To get so stressed about my kids’ car behaviour

If the issue is on the way home, then consequences are fairly straightforward.

Shout 'Get back in your seat with the belt on now or you will go straight to bed when we get home.'
If they don't listen, when you get home to bed they go and stay there. Very firmly tell them 'You have behaved like a baby who cannot sit in a car seat by themselves and therefore you stay in bed like a baby does.'

Absolutely go loopy at them in every single way you know and super scary and horrible consequences.

Also get them both in ERF seats, as it is much harder for them to get out.
Or have the younger one in an ERF seat in the back and put the older one in the front seat if you get really desperate.

Google to find escape proof car seats for children - there are plenty around that are safe and legal.

This! My niece once unbuckled herself on the A1 and I also drove her to the police station. She was 3. She needed to understand how dangerous it is.

I've used the police officer line before. If you're ever at an event with police, ask them to have a friendly word.

Why is 3yo not in a buckle harness seat? That's harder to undo.

Rear face the 3yo and forward face the 5yo. Then it's harder to interact.

Remove TV and any treats.

Set up a treat day out and when they're dicks in the car, go home. Obviously this needs to be planned and you go through with the day out if they behave.

Reward chart for good car journeys with a decent reward after say 20 trips.

When my DD3 undid her seatbelt once, it was the only time I’ve actually properly lost it and shouted loud/ harshly. Not that I’m proud of it but she was so shocked by my reaction that she’s never done it again!

I feel you as mine have done similar, similar ages though mine are 7 and nearly 5. I don't have any sage advice. My youngest has the same carseat as you. When we took off the lap part and used the normal car seat belt with it, it caused absolute havoc. As soon as the car stopped or I was parking up he would unclip and be climbing all over the car. Or they would be absolutely battering the shite out of each other. So back to the lap belt thing he went and things have calmed down for now (though probably not for long). My oldest is slightly less feral than my youngest (by a very small margin) and has been told not to touch my youngests car seat and not to unclip him ever. If this stops working I will definitely be looking at some of those lock options. Whilst they probably arent safe, neither is the kids being unclipped (and mine have done it on the motorway too) and despite what other posters say, it's not always safe to just stop. So, solidarity!

I would refuse to take them out together other than absolutely essential trips for a week or two. If it means you are all stuck at home for a while over the school holidays, then so be it. You can tell them what is happening due to their dangerous behaviour. Hopefully they’ll grow out of the stage of being little shits soon.

This is a sensible suggestion

Your child huffed over sweeping the floor and you banned him from the beach for the afternoon? If he was doing the job you basically punished him on his holiday for a bit of chuntering with no chance to do better. Harsh.

OP I've had this issue. I would (try to) stay calm and pull over at he next safe place and tell them that's what I'm doing because it wasn't safe to drive. Then I would stay there until they were buckled in and quiet. Rinse and repeat.

Mine always went nuts in the car. Also hotel rooms. Any confined space basically, until a lot older than yours!

Not harsh. I asked her four times and the only response she gave was huffing and puffing, and the lament that she was the only children her class to be asked to do chores. She wasn't doing the job at that point. I make no apology for being harsh because I was harsh infrequently.

Giving them a smack on the bum and saying flying through the window will be 100 times more painful would do it but I dont think thats a popular suggestion 😂

Hope you have a tin hat. But you are right it would be effective.

You do know you will be accused of assault.

5.4.3.2.1.....

You absolutely can refuse to allow the car to move every single time the kids unbuckle. It is unlawful to drive with them unsecured.
I live rural and you need to start enforcing the law.
Stop.
Make sure car doors are locked.
Give the kids a count of three to be back in seats.
Buckle up and proceed OR
Phone local Police and wait for them.
Have their number ready - from when you all visited the Police Station to be told the law.

You are a danger to all if not in seat belts.
You need to stay home, go home until managed lawfully.

Fairly terrifying all the suggestions to just stop in the middle of a country road (hazards don’t make you less of an obstruction and can’t be seen round corners!!) or on the motorway hard shoulder which can be deadly. It’s far more likely you’d be rear ended while causing an obstruction like that than the chances of having an accident while driving sensibly with them unbuckled. Why would you see your children are unbuckled and make your car more likely to crash??

My DS had speech issues and got frustrated when I couldn’t understand him and threw shoes and water bottles at me while driving. A drive to the local police station where I dragged him up the stairs stopped that behaviour cold.

My DD tried it once and I wasn’t near a police station so a smack sorted that behaviour out instantly.

Dangerous behaviour must be stopped cold the first time and is something that cannot be allowed to continue as you experiment what works and what doesn’t.

I’d rather smack my child or scare them silly than have them sent through a windscreen.

Safety is the only time I shout.

DD was about 18 months - 2 years and discovered she could get out of the car seat. I pulled over, completely lost my shit and refused to move the car until she was fastened back in.

She never did it again, and to this day (she’s 18 now lol!) panics if she’s not fastened in and the car is moving.

Some things are more serious than getting to an appointment on time.

Unknown to me, my little girl when she was around 5 unbuckled herself whilst I was driving. Unfortunately I had to do an emergency stop as a car was coming too fast out of a junction, in doing so that’s when I found out she wasn’t secure as she promptly hit the back of the passenger seat and fell into the footwell. Words were said, we were both in shock but she never did it again. She luckily wasn’t hurt.

Im not a fan of screens, but the only thing that kept mine quiet and sitting nicely at that age was allowing them To watch something on a tablet each in the car with their own headphones. Was an absolute game changer and they lost complete interest in annoying each other or distracting us whilst we were driving. Pick your battles moment.

A smack beats death in a car accident, hands down.

Show the children videos of those crash test dummies. That's a clear visual of what happens

I wouldn’t let either of them in the front, however I’d consider if there are any local community police (PCSO) who could come and talk to them about car safety and that if they do it again they will take mummy away to prison?

I'm generally a pretty gentle parent, but I would absolutely roar at a 5 yo if they were undoing their younger siblings seatbelt in a moving car. 5 is old enough to know better. And yes consequences!! So going home immediately if something fun or yes, put them to bed! Angry face. Telling dad when he gets home. Dad also has a STERN talk with them. Enough that he will remember every time he thinks about doing it again!

Surely just invent a lovely trip somewhere? the zoo. Wherever. Then drive in a direction without winding country lanes. Then turn the car round and go home when your eldest DC unbuckles your youngest? Sit on your driveway. explain why you've come home. etc etc. Also sit down with your DC5 together with your husband & show him safety videos on the importance of seatbelts. ring your local police ststion and ask if you can bring the kids in (eldest only maybe) so they can explain why everyone needs to wear seatbelts. You cannot allow this behaviour to continue OP!

I would start back at the beginning for a little while.

Don't have them in the car. Take them for a walk instead. Show the dangers of being at the side of the road and how to keep safe. Whilst doing this, discuss how it's everyone's job to help each other stay safe and we must do this calmly. These are the rules for staying safe whilst walking. Get them to look out for buildings and trees, birds... whatever!

Do this a few times.

The same then applies to the car. It's everyone's responsibility to help you do safe driving. What are the rules? Can they find a blue car, a red car, a truck or tractor?

Discuss a consequence to the behaviour.

If they do unbuckle or break an important safety rule pull over. As soon as you can. "Seat belt on please.".. thank them...then drive off (you may need to actually belt them up).

When you get home, the consequence is communicated along with an explanation.

I hope it helps.

Turn around and go home. The second they start, turn around and go home and if it carries on on the way home then so be it. The next weekend you refuse to take them out because of their behaviour.

The only lie there was that you threaten a visit to the police station that you knew wasn’t going to happen but all the rest is spot on. Good call.

So you just carry on driving with a 5 and a 3 year old unbuckled and moving around the car?! You absolutely must pull over and rebuckle.