AIBU to think of course all the anti-trans posts on this website and others are leading to real life harm?

im almost certain most trans people will always make sure theyre seen and heard, I really dont think you need to worry about that.

Tommy Robinson is not women's fault and certainly not Mumsnet's fault.

HTH.

😄

You think Tommy Robinson waanabees spend a lot of time on Mumsnet?
Arent they busy on Compulsory Sinking of Small Boat forums and cancelling their subscritions to the RNLI?

Male violence and misogny is not the fault of women.
They are just easy to blame.

Trans people can exist and shouldn't be discriminated against.

But men (including transwomen) should stay out of womens/female single sex spaces.
If the TRAs hadn't overreached so much there wouldn't have been the pushback.

@helpfulucy
Sorry that last comment just doesnt make sense. The man who did the filming is the one you have the issue with. Why he did it and what he said and his views are not the responsibility of sex realists or anyone but himself.
A lot of sex realists on twitter have attacked this man doing the filming. Most sex realists I follow are my age 60, or even older and have a very live and let live attitude to men wearing dresses and what not, we were teenagers in the 80s. Even in my school in rural Cambridgeshire I had several male classmates who wore makeup and one who wore women's clothes on occasion.
I have not seen any support for the film man at all amongst the small circle of people you seem to be blaming. I found it nasty myself.

I can believe it's wrong for trans women to be harassed or victimised in public, whole also believing that single sex spaces need to be enforced in order to uphold women's safety, dignity, and privacy. I don't see any contradiction between those beliefs.

A lot of sex realists on twitter have attacked this man doing the filming. Most sex realists I follow are my age 60, or even older and have a very live and let live attitude to men wearing dresses and what not, we were teenagers in the 80s. Even in my school in rural Cambridgeshire I had several male classmates who wore makeup and one who wore women's clothes on occasion.
I have not seen any support for the film man at all amongst the small circle of people you seem to be blaming. I found it nasty myself.

I’m quite a bit younger than 60 and remember when transvestites were around in the 1990s. They drew less ire then mainly because they weren’t DEMANDING that we called them anything other than men and weren’t DEMANDING we let them into women’s single sex spaces. That’s the difference. That’s when transvestites became dangerous to women.

Happy for them to exist. But not in womens spaces or womens sport.

The good news is that crimes against trans people have fallen dramatically since 2023, when the police finally started to realise that misgendering is not, in fact, a crime.

Transwomen are actually more likely to commit murder than to be murdered in the UK, so clearly Mumsnet isn't causing men to be violent to transwomen.

In my ideal world are they seen and heard? They're seen and heard now (in all senses of the phrase, usually seen first then heard). But being seen and heard doesnt always result in what you want, as women have experienced over the years.

I would like a world where no one has any MH struggles and are happy and content with who they really are, of course. Wouldnt you like that?

The vast majority of users in MN do not give a jot how someone presents themselves.

im sure I speak for many when I say what I do have a massive fucking problem with is biological men demanding access to female safe spaces and our sports events all the while saying naff all to call out the actual harm dished out to biological women who try and challenge this.

Nobody here believes that trans people should be abused.

You can disagree with something eg the existence of God without wishing believers harm. People on here debate with words like adults. If you want to discuss actual transphobia, go to the male dominated forums and comments on places like Facebook and 4Chan where they say actual transphobic stuff. You won’t get debate on those platforms, just insults which isn’t ok.

It’s an existential argument over language and identity. And to fight to uphold women’s rights and dignities is ‘helping’.

Nobody can change sex so I am totally focussed on male behaviour imposing on women. Men claiming to be women - benign or otherwise - is just another facet of predictable and depressing misogyny.

Why aren’t you bothered about how much harm this ideology does to girls and women?

Plenty of people get abused on public transport. Both sexes and all genders, and creeds, and types. Life is unpleasant nowadays at times.

If they’d stayed out of women’s spaces, no one would have given a shit.

The vast majority of users in MN do not give a jot how someone presents themselves.

Lots of boys with long hair, wears dresses, likes pink etc. Yes- I called those children boys.

Have they also started prepping for Christmas? If so, you might have a point.

I think mumsnet has played a part in changing the direction of the discourse around trans people/issues and that change in discourse has led to legislation as well as more openly hateful behaviour from the general public towards trans people, yes.
It's an academic debate that has got WAY out of hand IMO. I really feel for trans people, and trans women in particular at the moment.

Being anti trans activism isn’t being anti trans people in the same way that being anti current immigration policy doesn’t make you racist.

The extremists and activists have ruined things for the trans people who used to live normal lives where they didn’t want words like “chest feeding” and “people with a uterus” to piss off women.

Take out the word mumsnet and swap it with ‘standing up for women’s rights’. Same thing. FWS was a bunch of mumsnetters that had had enough.

If standing up for women’s rights has led to hate on trans people, that’s not the fault of the women standing up for their rights.

Guides including camping facilities, sport, NHS lying about men in women's wards, prisons, women not being given single sex rape support.

These are why there has been pushback.

The arguments are not about how people style themselves though, are they?

The arguments are all about trans identified male people insisting on access to spaces and services set aside for females.

That is the point of conflict. Not what they are wearing.

Regardless of the fact that female places were originally set up for the protection of female people from male aggression/voyeurism/assault etc.

Regardless of how the majority of ordinary women feel about allowing in any man in who claims to be a woman.

It’s a shame that some men are shits who will pick on another vulnerable male who is dressed “as a woman.”

But women’s spaces are not a refuge for females plus any male who says he wants to come in.

A male can be vulnerable but not harmless.