lot of money and we were having to send virtually everything we got to charity / food bank (neurodiversity, allergies, being vegetarian, etcetera). We end up spending about £10 each on me and my husband's main present to each other in order to finance this - it's a family of five siblings with children and grandchildren so quite a few presents. I asked if we could stop - everyone who wanted to could carry on and we could come afterwards. She refused and said that she would still be getting the presents and wanted them to be opened as usual. We are struck resenting the situation as we feel that we don't want to sit opening presents but not giving any back so have continued to buy things. I don't go now as I find her very overbearing and she has cornered me quite a few times to demand to know personal information I have purposefully not shared. I get sent the present but my husband and children still go because my husband doesn't want to upset things as he wants to be able to see his brother (understandably). I find it extremely annoying that me and my husband barely get a Christmas present to fund something my sister-in-law wants to do.

Poor SIL. She’s being blamed because she has been left to sort all her DHs family gifts, be the messenger, and now you’re moaning my about her. Maybe she hasn’t got the time to sort 5 gifts for his side of the family or be embarrassed about what a shit job he does. Maybe she doesn’t want 5 shit gifts in return. Maybe she can’t really afford 5 gifts. I personally wouldn’t find any joy in Christmas gifts if I thought someone else was stressed or skint trying to take part.

also you’re contradicting yourself.
you enjoy picking out gifts for people. You said that’s the reason. When pp have suggested a budget suddenly actually you don’t enjoy picking out gifts for people because what’s the point, you may as well buy a gift for yourself.

That’s very true! It sounds like nobody is saying they have to buy or accept gifts, just that they can’t dictate what other family members do. The problem is the social obligation they feel to take part if everyone else is buying for each other. It sounds like they want secret Santa because they feel that makes reducing their gift buying socially acceptable so hopefully your husband can find another option with them that works for everyone.

Don't worry OP, you are not coming across as entitled, controlling, selfish, precious, uncaring, insensitive or lacking in any empathy for your supposed loved ones.
Bet they are absolutely looking forward to spending Christmas with you as you obviously don't want them to feel uncomfortable at all.

If they set a budget of 50 per present and give a list of options then it's absolutely not tat. You get something you actually want and the giver can sort it in a short time without having to give hours of brain space to what someone might want

Why the hell wouldn't you want to buy someone a gift they actually want from a list of wanted items they've given you. Thats mad

I understand. I actually like secret santa but only when it's an actual secret and a suprise. We do it in our family too, but everyone chooses what they want. So boring

This. Your posts smack of " Me. I like. I want"

If they are struggling for money then they already feel awkward about it. This will be magnifed massively when they open their ' carefully wrapped and chosen gifts' from you while they have bought less / nothing.

It would be much more gracious to buy your carefully chosen presents for you, your family and other extended family and to do secret Santa with sil and her family.